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So do you justeep tuning the strings till they settle in?How do you address the intonation issue of the tapes
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03-18-2021 06:09 PM
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Been through several sets over the years, 12-54 I don't have any tape intonation problems and they are soft to the touch w/ a nice nylon-ish sound and they last a long time and are easy on the picks.....
I Have then on my Sadowski, Ibanez (2) Peerless and D'angelico.
Most important thing
is to not cut the tops too short or the upper strings may unwind a bit causing intonation problems,
Leave a few inches with the purple material showing! this is KEY!!!
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i mainly finger pick flesh mostly and as i get older i think these may be easier on the hands solo jazz playing or chord melody.And thanks for the info!!!!
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I have used these on my Eastman AR-371 with no issues.
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The 77 Hawk Jazz I got a few months ago had a set of these mounted (12-52). I thought they sounded nice , but the lack of tension felt really weird to me. This guitar has a slightly shorter scale length (24.55"), which maybe exacerbated that. I took them off pretty much right away and put Chromes on, which feel much better to me.
John
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Adding my 2¢ to this thread because I asked La Bella a question on Jazz Tapes tension via email. I was trying the 12s on my guitar and they felt very loose to me so I was considering 14s.
Their answer:
"...tape wounds in general have very light tension. We suggest to ignore the number on the gauges, and just look at the tension name e.g. the 14s are medium tension similar to a medium electric guitar set that is 10-48."
So there you go, if you like regular 10s on your electric guitar the feel will be similar with Jazz Tapes in 14s. The 1st string is still going to be a .14 vs. a .10 but overall the tension will be "medium."
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Getting fret buzz.?Put 12s on my Eastman 403.and i accidently tune them up almost a n octave tuned them back to standard did i ruin them?
Last edited by EarlBrother; 10-08-2021 at 04:48 PM.
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There is also the Rotosound Top Tapes: RS200 Top Tape Monel Flatwound Electric Guitar Strings 12-52 Gauge
I might try them for the Monel connection. Anyone tried them?
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Hey Rob im curious too, 12US$ a set beats the TI JS at 24!
Search on the forum there are some interesting comments on Roto flats.
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You're probably getting fret buzz because of the lower tension. Check the neck relief, which may be too little, or even perhaps some backbow, depending on the neck. I don't know what was on the guitar before this set, but the difference in tension could be fairly large. I check relief if I change by even one thou, but I keep a straight neck and very low action on my electrics.Getting fret buzz.?Put 12s on my Eastman 403.and i accidently tune them up almost a n octave tuned them back to standard did i ruin them?
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I've used Labella tapes 14-67 on my Byrdland for years and have never noticed any intonation issues in particular. In all that time, I might have had one bad set that did not intone correctly. I couldn't stand it, finally decided it was not me or the guitar, replaced them, and the problems went away.
Not sure what you are asking about tension. I like really low action and when the Byrd is set up properly even heavy strings like these are very easy to fret. On my other electrics, I use 9s; although these offer less to pick against, I try not to alter my mechanical technique in either hand) appreciably. That said, yes, the lighter-gauge strings require a bit more finesse in the right hand technique.
HTH
SJ
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UPDATE: On the aforementioned 9s, I may engage in a variety of shenanigans to get the strings to stretch out and settle in a bit sooner, like pulling on the entire string perpendicular to the fretboard from nut to bridge right after I put them on. This is usually good for a half-step of instant stretch on a new set of strings. On a guitar that I use for blues, rock, etc. uneven stretching comes with the territory, so I am less worried about it. But with the heavy tapes on the jazz box I just let a new set of strings stretch out naturally over a few days. I figure this is the best way to avoid uneven stretching that can mess up intonation.Last edited by starjasmine; 10-08-2021 at 09:00 PM.
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TI 13 flats
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I haven’t used them, but have used Rotosound’s taped bass-guitar strings, and they are wonderful.
Originally Posted by jazzkritter
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Broturtel.Did you find a happy medium with intonation?Adjusting the guitar itself?Any tips on getting reasonably close?
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I have an Eastman AR910 that i was looking to tame it's bright sound especially when playing it acoustically.The Jazz Tapes i put on sound really good.I followed jazzimprov's advice earlier in this thread and had zero problems putting them on.I put on 14's but next time i think i will try the 12's.I've always been a Thomastik user but i might try the JazzTapes on some other guitars.Why it took me so long to try them is beyond me,especially since i am a huge Pizzarelli family fan.
