High Dispersion Loudspeakers

**pingu** · 02-20-2022, 11:31 AM

Hi all,
I’d be interested in hearing everyone’s
experiences with high dispersion
loudspeaker systems on the gig

upfiring or downfiring speakers
line arrays (bose L1 etc)
acoustic lenses
etc etc

and wether they help everyone in the band
and audience hear you evenly (or not)

**nevershouldhavesoldit** · 02-20-2022, 11:48 AM

I rarely point my speaker forward. I usually point it backwards a few inches in front of a wall behind or alongside the stage / playing area. As I’ve said before, I screwed chair legs into the baffle on one cabinet and played with it pointing at the floor.

I carry a door stop in my amp / speaker bags and wedge the back of my Little Jazz and speaker cabs (RE 10 & RevSound 8) so they’re angled forward to use the floor as a reflector if there’s no wall nearby. I once put a set of tilt legs on a Vibrolux backwards, so the amp tilted forward and bounced sound upward and forward off the floor. All of these help both band and audience hear the guitar better at lower volumes, especially if the speaker is placed at the rear of the stage.

**SierraTango** · 02-20-2022, 01:46 PM

I posted this a while back. Since then I've used the EV Evolve 30m several gigs and I've very happy with it. We've had complements on our sound from other musicians, and it is SO easy to set up and pack up.

We got a call from one of our regular venues to cover a gig, the entertainment cancelled due to illness. Short notice, but I took it. At first I hesitated to go with the new EV system, but then thought I had just invested in it and why not? I can put my old rig in the truck and if it's a disaster, swap it out on break. It's a outdoor venue (weather has been nice-75 degrees daytime cooling to 60 or so in the evening), usually draws about 150 people.

Since I was most concerned about the guitar sound, and one of the reasons I got the rig, question was could I get by without the Evans JE 200, plug straight into the EV and be happy? Before the gig I set up the Evans and the EV then connected through a A-B switch. This way I could try to get the EV system to sound as close to what I was used to hearing from the Evans using the Bluetooth control. I got pretty close. Wasn't to worried about the vocal and horn microphones.

The first set was a adjustment for me, as the EV array was set up between the horn player and me. I have been used to having the Evans on my left side, so now all the sound is coming from my right. Took a few songs to get used to it, but no problem. Of course I asked around the audience and everyone stated we sounded great! My girl too took some short videos and confirmed the mix was very good. The old system stayed in the truck. And SO easy to pack up!

So short answer to myself-yes it was worth the investment, and I think performers in my situation or similar would benefit from at least trying this type of rig out.

**Gitterbug** · 02-20-2022, 02:11 PM

I can only speak of my experience with upward-firing speakers starting in 2014.

Guitar: Yes if the setting is reasonably intimate and there's a reflecting ceiling max. 10'-12' above. In open air, the sound gets lost or the player, hearing him/herself so well, won't dial in enough volume.

Bass: Yes, with less qualifications. Toob/Metro bassists (mainly jazz on upright bass) seem to prefer the upright position.

My first Toob prototype from 2007 actually has a tail end with a passive radiator for the speaker's back waves (made from a kitchen funnel). There were so many other novelties that I can't say which ones worked and which didn't. Anyway, the result (and numerous subsequent takes) was far too complex to be pursued.

To be honest, I only became aware of the Sonusphere designs a couple of days ago. Kudos! The question is, do you get enough SPL where you need it (the audience, after all) or are you losing too many watts to secondary directions. My answer above is yes, but not in all conditions.

**EastwoodMike** · 02-20-2022, 04:31 PM

Quilter had this block dock offering going for a while:

Frontliner 2x8w Quilter Labs

not sure if it about to be discontinued for economic reasons.

EM

**citizenk74** · 02-20-2022, 08:02 PM

Used a pair of Bose 802s, and later 808s for years for monitor-less vocals in the smaller rooms we played. Later added my guitar signal (Rockmodule) to go amp-less, with the bass player going ampless (Bass Rockman) through the PA. Later we did a bass/guitar/vocalist(s)/drum machine with just the Bose and a powered board. Dispersion is a wonderful thing!

**_bix_** · 02-20-2022, 11:20 PM

I am a big believer in a tower to disperse sound horizontally. When I see side-by-side 2x12 combos, I want to tip them on their side.

**Herbie** · 02-21-2022, 12:58 PM

Apparently it depends very much on the size and the style of the ensemble. Is the band big, is the music loud, does the venue have pa etc etc.

In my experience (gigging mostly clubs since 1982) sometimes wide dispersion would be a good thing in rehearsals, but on a gig – or in studio – it would cause only leaking to other mikes on the stage.

The stages are different too. Some are made very solid but specially outdoor stages are often kinda 'hollow' so You are in trouble with the boominess if You even have Your amp on the floor. It must be lifted and because there is not always a chair available, I have a amp stand with me. It tilts the amp toward my ears so I hear what I play without disturbing other players or the sound guy with the leakages.

I have seen some guitarists playing gigs with amps turned away from them, but I have heard about the phase errors in multi-mike situations and have not a need to try it.

**pingu** · 02-21-2022, 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by _bix_

I am a big believer in a tower to disperse sound horizontally. When I see side-by-side 2x12 combos, I want to tip them on their side.

yes that’s correct ....
a vertical column
(or line-array)
increases dispersion in the horizontal plane (with reduced dispersion in the vertical)

the current Bose and EV etc etc
wide horizontal dispersion line-array systems seem to be
gaining in popularity ....

**Gitterbug** · 02-21-2022, 01:58 PM

Here's what I made for the British blues guitarist Joe Nethercoat of two Metro 6.5BGs, per his wishes and specs. Objective: max. dispersion. Not elegant, I admit, and photo taken before cleaning. Assembles/disassembles in a jiffy. Apparently works, too. Weighs a tad over 10 lbs., takes 260W. Powered by a 200W DV Mark head.

**BigDaddyLoveHandles** · 02-21-2022, 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by Gitterbug

Here's what I made for the British blues guitarist Joe Nethercoat of two Metro 6.5BGs, per his wishes and specs. Objective: max. dispersion. Not elegant, I admit, and photo taken before cleaning. Assembles/disassembles in a jiffy. Apparently works, too. Weighs a tad over 10 lbs., takes 260W. Powered by a 200W DV Mark head.

Is that how baby Metros are made?

**nevershouldhavesoldit** · 02-21-2022, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by Herbie

I have seen some guitarists playing gigs with amps turned away from them, but I have heard about the phase errors in multi-mike situations and have not a need to try it.

I always mic or ask the sound guy to mic my amp by dropping it from the handle or using a low stand between the front and the wall. With closed cabs, there’s no phase problem at all. With open backs, the bleed is far below the level of the direct feed. And unless it’s consistently and perfectly 180 degrees out, it’s just another reflected sound that adds depth and dimension.

If phase shifts from reflected and diffused signals were a significant problem, it would be worst from ported cabs and other designs in which the signal from the port / vent is out of phase with direct sound from the speaker cone.