Super 400 ridicolously cheap?

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 02:42 PM

12th fret is a well known store in Toronto for high end used guitars, mandolins and banjos. Pretty much the only store of it's kind in the city (There is one other similar but smaller store). This guitar has been in the store for months. They keep knocking down the price. Now it's at 6750 CAD (comes to around 5000USD). It's not like it has any flaws. It's pristine. Comes even with the original case. Is this another sign that archtop market is dying:
Gibson Super 400 Archtop Guitar Natural, 1948 | www.12fret.com

Note: This is not a sale post. I'm not selling the guitar nor do I have any affiliations with the store or the owner of the guitar. It's just that I've been seeing a lot of achtops lately with very good prices just collecting dust in the stores.

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 02:53 PM

refinished

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 02:57 PM

Yeah you're right. I missed that. Still though, according the reverb price guide this is like half price.
Gibson Super 400 1948 Sunburst Price Guide | Reverb

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:03 PM

1/2 price is typically what a refinished guitar is worth.
but if you like it make an offer, they'll probably bite.

**Gabor** · 11-11-2019, 03:05 PM

It does not look like as photos of the actual selling item, more like "borrowed" stock or article photos,
Maybe I am wrong... but anyway, above $5000 the buyer expect more than 2 photos and including close ups...)

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

1/2 price is typically what a refinished guitar is worth.

Wow ruthless.

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by Tal_175

Wow ruthless.

I don't set the market, it is what it is...

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Gabor

It does not look like as photos of the actual selling item, more like "borrowed" stock or article photos,
Maybe I am wrong... but anyway, above $5000 the buyer expect more than 2 photos and including close ups...)

nah, they're photos of the actual guitar, I'm sure if you want more they'll email them to you.

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Gabor

It does not look like as photos of the actual selling item, more like "borrowed" stock or article photos,
Maybe I am wrong... but anyway, above $5000 the buyer expect more than 2 photos and including close ups...)

I saw and played the guitar a couple of months ago. It's exactly like in the photos. It was too light and acoustic for my expectations from a Gibson archtop. But then it's 1948.
I was shocked how clean it was. Didn't suspect that it was refinished like a doofus.

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 03:16 PM

I want a refinished 1959 ES 175.

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by Tal_175

I saw and played the guitar a couple of months ago. It's exactly like in the photos. It was too light and acoustic for my expectations from a Gibson archtop. But then it's 1948.
I was shocked how clean it was. Didn't suspect that it was refinished like a doofus.

well, it is an acoustic guitar, not sure what you were expecting

**Gabor** · 11-11-2019, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

nah, they're photos of the actual guitar, I'm sure if you want more they'll email them to you.

My bad then.

I did not know the actual store and meanwhile I googled using the picture and did not found match so I concluded I was wrong, it's original.

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

well, it is an acoustic guitar, not sure what you were expecting

I played other super 400's none of the were nearly as light weight as the one in the ad.

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by Tal_175

I played other super 400's none of the were nearly as light weight as the one in the ad.

were they acoustic Super 400s? pickups, pots, knobs, etc add weight

**Tal_175** · 11-11-2019, 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

were they acoustic Super 400s? pickups, pots, knobs, etc add weight

Some of them. There is more to weight of the build than the hardware. Of course gravity does it's part, but super 400's I played felt more thickly carved than this one. There was an acoustic L7 in the store when I played the S400 which felt heavier.

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 03:30 PM

refinishing requires sanding, that'll thin things out a bit.

**customxke** · 11-11-2019, 04:45 PM

Refin without a serial number on the label......I think it’s priced fairly.

**WillMbCdn5** · 11-11-2019, 05:02 PM

My 51' Super 300 non cutaway weighs 6 lb 2 oz /2.78 kilo with original finish and no pickup.
Will

**Jim Soloway** · 11-11-2019, 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by Gabor

My bad then.

I did not know the actual store and meanwhile I googled using the picture and did not found match so I concluded I was wrong, it's original.

Probably the most reputable store in Canada.

**Dennis D** · 11-11-2019, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

refinishing requires sanding, that'll thin things out a bit.

I'd have to think a natural -original-to-natural refinish wouldn't remove too much ' meat '......But I'd agree original sunburst-to-refinish in natural would mean some aggressive sanding....

Yes, no or ?

**wintermoon** · 11-11-2019, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by Dennis D

I'd have to think a natural -original-to-natural refinish wouldn't remove too much ' meat '......But I'd agree original sunburst-to-refinish in natural would mean some aggressive sanding....

Yes, no or ?

probably correct Dennis, I was just funnin'

**Dennis D** · 11-11-2019, 08:20 PM

Originally Posted by Tal_175

I saw and played the guitar a couple of months ago. It's exactly like in the photos. It was too light and acoustic for my expectations from a Gibson archtop. But then it's 1948.
I was shocked how clean it was. Didn't suspect that it was refinished like a doofus.

I wouldn't feel too bad about not having spotted the 'refinish'. The color was an original natural, so you wouldn't have seen the telltale marks that are typical of sunburst-to-natural refinishes.