Nylon classical cut away jazz guitar

**jefchan** · 01-08-2010, 01:41 PM

Still bothered by the weight of semi & solid body guitars, still searching for the light, nylon strung cutaway, w/650mm nut width [or close]? Me, too. [Listening to Gene Bertoncini, Earl Klug]

**JohnW400** · 01-08-2010, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by jefchan

Still bothered by the weight of semi & solid body guitars, still searching for the light, nylon strung cutaway, w/650mm nut width [or close]? Me, too.[Listening to Gene Bertoncini, Earl Klug]

You mean 650mm scale length and 50mm nut. A lot of the 'crossover guitars have 48 mm nuts. A regular classical has 52mm.

I did a ton of research and finally bought one. Action is a bit high so I need to get it set up.

What's your price range? Some nice stuff out there.

**jefchan** · 01-08-2010, 02:53 PM

Thank you. No wonder I'm still looking.
The ideal that I've heard Bertoncini play is a Buscarino built Grand Cabaret, "The guitar has a rounded cutaway and a 20-fret, 650-mm. scale. For amplification, Buscarino implanted a strip of piezo film material between the bridge plate and the underside of the top, which makes the entire top active. An L. R. Baggs preamp is Velcroed inside the guitar. Bertoncini uses a Polytone amp and La Bella Professional strings."
My budget is even more modest than my skills. Less than a thousand US$.

**JohnW400** · 01-08-2010, 03:48 PM

Forget the Buscarino then. It's lot's of money as are most custom luthier boxes.

The next question is do you play mostly amped or not?

If you play pluged in more often than not or if this will be a giging ax then you should put more money into the pup rather than solid woods. If you play purely for fun then I would consider the wood over the pups.

Solid woods are best for acoustic tone but the p/up becomes the great equilizer. You can get a good crossover guitar with a solid top and laminate back and sides and a p/up for under $1000.

Another thing I forgot to mention is there are different body thicknesses as well. Soem of the crossovers tend to have shallower bodies. On some the difference is slight . On others it's big like the body depth on a Cordoba Gipsy Kings Model. (65mm versus 95 or 105mm)

Anyway, some models to look at in your price range are

Yamaha GC171. Around $700
Kenny Hill Estudio $900 (narrow neck)
Cordoba 45FCE $970 with humi case
Takamine ec132c $850 w/case

That should be enough to get you started

**JimBobWay** · 01-08-2010, 04:32 PM

+1 on the Takamine, that one has served me well for many years. The Gibson Chet Atkins is a fine guitar too, you can probably find one used under $1K. It's a semi-solid design. I also have a Yamaha Silent nylon string, fantastic for travel, and while not sonically as sweet as either of the others (the Takamine sounds best to me) it's good enough for the stage and very light. Try 'em before you buy 'em, & buy 'em used!

**rabbit** · 01-09-2010, 01:14 PM

Just a thought, off-beat but here goes.

"Rope Core" #KR116 strings by Thomastic-Infeld
(buy mine from 'just strings' internet) are unique,
ball-end strings intended for classical or fragile guitars.
Low tension like conventional nylon strings, however the
'rope core' at the center of all six strings means they work
with magnetic pick-ups. The trebles are nylon flat-wound and
the basses wound like conventional classicals. Easy on frets.

I've a '00' martin with these and a Humbucking soundhole
pickup. You can get a nice jazz sound from a light guitar
and you may already have most or all you need except for
the strings, which are pricey at about $25.

**jefchan** · 01-09-2010, 01:20 PM

Thank you! And thanks to Dirk for creating this fantastic website. Also, I've tried the Yamaha Silent and it's very good, but the nut width is slightly narrow.

TommyD · 01-12-2010, 12:49 AM

Godin makes some pretty reasonably-priced nylon stringed guitars. I'm thinking about one myself.
If you want to see one in action -- and I MEAN in action!, click on the links in my new post in the "Improvisation" board, called "The Brazilian Wizard".
The guy is one of the best players in Brazil, and plays on Godin guitars. They're made in Canada.
T/

**jefchan** · 01-23-2010, 08:15 PM

Has anyone tried the Takamine 132SC?

**gremboul** · 01-23-2010, 08:52 PM

The Takamine is an outstanding guitar.

**brad4d8** · 01-23-2010, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by TommyD

Godin makes some pretty reasonably-priced nylon stringed guitars. I'm thinking about one myself.

I have a Godin nylon, I don't know the model off hand, but it has synth access pickup built in. I also have a Gibson Chet Atkins Nylon, and of the two I prefer the Godin, although the neck is probably a little narrower than the Chet. It has access much higher up the neck and just sounds a little better to my ears. Neither one can really be played acoustically, however. I also have an inexpensive Mitchell classical with a cutaway and pickup, but I've played it so infrequently I can't really comment on either its acoustic or electric sound, but it has a standard classical neck width. It was about $100 used. I used to have a Fender nylon string hybrid (GC 135, I think), and it was adequate acoustically, sounded good amplified, but the neck was narrower than a classical and had 14 frets to the body. Of all of them, I think the Gibson Chet Atkins may be the best choice for somebody used to a classical size neck, although I haven't spent enough time with the Mitchell to assess it properly.
A luthier friend told me that the best amplified sound from a nylon string that he'd ever run across was in a Giannini, although I don't remember if it was a standard classical style or one of their craviolas. He also said that it was lacking acoustically.
Good lcuk,
Brad

