Jazz guitar with wider string spacing

[Humbuckr]

Hi all

I recently sold a rather lovely Comins GCS-16-1 as I couldn't get past the tight string spacing, particularly at the bridge. Spacing there was around 51mm (maybe towards 52mm max). The nut width was pretty tight too, similar to my strat at around 42mm.

In contrast, my Martin 000-28EC has a 57mm bridge spacing and my Stratocaster with its vintage tremolo bridge is 55mm.

There was no trouble playing the Comins with a plectrum, but for fingerstyle (especially with 13 gauge strings) it was just too cramped for my large fingers. A great shame as it sounded fantastic.

I know Eastman have 1 3/4 nuts but Im not sure the bridge spacing is that wide. Does anyone know of commercially available, production level instruments with wider spacing, especially at the bridge, for fingerstyle? Could be archtop or semi-hollow.

Thanks in advance.

[jazzmanstever]

You can always re-slot your existing bridge for a wider spacing, or replace it entirely with another bridge to accommodate wider spacing. If it's a bridge with individual saddles you can possibly replace just the saddles and re-slot them for a wider spacing. I've done that several times with various guitars over the years. It's not always easy to find tunomatic type bridges that don't come pre-slotted though but they do exist. Similarly with wooden bridges you can either re-slot them or just replace it entirely.
Sometimes there can be an issue with the strings aligning over the pickup pole-pieces but in my experience it hasn't been a deal-breaker.

[Jim Soloway]

When we were building guitars we offered a finger-style spacing. It was 1 13/16 at the nut and 2 3/16 at the bridge. Coincidentally, someone posted an FYI on the for sale forum on this site for one of them being sold on the used market right now. I have nothing to do with the sale so please don't think of this as spam.

EDIT: Sorry, both the post and the Reverb listing appear to be gone. Perhaps it sold.

[Humbuckr]

You can always re-slot your existing bridge for a wider spacing, or replace it entirely with another bridge to accommodate wider spacing. If it's a bridge with individual saddles you can possibly replace just the saddles and re-slot them for a wider spacing. I've done that several times with various guitars over the years. It's not always easy to find tunomatic type bridges that don't come pre-slotted though but they do exist. Similarly with wooden bridges you can either re-slot them or just replace it entirely.
Sometimes there can be an issue with the strings aligning over the pickup pole-pieces but in my experience it hasn't been a deal-breaker.

On the Comins the neck is quite slim (its more like a solid body electric neck in geometry I reckon) so the strings would've been a bit too close to the fretboard edges.

[Caboverde]

Hi all

I recently sold a rather lovely Comins GCS-16-1 as I couldn't get past the tight string spacing, particularly at the bridge. Spacing there was around 51mm (maybe towards 52mm max). The nut width was pretty tight too, similar to my strat at around 42mm.

In contrast, my Martin 000-28EC has a 57mm bridge spacing and my Stratocaster with its vintage tremolo bridge is 55mm.

There was no trouble playing the Comins with a plectrum, but for fingerstyle (especially with 13 gauge strings) it was just too cramped for my large fingers. A great shame as it sounded fantastic.

I know Eastman have 1 3/4 nuts but Im not sure the bridge spacing is that wide. Does anyone know of commercially available, production level instruments with wider spacing, especially at the bridge, for fingerstyle? Could be archtop or semi-hollow.

Thanks in advance.

As a classical guitarist who has been wanting an electric of any kind with a wider-than-usual string spacing, I sympathize. Since you mentioned Eastman, perhaps consider commissioning something from Yolanda Team? There is a Mr. Wu archtop with 47mm width nut on Reverb (been eyeing that one for a while): Mr Wu Custom Jazz Guitar, Yunzi/Eastman | vintageguitardan | Reverb

[Humbuckr]

As a classical guitarist who has been wanting an electric of any kind with a wider-than-usual string spacing, I sympathize. Since you mentioned Eastman, perhaps consider commissioning something from Yolanda Team? There is a Mr. Wu archtop with 47mm width nut on Reverb (been eyeing that one for a while): Mr Wu Custom Jazz Guitar, Yunzi/Eastman | vintageguitardan | Reverb

Thanks, I should say Im in the UK, which is partly why I specified production line. The Eastman 1 3/4 nut (as with my Martin acoustic) is fine. Its the bridge spacing that's the issue really. Ive played arcbtops from Ibanez, Eastman and Comins and all have relatively narrow bridge spacing, with my Stratocaster noticeably easier to fingerpick on. Maybe I should just give in and accept that I play jazz on a strat!

