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11-16-2019 06:10 PM
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With that budget I would consider a two step approach. I think that Eastman makes most of their guitars with 1-3/4 nuts. You could start with one of their models and then take your time to shop for the holy grail after you figure out what does and does not work for you.
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So as much as I love Gibson Archtops, I would recommend a used Mark Campellone, Franz Elferink or similar archtop build instead.
You will get a superior instrument at much less entry price.
It would be best to play it in person or at least get a 48 hour approval period. But once you figure which specs work for you, you can start shopping!
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IMO, newer archtops, both from Gibson and boutique makers, are designed to be plugged in. They are not as good acoustically as a top shelf flattop. And many older archtops are designed to be played acoustically, but with a plectrum. And in both cases the nut is more likely to be 1 11/16 than not.
So for a purely acoustic archtop that is designed to be played acoustically without a plectrum and has a 1 3/4 nut, I am at a loss for a guitar to recommend. It sounds to me like another flattop would be a more appropriate use of the funds ( or perhaps a classical.)
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I also noticed it’s not on the site & should have mentioned that. But, it may still be in the store. I played it about 3 weeks ago, then looked for it on the site the next day and it was not there.
Originally Posted by Oldgoat
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The Benedetto Bravo has a 1.75" wide neck, and a relatively thin body at 2.5", and can be had new for $5250, much less used. Look at Reverb for both new and used. Eastman copies Benedetto pretty closely, and most have 1.75" nut widths. You can get a carved spruce top for a very reasonable price.
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You can always look at the for sale section :-) Originally Posted by Oldgoat
This is how I use previously sold: Maybe I'm wondering what a L-10 is. Do a 'Find on Page' for L-10, and then click through the highlighted listings. Each listing is a link to the sales page for that instrument, where you'll find decent photos and some pertinent info along with some stuff about how well it's been set up and what a wonderful thing it is. Ignore the boiler plate sales speak of course. There's 7 or 8 L-10's there, and you'll soon know what they are.
In your case I might look at L-7's. He's sold over a hundred. Maybe make some notes about what you're interested in like year, body depth, and nut width. And then go looking at L-5. You will learn quite a lot, and spend a some quality time lusting after guitars.
My apologies if you already did this.
I see that some of the folks who know these instruments better than I are chiming in. You can believe pretty everything you read. I think more of these guys will be showing up. There's a ton of experience in these parts.
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Thanks, just read through it Originally Posted by ccroft
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What is the patience thing of what you speak? Originally Posted by lammie200
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Patience would be waiting until you know what you want before buying. Buying quickly and then looking for something better is just the normal way of doing things here.
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I agree. If you are building a guitar in 1935, you are building it to sound good acoustically. If you are building a guitar in 2019 to be played through an amp, your focus should be on how to create the best sounding guitar with electronics in play. As we all know, there are a different factors that need to be taken into consideration. Both are "purpose-built". Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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Thank goodness, I was afraid I was going to have to find another forum! Originally Posted by sgosnell
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haha... +1 for the hedonists! Originally Posted by Oldgoat
cheers
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It is really difficult to quantify. Obviously, I'm fine with my Breedlove, which is ~15 1/2 lower and 4" deep. If the lower bout were much bigger, I'd want something thinner. If the box was much deeper, I'd want something smaller. I have both the 24.9 and 25.5 scale length and for some reason that doesn't bother me nearly as much as the 1/16" at the nut. My guess is that the added difficulty of 'fitting fingers' on the smaller scale is offset by the reduced string tension of the shorter scale. But more than likely, it's all between my ears. Originally Posted by coolvinny
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+1 on the L7 recommendations, btw.
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OK, then I would steer clear from any guitar with a pickup mounted in the top. A guitar with a floating pickup might be fine, even if you never plug in. I would suggest vintage acoustic Gibsons (16" L5, L4, also L7 but not the L5ces or L4ces which stands for "cutaway electric Spanish"; or a Johnny Smith). These will be voiced towards the bright side, designed to cut through a big band- crisp and punchy. They've got their own charm. Originally Posted by Oldgoat
I am not promoting archtop.com, btw, but their website makes the examples easy to find. There are other great sellers of arch top guitars out there and you should check them out.