**jefchan** · 02-12-2010, 04:31 PM

Sorry. Visually challenged me.

compare: Taylor NS32-CE Nylon String Grand Concert Cutaway and the Chet Atkins Classical cutaway CEC [1980's, not the studio model]

**ronjazz** · 05-31-2010, 04:42 PM

Find a nice classical or flamenco you like the feel of, and then have the RMC system installed. I've had the RC system in four guitars in all; the latest is an Aparicio Flamenco, costs about $1500, but the previous guitar was a $350 Yamaha flamenco which sounded great but the nut was too narrow for me. it is the best, and synth-access available, which is cool for writing arrangements in the computer.

**medblues** · 05-31-2010, 09:50 PM

I am very happy with my Takamine TC132SC. All my friends like it too.

**bako** · 05-31-2010, 11:03 PM

Anyone try the Kenny Hill "New World Guitars" ? (their more mass produced instruments)
I have been looking at a narrow fingerboard cutaway "Player Series" model online (around $1,600) but haven't tried it yet.
When a good company goes into making a cheaper model, there is always the hope that it will in some ways keep the qualities of the high end guitars. That is exactly what their promotion plays into.

**Flat** · 06-01-2010, 12:48 AM

Before Kenny Hill started building his New World guitars in China, he built a similar low-cost series in Paracho, Mexico, using some of that well-known guitar-building city's craftsmen.

I have one of his Paracho-built Palo Escrito Crossover Cutaway models. This series was called "Guitarras de Estudio." Palo escrito ("Mexican rosewood" some call it) back and sides, red cedar top. Originally sold for about $1700, but my eBay special was under $900.

Very nice guitar, and an amazing guitar for the money. I suspect the New World series is of similar quality, although I believe his New World Crossovers are built of East Indian rosewood and Sitka spruce tops--which you might find even more desirable, depending on the sound you want to hear.

**JohnW400** · 06-01-2010, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by bako

Anyone try the Kenny Hill "New World Guitars" ? (their more mass produced instruments)
I have been looking at a narrow fingerboard cutaway "Player Series" model online (around $1,600) but haven't tried it yet.
When a good company goes into making a cheaper model, there is always the hope that it will in some ways keep the qualities of the high end guitars. That is exactly what their promotion plays into.

Lo Prinzi has a nice model in this catagory. They're made in FL. by Augie and his daughter.

Laminate back and sides but they tell me they do their own laminating. They also use a b-band pup as opposd to the Fishman. The plus to this is no 1.75 x 2.5 hole in the side of your guitar.

I didn't buy from him as I prefer solid wood.

TommyD · 06-01-2010, 09:49 AM

I want an amplified acoustic guitar that has a truss rod for adjusting the neck, an action that is height-adjustable so I'm not stuck with strings that are 1/4 inch above the fret board at the octave, and a fret board the same width as my Gibson archtop. Maybe I'm asking too much?
tommy/

**JohnW400** · 06-01-2010, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by TommyD

I want an amplified acoustic guitar that has a truss rod for adjusting the neck, an action that is height-adjustable so I'm not stuck with strings that are 1/4 inch above the fret board at the octave, and a fret board the same width as my Gibson archtop. Maybe I'm asking too much?
tommy/

Yamaha CG171 has a truss rod, 48mm nut width. It's the electric cutaway version that sells for under $700. I have one. Nice guitar.

I think Taylor may have one with a smaller neck and truss rod and I'm pretty sure Takemine has a 'crossover model"

**Soco** · 07-01-2010, 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by jefchan

Thank you. No wonder I'm still looking.
The ideal that I've heard Bertoncini play is a Buscarino built Grand Cabaret, "The guitar has a rounded cutaway and a 20-fret, 650-mm. scale. For amplification, Buscarino implanted a strip of piezo film material between the bridge plate and the underside of the top, which makes the entire top active. An L. R. Baggs preamp is Velcroed inside the guitar. Bertoncini uses a Polytone amp and La Bella Professional strings."
My budget is even more modest than my skills. Less than a thousand US$.

Gene actually uses an AER amp now.
I am very happy with my Godin Multiac grand concert and also my Taylor ns 32-ce.

**jefchan** · 07-02-2010, 03:58 AM

I didn't understand the reference to "RMC system" ostensibly to amplify an acoustic nylon string cutaway. Pointed and insightful comments, thank you very much. While still shopping, I spent a half hour with the Manuel Rodriguez Model A, and the FF Cutaway at Guitar Centre. Wonderful sound, great fit, expensive.

**ronjazz** · 07-02-2010, 04:19 AM

The RMC system also works well in standard electric guitars, to either get an "acoustic" tone or to drive the synth. Graphtec also makes a similar system. I've put my RMC into at least 4 different classical/flamenco guitars over the years; it's the most faithful reproduction of the guitar's sound I've heard yet short of a good microphone, although it's expensive and needs a pro for installation. I generally run through a Bose L1 system with a Zoom A2 acoustic multi-effects pedal for reverb and tone.