-
My buddy lives in a very dry NYC apartment, and owns an early 60s thinline ES-125. He's rightly concerned about keeping the guitar healthy, not sure if the solutions for larger sound hole acoustics would work with an f-hole thinline instrument. He's afraid of damaging the wood.
Have any of you had experience humidifying such guitars? Thanks.
-
12-11-2020 09:10 AM
-
It's the variation in humidity that seems to do the damage. Fluctuations from 20% to 80% humidity cause expansion and contraction. Add temperature shifts and it can be compounded. However, the ES-125, aside from it's neck joint design, is a durable instrument compared to a non-laminate.
Originally Posted by mad dog
I have met some who put a humidifier in a case but then open the case and play the instrument in a dry environment for a long period of time. That does stress the instrument a wee bit. OTOH, the instruments are meant to be played.
-
Humidify the case is the way to go. Many systems available. I’ll take a pic of two (one commercial, one extremely effective and clean home-brew system) this evening when I get back.
I would absolutely not drop anything inside the guitar. It is not that a “Damp-it” (or however it is spelled) does not work OK-ish. It is that every now and then one can get a puddle inside the guitar.
Many use such internal systems with absolutely no trouble, but humdifying the case works extremely well and has notably less risk.
The best is of course to humidify them room/apartment/house. But that is not always practical.
-
Agreed that fluctuations are worse than the actual moisture content of the wood. (And absolutely +++ agreed that temperature fluctuations are every bit as big an issue - and far more able to happen over a short period of time.)
Back to humidity:
If you use tuning shifts and neck relief changes as a reasonable sign that the moisture content has changed, then a couple of hours out of the humidified case seems to have limited impact.
Over a day or two, you can definitely note the changes.
-
Here are pics of a mid 1970s laminate Gibson archtop that was gigged a lot in Pennsylvania. Temperature and humidity swings were unavoidable. The guitar survived well and is a gem. Some exposure effects are visible though. It's been refretted and has a new pickguard but plays like new.
These pics show lacquer checking on the top with dirt and oxidation in the checks. It looks like the wood might be cracked, but it isn't. The bracing is unscathed. The neck is perfectly straight.
Here are the effects of necessary exposure in a working guitar over a more than 40 year period in a highly variable climate. The instrument held up very well. It should last another 40 or more.
-
How about an inexpensive room humidifier?
cool mist humidifier - Google Search
-
I own an original ES125TC that I bought new in 1966 and a newly acquired 1966 ES125TDC- Cherry sunburst models. The TC has been humidified for 54 years in the case with a plastic film cannister that I drilled holes into and a wetted(distilled water) piece of sponge inside to hold the moisture. It was my gigging guitar for over 10 years during the 60's/70's and is in collector quality, pristine condition. I acquired the TDC from my brother, recently, and it has had little care other than an occasional wipe-down and was not humidified. I am doing a complete reconditioning on the instrument and when it is done will be in very good to excellent condition. For me, a laminate is more forgiving than a solid wood guitar but there will be long term effects that will show visually and ,certainly, in the components. Proper care will pay off in the long term both in the value and quality of your instrument.
Play live . . . Marinero
-
Have you checked out the Boveda humidipaks? They don't have any risk of over-humidifying, but you have to be in the habit of putting the guitars back in closed case when not in use. Make sure you read up on the right type/size for your instrument and case.
Boveda for Wood Instruments | Boveda(R) Official Site
PK
-
There's another trade off in my world. A guitar kept in a case often gets played less.
-
I live in one of those overheated NYC apartments and use one of thes:
Oasis HumidifiersOasis (R)OH-6 Case Humidifier - Oasis Humidifiers
It even works in a gig bag, and does not leak or leave puddles, or anything like that. The guitar (Godin archtop) I've used it with has noticeable changes in action and fret buzz (no cracks or finish problems) when the heat comes on in late autumn. I use a soundhole humidifier with my Gypsy jazz acoustic for the same reasons. My other guitars don't seem to be bothered much (though they do need seasonal truss rod tweaks).
John
-
If possible, isolate a small room by keeping the doors closed to it. Get a small room humidifier, I use a Vornado, or something similar, that has a large water reservoir. Mine holds 3 gallons, I think, and can go for several days between refills.
Get a little humidity meter so you can keep an eye on how well it works. I've had to crack the door open occasionally, but not too often.
I recommend avoiding the atomizer types, as over time I've noticed mineral dust from whatever occurs naturally in our water, as we're on a deep well. The wick style humidifiers seem to work best, but the wicks need changing about every 3 months here. I've managed to get a second run from each set of them by soaking them in vinegar overnight and rinsing and drying to desolve the salts that accumulate and stop the wicking process.
I keep all of my guitars in the humidity controlled room. We have radiant hydronic floors, which during the heating season makes for a dry house. The cactus house plants love it, the guitars not so much.
Anyway, that's what I do.
Cheers, Steve
-
I live in a normally heated but still very dry Philadelphia apartment and also use one of these for my Campellone thin line archtop. I place it in the case near the headstock and replenish the water every 3 days or so. The guitar stays in the case when it’s not being played which, unfortunately, is a lot these days. Originally Posted by John A.