[marcwhy]

When we were building guitars we offered a finger-style spacing. It was 1 13/16 at the nut and 2 3/16 at the bridge. Coincidentally, someone posted an FYI on the for sale forum on this site for one of them being sold on the used market right now. I have nothing to do with the sale so please don't think of this as spam.

EDIT: Sorry, both the post and the Reverb listing appear to be gone. Perhaps it sold.

Yep, it sold! Hopefully someone here got it!

[Jim Soloway]

Yep, it sold! Hopefully someone here got it!

I'm working with someone in NC on a possible revival of the Soloway brand and it's starting to look look like it might really happen. We're working on a 14" version of the Single 15 body shape but with a full 2" depth. Unfortunately, even if it does really happen a fingerstyle option probably wouldn't happen for quite a while.

[marcwhy]

I'm working with someone in NC on a possible revival of the Soloway brand and it's starting to look look like it might really happen. We're working on a 14" version of the Single 15 body shape but with a full 2" depth. Unfortunately, even if it does really happen a fingerstyle option probably wouldn't happen for quite a while.

Wow, that's exciting news!! Please keep us informed!

[iim7V7IM7]

In many cases, the standard 50 mm humbucker pole piece spacing drives the neck taper and string spacing on factory electric guitars regardless of the 1-11/16” or 1-3/4” nut width. My archtop with wider string spacing uses humbuckers with bar pole pieces to allow for a 1-3/4” (44.5 mm) to 2-3/16” (55.6 mm) bridge spacing.

[Jim Soloway]

In many cases, the standard 50 mm humbucker pole piece spacing drives the neck taper and string spacing on factory electric guitars regardless of the 1-11/16” or 1-3/4” nut width. My archtop with wider string spacing uses humbuckers with bar pole pieces to allow for a 1-3/4” (44.5 mm) to 2-3/16” (55.6 mm) bridge spacing.

That's usually more of an issue for bridge pickups than neck pickups and F-spaced humbuckers will handle many of those situations.

[iim7V7IM7]

That's usually more of an issue for bridge pickups than neck pickups and F-spaced humbuckers will handle many of those situations.

Absolutely Jim, they are 52-53 mm if there is one that the player likes.

[caue amaral]

Strange...I've always found the spacing of the comins, as well as the benedetto and eastmans, to be the widest among the most popular jazz guitars. My comins gcs1 has a much larger spacing than the standard gibson for example..
and it's the same arm of the gcs16-1...
besides being quite robust, not thin.

[charleyrich99]

What should I specify my string spacing at the bridge to be on a newly commissioned archtop to accommodate finger style playing?

The pick up will be a Kent Armstrong 12 pole (USA) floater. The guitar will only have a single pickup.

Should it be the same as my Martin HD 28? Or will that not be optimal on an archtop?

I play mostly with hybrid picking. But I also play just with a pick.

Thanks

[tbeltrans]

Much of my guitar playing had been fingerstyle on acoustic (flat top) guitars. I prefer a wider string spacing, with my favorite being my Huss & Dalton 12 fret 00 with its 1 7/8" nut (built before they went to their current 1 3/4" nut) and 2 5/16" saddle string spacing. This guitar is (to me) essentially a steel string version of a classical guitar.

However, in recent years, my focus has been solely on solo chord melody. For that, I find that a narrower string spacing of an archtop to be better because I am often fretting two adjacent strings with the same finger.

For me, 1 23/32" nut seems a good compromise between 1 11/16" and 1 3/4". So my point is to carefully consider what you intend to play. On my archtop, I still play fingerstyle, but my chording needs are distinctly different from what I would do on an acoustic playing fingerstyle. I haven't measured the saddle spacing on my archtop, but it seems to be typical for an archtop.

Note again, though my archtop is essentially acoustic with a small floating pickup, when I refer to "acoustic" in this post I am referring to a flat top acoustic.

Tony

[charleyrich99]

Much of my guitar playing had been fingerstyle on acoustic (flat top) guitars. I prefer a wider string spacing, with my favorite being my Huss & Dalton 12 fret 00 with its 1 7/8" nut (built before they went to their current 1 3/4" nut) and 2 5/16" saddle string spacing. This guitar is (to me) essentially a steel string version of a classical guitar.