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I tried the Labella black tapes gauge 12 on my Gibson ES 175. I loved the percussive sound and the warmth of the strings. But the tension was extremely low, especially for lower strings. The intonation problem came from my fingers not being used to such low tension, so I was always sort of bending them. I never tried the 14th because the low strings seem too huge. Maybe on a longer scale guitar the tension would be less of an issue.
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If the tension was too low, then bigger strings would seem to be a way to provide higher tension. The thing with nylon tapes is that the nylon doesn't affect the tension much if at all, it just increases the diameter. Lower diameter tape-wound strings are pretty light compared to metal-wound strings of comparable diameter. If you want the sound of tapes, you have to live with bigger diameters.
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If you do, I recommend the D'angelico Semi hollow Deluxe SS Baritone! I've used the jazz tapes on a few archtops but moved on. Had a set of 14's left over. I just got the baritone which has a 26.75 " scale and a staircase bridge and the guitar loves these strings!! Provides an acoustic bass like tone for all the lovely bass line opportunities the guitar provides. They fit the bridge and winders which are locking right on the purple wrap. I'm getting a wonderful jazz tone using the p90 neck PUP and also combining the p90 bridge PUP. I got the guitar mostly to simplify lowering the keys of many of my songs as my voice has deepened over the 50 years I've been writing them, The guitar is tuned down to B. Singing a rag time song I wrote in C in Bb with a capo on 3rd fret is SO nice, But I didn't expect how good it would be for jazz. I'll do a NGD with more details soon. Originally Posted by EarlBrother
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What an excellent and informative submission by broturtel!
I have only a few observations. First don't cut any of the wound strings ANYWHERE! Instead, calculate how many windings you want times your post diameter times pi (3.14). Three coils will typically be about an inch-and-a-half. Attach the string at the bridge end, insert the string through the tuning machine with the holes parallel to the run of the neck, pull taut, then pull back the amount you determined to be the the length needed for three coils. Crank it tight from there. You'll have lots of waste end, and again, don't cut it. Simply wind it in back/forth/around among your other strings' waste ends.
Secondly, while a short guitar scale will make an already seemingly low tension scale lower, there is no problem if you observe the above rule. And with respect to a tailpiece, I have two pianos with Jazz Tapes, a Johnny Smith and a First Act that I bought at K-Mart 20 years ago. (The First Act has a longer scale.) I especially love the strings on the solid body.
The strings long lasting? I play about three hours a day and have averaged a couple a day for years. The strings are at least 5 years old and still really nice! And this coming from a guy who, when playing professionally five days a week (using that Johnny Smith), changed his round-wound strings every week.
As for intonation, I don't experience problems. You'd think I would if it were there; I am a piano technician who works for artists at the highest levels. Of course your bridge has to be correctly positioned. I frankly don't know if the strings require a substantially different position than other types of strings, but looking at my First Act I see that the taper from bass to treble is significant, with the 6th string maxed out at "as far back as possible" and the treble nearly maxed the other direction. (It's a moot point for the Johnny Smith, since it is a bridge that can be moved. Only the string tension holds it in place.) The only other reason I can see for poor intonation is the low tension. Squeeze, push or pull the strings and they run sharp. But that is true from all low tension scales and strings.
The only other concern I see is that a guitar with a non-adjustable tailpiece that descends at a severe angle causes the nylon to sort of separate at the bridge points. The nylon is, after all, a tender material giving that wonderfully tender sound.
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You write, "The silk should clear the nut and only the silk should wrap around the tuning post." While the silk on these strings will clear the nut on virtually any guitar, the silk may or may not wrap around the post. And indeed, for shorter instruments, you must wrap the tape-wound portion around the post. In so doing, nearly any scale length will work for these strings if they are installed intelligently. You are correct in warning against cutting these strings. My first set I cut into the silk portion, and it ruined the string. Don't do it.
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I am forever using the word "piano" for everything. I've restored grand pianos for over 40 years, hence the inadvertent claim that I have a Johnny Smith piano.
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For anyone who likes Labella Jazz Tapes,you might want to try Galli Black Nylon Tapes instead.I find the Labella Tapes too rubberband like while the Galli are stiffer and sound just as good and they last a long time.
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Or the Pyramid version, about which I posted a few years ago.
I loved the feeling under the fingers, but got a bit tired of the slightly too muffled sound of the lowest strings. IIRC I had the heavier of the 2 gauges the sell, and still had the too-easy-to-push/pull-sharp issue with them. And curiously, what really did it in for me was that they felt too high tension (I have the calculated tensions I got from Pyramid somewhere: they seem really high indeed).
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