I used to humidify the room where my guitars live (our second bedroom). Unfortunately, it is also the room where I keep my main computer, a nice 27 inch iMac that I primarily use for photo editing. A year or two ago, it went on the fritz and when I brought it to Apple, they said the warranty was void because the humidity in whatever room I kept it was too high. I complained to the store manager, which came to nothing. (Apparently there is some form of sensor in an iMac that purportedly tells them that.) Result: a $900 repair. Further result: I switched from a whole room humidifier to the in-case Oasis. Seems to work fine.
-
Like Skykomishone, I keep my instruments in a room where I run a small humidifier, though mine is ultrasonic. I use only distilled water to avoid mineral dust. A 2nd advantage to distilled water is that it is nearly sterile - probably due to the distillation process. This significantly reduces the amount of cleaning the humidifier requires. I used to use tap water+distilled water at 50%+50% and much more cleaning was required.
I employ a lamp timer to control the humidifier; it runs for 30 minutes every three hours. At that rate, I get about a week out of a gallon of water. I don't measure the room's humidity but it feels much more humid than the rest of the house.
The tank is refilled from the bottom so don't buy a humidifier with a tank that can't stand up on its own when upside down (e.g. teardrop shaped). You will quickly come to hate that.
Good luck!
-
bmw2002,
Sorry to hear about your iMac problem! That really blows! Did Apple give you anything concrete - above this %humidity is too high?
Does this user's problem sound like yours?
Apple: The Midwestern United States Is Too Humid For The iMac – Consumerist
Originally Posted by bmw2002
-
I've been playing guitar for... 25 years now always living in the northeast and have never humidified a case, a room, or anything. Never had an issue. Am I just lucky or are these concerns overblown? It seems that some people worry about it quite a bit.
-
Thanks for the note. My issue wasn’t the screen, rather the internal components. The tech showed me some part of the computer (is “motherboard” a thing?) and I nodded like I understood what he was saying, Originally Posted by chasranney
What made it particularly frustrating was that I still had about 10 days left on the machine’s purchased warranty — so I was feeling relieved when I brought it into Apple. They were apologetic, but couldn’t get them to move. Doot!
-
Originally Posted by drbhrb
I live in the NE and always humidify though not the first night the heaters kick on as the levels seem to be fine until it gets much colder and the heater is cycling more frequently. but a friend who lives in the same area never humidifies and hasn't had an issue, I'm just not willing to risk it.
-
What is very dry? Has your friend measured it? In a common temperature meter nowadays there is a humidity meter too.
In my apartment when relative humidity is 45% or some lower if feel it very dry, my cloths and hair electrostatically charged. Also when sometimes it is 60% or some higher I feel it sometimes like a steambath.
Manufacturers say between 40%-60% is optimal for guitars. Under 40% I think it is unsuitable for long term comfortable human living, say 35% is extreme, and unhealthy. So if it is suitable for humans, then it suitable for guitars (talking about a dry apartment)
I think every event of change (either temp or humidity) is hurts. The worst idea to keeping the guitar in case in xx%, then periodically play on 40%, then back. That is a torture.
Same goes to temperature, if anyone have the extreme idea to keep the guitar in a special conditioned room, basement(!) to "care" it, then daily frequently and periodically plays on it in different temperature conditions.
First measure, then decide. There is a slight possibility, actually hurt the guitar with any forced humidity or temperature "caring"
-
chasranney
That's some good input. Thx.
And yes, very important to clean the evaporative type humidifiers on some schedule. It helps.Last edited by skykomishone; 12-12-2020 at 05:21 PM.
-
I know it's not practical for everyone, but when we needed a new AC and furnace, I had one of these Aprilaire whole house units installed into the system. Never have to fill it, runs off the water line, and humidifies through the house's ventilation system. Important for us, because my wife's baby grand and violins are upstairs, my guitars are downstairs, and she has serious resp problems. The upside of having it integrated with the hvac install is that I can control everything from one thermostat. Notice the little humidity indicator at the right.
Sorry! Something went wrong!
-
Thank you all for these comments. I linked this thread to my friend ... he's pursuing a couple of the suggestions offered. Very helpful people here!
-
For those who use humidifiers, can anyone recommend a good hygrometer for under $75 USD ?
I've done a bit of research, and it seems that accuracy can be all over the map for these things. There's no shortage of customer reviews which have mentioned purchasing 2 of the same product, placing them side by side, and getting completely different temperature and humidity readings.
I've also found that most of the "buying guide" sites have never actually tested the products they "review", and merely exist to drive traffic to an Amazon affiliate purchase.
-
The humidity guages in my home, and I have 3, are all within a % or 2 accurate. That's close enough. You can probably buy 3 on amazon for 75 bucks. My latest one is an Acurite. Does humidity and temp. Unless you're doing scientific research, +/- a degree or 2 should be good enough. IMHO. One of mine is a precision instrument, the other cheapo's, and they're in the same tolerance. Originally Posted by redcap
-
This only applies to solid wood builds I believe. I dont believe laminates need ti be humidified. But correct me if Im wrong, Im always willing to learn something.
-
they do need humidifying to prevent things like fret sprout, unwanted neck movement etc Originally Posted by jads57
This only applies to solid wood builds I believe. I dont believe laminates need ti be humidified. But correct me if Im wrong, Im always willing to learn something.
Reply With Quote
Recommandations for Hollowbodies for $600 and under?
Today, 05:20 AM in Guitar, Amps & Gizmos