However, in recent years, my focus has been solely on solo chord melody. For that, I find that a narrower string spacing of an archtop to be better because I am often fretting two adjacent strings with the same finger.

For me, 1 23/32" nut seems a good compromise between 1 11/16" and 1 3/4". So my point is to carefully consider what you intend to play. On my archtop, I still play fingerstyle, but my chording needs are distinctly different from what I would do on an acoustic playing fingerstyle. I haven't measured the saddle spacing on my archtop, but it seems to be typical for an archtop.

Note again, though my archtop is essentially acoustic with a small floating pickup, when I refer to "acoustic" in this post I am referring to a flat top acoustic.

Tony

By fingerstyle, I mean Joe Pass and not Chet Atkins or Tommy E.

The normal 1 11/16 nut size works fine for my small hands when playing chord melodies on an archtop. However, the spacing by the bridge is a bit cramped for me when I play chord melodies. I was looking for guidance on slightly wider spacing at the bridge on an archtop.

And on a side note, boy do I love your Citation. So jealous ;-)

[tbeltrans]

By fingerstyle, I mean Joe Pass and not Chet Atkins or Tommy E.

The normal 1 11/16 nut size works fine for my small hands when playing chord melodies on an archtop. However, the spacing by the bridge is a bit cramped for me when I play chord melodies. I was looking for guidance on slightly wider spacing at the bridge on an archtop.

And on a side note, boy do I love your Citation. So jealous ;-)

I am not sure why, but the typical spacing at the bridge doesn't bother me at all for playing fingerstyle. To me it was interesting to look up the specs for the typical guitars played by Chet Atkins and Tommy Emmanuel. Chet often played his Gretsch Country Gentleman or something very similar and that has a bit narrower than 1 11/16" nut and typical narrower string spacing at the saddle. Tommy Emmanuel's Maton has a 1.73" nut (not quite 1 3/4") and 2.16" saddle string spacing. So both players have what we might consider today rather narrow string spacing for fingerpickers.

As for Joe Pass, when I saw him play, he usually had an Ibanez archtop, though I don't know the model. The string spacing seemed typical for an archtop, so I would guess that to be a 1 11/16" nut and typical saddle string spacing. He would switch between pick and fingers. When using his fingers, he would stick the pick in his mouth, so I don't recall him using hybrid picking technique (i.e. pick between thumb and index finger and the other 3 fingers playing fingerstyle).

Tony

[Humbuckr]

I am not sure why, but the typical spacing at the bridge doesn't bother me at all for playing fingerstyle. To me it was interesting to look up the specs for the typical guitars played by Chet Atkins and Tommy Emmanuel. Chet often played his Gretsch Country Gentleman or something very similar and that has a bit narrower than 1 11/16" nut and typical narrower string spacing at the saddle. Tommy Emmanuel's Maton has a 1.73" nut (not quite 1 3/4") and 2.16" saddle string spacing. So both players have what we might consider today rather narrow string spacing for fingerpickers.

As for Joe Pass, when I saw him play, he usually had an Ibanez archtop, though I don't know the model. The string spacing seemed typical for an archtop, so I would guess that to be a 1 11/16" nut and typical saddle string spacing. He would switch between pick and fingers. When using his fingers, he would stick the pick in his mouth, so I don't recall him using hybrid picking technique (i.e. pick between thumb and index finger and the other 3 fingers playing fingerstyle).

Tony

Tommy’s Maton is 55.35mm at the bridge, so marginally more than 2.16” but I was surprised it was narrower than expected too. By contrast the Martin 00028 Eric Clapton signature acoustic is 57mm at the bridge, but I think thats a bit too wide for typical jazz playing. It suits his acoustic blues style. My Comins GCS-16 archtop is 53mm. I guess if I was having an archtop custom built then 53-55.5mm territory would be ideal.

You've got to consider nut width too though, as a mismatch can bring the strings a bit too close to the fretboard edges, as can happen with vintage spec strats with the wider spaced tremolo bridges coupled with a 42mm (or less in some cases) nut.

[Saxophone Tall]

Hi all

I recently sold a rather lovely Comins GCS-16-1 as I couldn't get past the tight string spacing, particularly at the bridge. Spacing there was around 51mm (maybe towards 52mm max). The nut width was pretty tight too, similar to my strat at around 42mm.

In contrast, my Martin 000-28EC has a 57mm bridge spacing and my Stratocaster with its vintage tremolo bridge is 55mm.

