In-depth inspection Gibson "LeGrand"

**gitman** · 03-08-2022, 06:17 PM

This is indeed interesting to watch since the guy also goes INTO the guitar with an endoscopic camera - quite revealing .... and I'll say no more.

Video! 1994 Gibson LeGrand Dark Wineburst | The Trogly's | Reverb

**deacon Mark** · 03-08-2022, 07:44 PM

Interesting would be the word. Nothing to me revealing would be curious what was revealing to you gitman? I have to say his rock chops put my to shame but clearly he realizes that the jazz guitar does not help him play any jazz. Fantastic guitar but over priced at 10K. Maybe along the lines of 7200 to 8000K. I did note a nice acoustic sound though.

**6v6ster** · 03-08-2022, 09:13 PM

That video is kind of funny. He really doesn’t know much about archtops clearly and his playing rock on it really shows what a different kind of guitar they are.
that guy just hoards guitars for the sake of having. I’m not super into that philosophy personally.

**EllenGtrGrl** · 03-08-2022, 10:23 PM

Nah, I really I'm not a Troglydite (what he calls his YouTube followers), his channel gives me the blahs. I get the impression, that Trogly is basically more of a guitar collector, and guitar flipper, than a player (when he does play [not that often IMO], his playing technique makes me cringe), who usually sticks to variations of the the classic Gibson and Fender solidbody designs (he especially seems to have a love affair with Gibson Les Paul models). I saw the video post for the Le Grande on YouTube, and told myself, "nope", he'll probably get things wrong with regards to that guitar."

**gitman** · 03-09-2022, 06:58 AM

Originally Posted by deacon Mark

Interesting would be the word. Nothing to me revealing would be curious what was revealing to you gitman? I have to say his rock chops put my to shame but clearly he realizes that the jazz guitar does not help him play any jazz. Fantastic guitar but over priced at 10K. Maybe along the lines of 7200 to 8000K. I did note a nice acoustic sound though.

Looking at the insides of this very expensive guitar was a surprise to me : the sloppy glue-work and the strip of spruce on the centerline of the top plate makes it even harder to accept the price point at which these guitars are usually offered - this one is advertised at just under 10 grand ....
The acoustic tone is NOTHING to remember (ok, flatwound strings did not help) and the very dark and almost opaque finish makes this even more un-attractive. The fact that the guy knows nothing about this type of instrument (how to handle it) and didn't take the time to learn a few things about it PRIOR to shooting this video also tells me something.

**Jabberwocky** · 03-09-2022, 07:02 AM

Guy bought it from Archtop.com who had listed it on Reverb for $6995 and sold it for lower than that. 1994 Gibson LeGrand: Rare Dark Wineburst Finish, Johnny Smith | Reverb .

What chutzpah to turn it around and ask for 50% more than Joe Vinikow did who is certainly not a beginner at pricing archtop guitars.

But kudos to him for being at least honest about the defects that Joe V glossed over.

**EllenGtrGrl** · 03-09-2022, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by Jabberwocky

Guy bought it from Archtop.com who had listed it on Reverb for $6995 and sold it for lower than that. 1994 Gibson LeGrand: Rare Dark Wineburst Finish, Johnny Smith | Reverb .

What chutzpah to turn it around and ask for 50% more than Joe Vinikow who is no beginner at pricing archtop guitars.

Yeah, but the way Trogly hypes most guitars he shows on his YouTube channel, as being "rare" or "unique", and therefore valuable in some way, I'm not surprised he'd do that (for instance: c'mon a Guitar Center "Limited Edition" Les Paul in a non-standard [for the model year] finish is valuable? there are a lot of Guitar Center Limited Edition Les Pauls, and they aren't worth much more than your typical Les Paul - I oughta know, I had one [a 2010 Les Paul Special]). I bet you that more than a few of the followers of his YouTube channel, are the buyers of his guitars.

**Woody Sound** · 03-09-2022, 08:20 AM

I think the wood saddle is not original.

**Woody Sound** · 03-09-2022, 08:42 AM

"An acoustic on steroids."

**TedBPhx** · 03-09-2022, 01:00 PM

I quit watching when he tried to play it. Anybody else use a black light to inspect finishes? I didn’t understand what he was saying about that scratch/crack.

**Woody Sound** · 03-09-2022, 02:34 PM

"The finger tailpiece is for fine tuning, like the TP-6."

**Hammertone** · 03-09-2022, 02:35 PM

I was entertained by how he installed the wood bridge onto the guitar backward and by his ignorance about guitars like this, the history of Gibson, and the place of guitars like this within that history. I find his shameless entrepreneurial spirit, lack of jazz skill, and willingness to put his lack of knowledge on the record to be refreshing - no reason to stop him from cranking out another video review, admitting that he doesn't really know what he's talking about, and asking for plenty of money.

Gibson's use of the spruce center strip on the underside of the top is quite interesting - I was unaware of this design feature, given that Gibson did not use this kind of strip on their other carved archtop guitars, AFAIK. Heritage has done this since day one on top and back plates, as has Mark Campellone and (probably) a few other builders. Perhaps some of our members who own newer Legrands, Citations, L-5P, L-5CES, L-5WES and S-400 guitars could peek inside and let us know if this feature is found on any of these models as well, along with the ages of these guitars?

**Woody Sound** · 03-09-2022, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

I was entertained by how he put the wood bridge back onto the guitar backward

Haha, I didn't catch that!

**Cunamara** · 03-09-2022, 02:41 PM

Must've been a Friday afternoon guitar, judging by the sloppy gluing. It would've only taken a few seconds to clean that up.