1970's Gibson Johnny Smith
1949 Epiphone Triumph Regent, First Year
1939 Gibson L-5 Premiere, Natural Finish
1994 Gibson 'George Gobel' Custom (George Gobel model, thin line)
If you want a warmer, rounder sound then I think you're mostly looking into boutique stuff. You might find a real D'Angelico at the upper end of your price range, or a Barker or Hollenbeck on the vintage side (there are of course many more options; ISTR that Deacon Mark was selling a Barker on this forum, but the search only shows me 3 of 15 threads with "Barker" in them).
My own 17" arch top was made by forum member Matt Cushman and it is a wonderful guitar- modern voice which is warmer with more bass response than the 30s-40s archtops, plus a great neck and wonderful playability. It is a Benedetto style instrument. I play finger style almost all the time and it responds well to that, unlike many archtops which want the drive of a plectrum. Other wonderful luthiers have been mentioned by others in this thread.
2013 Trenier Rosine
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Nothing like a 16” Gibson archtop. It is the original archtop and the measuring rod of all other archtops.
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Many are but, as I'm sure you know, there are exceptions. I'm lucky to own a 2016 Trenier Motif oval hole, in fact the one on his website that Pasquale Grasso filmed a video with. It's designed to be played acoustically - actually it's designed to be played fingerstyle - but it also sounds really great with a plectrum. It sounds kind of mind-bogglingly good fingerstyle though...and it took me a while to figure that out...it wasn't until I found a thread where a 7-string Motif player had quoted part of a Trenier email and that hipped me to explore it more fully for fingerstyle, because with a pick it already sounded better than any acoustic archtop I'd played. I was actually thinking of selling it and buying the 2013 Trenier Rosine at archtop.com (which I've actually played, and sounds amazing) until realized just how special the Motif sounds with fingers (you would not believe how long the notes sustain for and the overtones!! when I visited my parents they were totally dazzled by this). Trenier is not taking orders currently but maybe watch out for a Motif or other Trenier oval-hole to perhaps come to market sometime. Used would be within budget but new would not be. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
I also think nut width itself is overrated - one must also consider the width at higher frets. Many 1.75 and 1 11/16" nut guitars are virtually indistinguishable by the 9th fret (although some 1.75" guitars will be a beefy 2 1/4" at say the 12th fret which I personally find too wide and have sold guitars due to...now I know that it's not just about nut width).
For a purely acoustic experience I think there's a lot to be said for an oval-hole archtop...even more so if playing fingerstyle. I also used to own a McKerrihan oval-hole, and I've played the 16" oval hole Andersen which is currently at archtop.com - a nice guitar and quite well-priced currently. Andersen 1 11/16" guitars feel often very similar to his 1.75" guitars IMO.
If I were the OP and if I just wanted something more comfortable than his 4" flat top, I'd definitely check out out the Andersen at archtop.com - like I said I've played it and it's very nice, and IMO it's well-priced. There's also a 17" Andersen oval-hole on Gbase for $7,500 perhaps worth checking out? But a 17" may give him trouble if he has shoulder issues.
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Definitely some interesting options, with the exception of the ~$20k L5. A bit too rich for my blood. Really wish the Gobel was 1 3/4" like the Johnny Smith (looks like they have two of these available) Originally Posted by Cunamara
Thanks
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Sorry I boofed up my post. I meant to reference that nice looking L-7 mentioned in post #12. It looks great.
yup. That guitar looks delish.
Nicer shape than mine, but more $$ too.
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I recommend taking your time. Christmas is soon. Don't rush into it. Play lots of guitars. Find out what you like to play.
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A nice spruce top Guild should always be a suggestion.
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Paul Duff certainly makes a beautiful guitar; however, I do have a lean towards vintage. Interesting when I went to check it out, he had a link to his distributor (Carter Vintage). They seem to have decent pricing on a variety of instruments. I'm guessing there is a lot of churn in the market in Nashville. Originally Posted by gitman
The Gibson L-5 you linked looks nice almost too nice for the price. Are there some red flags regarding that one?
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Foolish me. Several of y'all had mentioned Benedetto, so I went on to Reverb to look at them.
Benedetto Fratello 1988 Sunburst | Django Books | Reverb
Drop dead gorgeous. Of course, you can tell it is professionally photographed, so it probably doesn't look quite as nice in person. They have another one, that is also very nice:
Benedetto Fratello 1988 Honey Blonde, Handcrafted by Bob in | Reverb
But, man is that first one ever a looker. Why foolish me? Check out the price.
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Trenier Model E, 2011 (Natural Burst) 16"
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