There was no trouble playing the Comins with a plectrum, but for fingerstyle (especially with 13 gauge strings) it was just too cramped for my large fingers. A great shame as it sounded fantastic.

I know Eastman have 1 3/4 nuts but Im not sure the bridge spacing is that wide. Does anyone know of commercially available, production level instruments with wider spacing, especially at the bridge, for fingerstyle? Could be archtop or semi-hollow.

Thanks in advance.

I'm in the process of having a 7 string archtop converted for me by a luthier to a 6 string. Wide nut, wide string spacing. I have really huge hands and really long fingers (C to A on piano!)

I need to be able to push my fingers easily between the strings on the right hand and not unintentionally mute strings with my left. Hopefully this will do the trick.

Hope this helps!

[RJVB]

You can always re-slot your existing bridge for a wider spacing, or replace it entirely with another bridge to accommodate wider spacing.

Within the limits defined by the fretboard! The higher up you go, the further the E strings should be from the edge (ideally), not closer. (Because it becomes easier to pull/push them over the edge the higher you go.)

[RJVB]

I'm in the process of having a 7 string archtop converted for me by a luthier to a 6 string. Wide nut, wide string spacing. I have really huge hands and really long fingers (C to A on piano!)

What did the luthier say about the top thickness and/or bracing? Aren't those thicker/heavier on a 7-string than on a 6-string?

[Saxophone Tall]

What did the luthier say about the top thickness and/or bracing? Aren't those thicker/heavier on a 7-string than on a 6-string?

To be clear, the guitar is an Eastman Jazz Elite 7 string, not a luthier-created instrument. We didn't discuss top thickness / bracing. I was not aware that they are different than on a 6 string. If so, it's a trade-off / compromise I'll have to accept. The only alternatives are Lora / Wu (which is a "maybe" anyway, since their website lists 2" nut guitars but not 62-3 mm string spacing (at RH) ones, much less than that, like 57 mm max if I recall correctly OR a $10,000 luthier-created instrument, which is out of the question for me.

[RJVB]

I was not aware that they are different than on a 6 string.

I don't know either. I know it's something to factor in if you want to convert a 12-string to a wider-spacing 6-string, but maybe 1 additional string doesn't require structural differences that affect the sound if you remove that 7th string. I suppose that's something one could notice when playing with the 7 strings on...
(I also have no idea what that Eastman is capable of, acoustically.)

The only alternatives are Lora / Wu (which is a "maybe" anyway, since their website lists 2" nut guitars but not 62-3 mm string spacing (at RH) ones, much less than that, like 57 mm max if I recall correctly

FWIW, that's a 5mm difference, which means the strings will be 1mm closer to each other. The strings on my nylon-string reso are much closer together than that. It's taken me a while but I can now play that instrument without (or almost) unwanted RH damping or buzzing, using a bit of a hybrid classical technique.

Wu should be able to make you a 62-3mm-at-the-saddle guitar. The difference with his usual models should be small enough to obtain it with just a wider ("overhanging") fretboard rather than obliging him to carve a very different neck. Ask you luthier next time you see him; mine has confirmed that he has already widened the fretboard on guitars before. You can also calculate (or sketch) for yourself how much wider the end of the fretboard has to be to go from 57 to 63 mm at the saddle.

EDIT: I've been wondering lately about fretboard (or rather, saddle) radius and fingerpicking. I'm not at all convinced that the usual radius is irrelevant for finger picking. Using free strokes it puts the next lower string in the "after-stroke" path of your fingertip for the treble side of the saddle, and the next highter string in the downward part of your stroke on the bass side of the saddle. This, rather than LH considerations, could be the reason why classical guitars typically do not have a radiused fretboard.

[Hammertone]

Did you ever have to make up your mind?
Pick up on one and leave the other one behind
It's not often easy, and not often kind
Did you ever have to make up your mind?

Problem solved:

[Ryan G]

I'm in the process of having a 7 string archtop converted for me by a luthier to a 6 string. Wide nut, wide string spacing. I have really huge hands and really long fingers (C to A on piano!)

I need to be able to push my fingers easily between the strings on the right hand and not unintentionally mute strings with my left. Hopefully this will do the trick.

Hope this helps!

Hi,

I recently received my new 7 string archtop and the string spacing is too narrow. I was thinking of converting it to a 6 string. How did it work out for you?