**bluejaybill** · 03-09-2022, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by TedBPhx

I quit watching when he tried to play it. Anybody else use a black light to inspect finishes? I didn’t understand what he was saying about that scratch/crack.

Using a black light on a vintage guitar to determine if the finish has been touched up is very common, though it's not 100% foolproof.

**Dennis D** · 03-09-2022, 06:50 PM

Originally Posted by bluejaybill

Using a black light on a vintage guitar to determine if the finish has been touched up is very common, though it's not 100% foolproof.

GC also did that to my '50's L-7 when they were having their 'great guitar purchase extravaganza' a few years ago.
I was supposed to be impressed. : )

Then they called 'all the way out to California ', to confirm their offer with their expert.
I mean, who wouldn't be impressed by' an expert from California'...

(( Strike Two ))

Then after about twenty minutes of hanging around enduring that excessively loud crap music, I got their offer and bottom line should've stayed home.....
" And yer out. "

**Bluedawg** · 03-10-2022, 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by Woody Sound

I think the wood saddle is not original.

Pretty sure you are correct. That bridge looks like something out of a Stew Mac catalog.

My '93 Le Grand came with the metal "ABR" bridge.

I visited Jim Trigg's shop in Nashville in '94 and he made me an ebony bridge for mine which I still use. I think it really helps get a better tone out of the Le Grand.

**Hammertone** · 03-10-2022, 04:29 AM

Originally Posted by Bluedawg

... My '93 Le Grand ...

Oooooh, can you get a little mirror in there an grab a picture of the underside of the top?

**Jabberwocky** · 03-11-2022, 08:49 PM

I own a 2012 LeGrand Antique Sunburst that I bought from Meestursparkle from Japan. Sorry, I am not going to stick a probe under its top. Some things are better left unseen. It sounds and plays well as it is. Listening to that heehaw Midwestern accent slows down the speed of thought. Guess I am a bigot against Midwestern milquetoasts.

**RJVB** · 03-12-2022, 07:44 AM

I seem to recall a video of a vintage L5 (or similar) being played by Phil X. Guy has a couple of neurones cross-wired if you ask me, but I find it interesting to hear how these guitars sound under very different playing styles. I won't go so far as to say they all sound the same if you play them properly as jazz guitars (apparently) should but there is a bit of that O:^)

(I didn't bother to listen to the subject video... wasn't going to interrupt Anthony Wilson's "Seasons" for some

)

**Gabor** · 03-12-2022, 11:18 AM

I started to watch the video, and after a few sec I noticed that I had already downvoted it... no recollection when. Anyway, this spared me a few minutes now :-)

**Doctor Jeff** · 03-16-2022, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by Dennis D

GC also did that to my '50's L-7 when they were having their 'great guitar purchase extravaganza' a few years ago.
I was supposed to be impressed. : )

Then they called 'all the way out to California ', to confirm their offer with their expert.
I mean, who wouldn't be impressed by' an expert from California'...

(( Strike Two ))

Then after about twenty minutes of hanging around enduring that excessively loud crap music, I got their offer and bottom line should've stayed home.....
" And yer out. "

Did they get a second opinion from the pro from Dover?

**Archie** · 03-16-2022, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

I was entertained by how he installed the wood bridge onto the guitar backward and by his ignorance about guitars like this, the history of Gibson, and the place of guitars like this within that history. I find his shameless entrepreneurial spirit, lack of jazz skill, and willingness to put his lack of knowledge on the record to be refreshing - no reason to stop him from cranking out another video review, admitting that he doesn't really know what he's talking about, and asking for plenty of money.

Gibson's use of the spruce center strip on the underside of the top is quite interesting - I was unaware of this design feature, given that Gibson did not use this kind of strip on their other carved archtop guitars, AFAIK. Heritage has done this since day one on top and back plates, as has Mark Campellone and (probably) a few other builders. Perhaps some of our members who own newer Legrands, Citations, L-5P, L-5CES, L-5WES and S-400 guitars could peek inside and let us know if this feature is found on any of these models as well, along with the ages of these guitars?

He's an interesting character. I've watched his show on and off one the last year or two. He mostly does Gibson Les Pauls but I guess he's trying to branch out.
Admittedly his non Les Paul videos are shockingly misinformed but that's not really an issue I guess. He's having fun and people in the chat will always put corrections in the comments.

I was annoyed at the Legrand video, purely because I bought an inspection camera about 6 months ago, to do exactly the same thing. Now when I do it I'm going to get accused of copying him tut!

What I can't quite understand is his business model. He seems to pay top money for guitars, review them and then put them up for sale on his website. The added value being that he's selected them?
He doesn't seem to mind guitars that arrive in worse condition than advertised but he's also upfront about the issues, as he shows them in the review.
He never checks the truss rod though; I wonder if he ever has?
In terms of content his videos are very good and very well thought out because he can bash one out a day, sometimes two and he adequately covers the topics and segments. I'm trying to start my Youtube channel and what he does looks cheap and cheerful but it's really well thought out.

I like him, aside from his naivety on certain guitars. He knows a damn site more about Les Pauls that I do and his channel is very active. In a cut throat world of Les Paul burst tops (or whatever they're called), he buys and sells a lot and his channel is one of the biggest on YouTube.

**floatingpickup** · 03-16-2022, 06:06 PM

I also actually enjoyed the video. He is obviously not at all familiar with archtops, but he admitted that a number of times in the video. It was quite interesting to see the inside of the guitar. He played it like it was a flat top, but he made it quite clear that he wasn’t a jazz guitarist. At least, he recognized the beauty and the skill that goes into building a fine archtop.
Keith