Benedetto Pickups - 12k Resistance!

[58flame]

Only thing I can say is when I replaced thr std pickups in my Benedetto Bambino with lower output Manluis PAF's the guitar really opened up and sounded way better.

Bingo.

[Cunamara]

It's a matter of taste, 58flame. I hear a lot of jazz guitar videos with what sounds to me like a horrid, bright, thin, clangy tone- but you might think it sounds clear, articulate and defined. What's good to my preferences might not be good to you and vice versa.

The effects of inherent pickup tone (bright vs. dark pickups) are different than the effects of EQ on a bright pickup (unless you're using parametric or a 20 band EQ).

IME Benedetto style guitars are very bright and stringy when amplified using typical pickups compared to Gibson style guitars. Benedetto's pickups are designed to have a more typical "jazz" tone on that kind of guitar.

[58flame]

If you start with a clear tone, with as many frequencies as possible, you can mold the sound to anything you want with an EQ. If you're missing the high frequencies to start with, you're stuck with a dark tone. And then that dark tone you love in the woodshed becomes a muddy mess when you step on the bandstand in a room that seemingly sucks all the treble out the air! Now you're stuck and can't fix it. Been there, done that. Guitars with dark, uninteresting tones are just bad instruments to me.

[sgosnell]

The final two words of that post are the only ones which matter.

[arnie65]

This is the video from Barry Green that pushed me over the edge to get the Benedetto B6 pickups, later on last year I saw Barry (the guitarist on the right) playing here in my hometown, and the tone was exactly the same as in the video. A rounded fat, clear, defined tone. The pickups did not disappoint, I've got a pretty close tone to that... I guess some people might call this type tone muddy, or too dark, etc, but I like it.


Cheers,
Arnie...

[skykomishone]

I've taken an interest in this thread because an old friend of mine gave me a Benedetto pickup that I've been trying to identify. It's odd that it came in a Benedetto pickup box labeled 'S6', with a wiring diagram from Benedetto for an S6, but it's clearly not, because (S6) is a floater, and mine is a humbucker set pickup type, and I thought maybe it was a B6, but didn't match the wiring of a Duncan from the tabs on the back. There is no harness, and it appears brand new.

I've had this pickup for several years at least, and this thread got me interested once again in the pickup.
So, I sent a photo of it to Seymour-Duncan and they told me it was a KA and like their B6.



Do any of you know the history here of KA and Benedetto, and maybe have some experience with this version by comparison? And also, by chance know what is what on the back of the pickup and how it operates? Help is appreciated.

Thanks

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

I've had a B7 (same as a B6 but for a 7 string) in my Ibanez AF207 laminated 16" archtop for a few years and absolutely love it. I was just practicing on it and thought I'd capture a quick track to give you an idea of how it sounds. I think it's one of the smoothest old school 'buckers I've ever heard despite its operating parameters. It's not at all shrill or bright, and I think it brings out the best from this guitar. This was played with guitar tone pot about 3/4 up through my BAM200 with all EQ at noon driving a Toob Metro BG+, with my Alesis Picoverb adding just the slightest touch of reverb.



Sorry - I know the chord melody clashes a bit with the backing track. I hadn't listened to the whole track carefully and didn't realize how heavy the organ's comping got at times. I just wanted to show how the pickup sounds with big chords.

[arnie65]

I've taken an interest in this thread because an old friend of mine gave me a Benedetto pickup that I've been trying to identify. It's odd that it came in a Benedetto pickup box labeled 'S6', with a wiring diagram from Benedetto for an S6, but it's clearly not, because it's a floater, and it's of the humbucker set pickup type, and I thought maybe it was a B6, but didn't match the wiring of a Duncan from the tabs on the back. There is no harness, and it appears brand new.

I've had this pickup for several years at least, and this thread got me interested once again in the pickup.
So, I sent a photo of it to Seymour-Duncan and they told me it was a KA and like their B6.



Do any of you know the history here of KA and Benedetto, and maybe have some experience with this version by comparison? And also, by chance know what is what on the back of the pickup and how it operates? Help is appreciated.

Thanks

This is definitely one of the B6 pickups before Seymour Duncan started making them for Benedetto, it is indeed a Ken Armstrong made B6 pickup. As far as I know, he was the one that designed the pickup, which is very similar to his very popular 12 pole epoxy pickup. All you need is to solder your leads to the back of the pickup and install it.



Cheers,
Arnie..

[skykomishone]

I need to understand where to solder the which leads. I currently don't know, and until I do, It's useless to me.
So far, I've found this info from an old ebay listing for a similar KA B6 that gives some history from Kent Armstrong, which makes it different than the SD version that might be interesting to share.


"This B-6 is built by Kent Armstrong not Seymour Duncan. The older first generation 1990's were built by Kent you can tell the difference by the mounting ears and DC resistance of 8.9k and 4.2 split. Kent's have the black Ebony material over the ears and the Duncan's have exposed metal tabs and DC of 12.10K and no epoxy on the back. From what I understand the Armstrong B-6 and Duncan B-6 are two completely different pickups with the Armstrong more of a traditional PAF roots and the Duncan hotter and thus darker sounding.

From Kent:
Yes I made his pick-ups for ten years and then he signed a deal with Duncan. The Duncan sounds nothing like mine as they had to use 44 gauge wire instead of the 42.5 gauge I use and that makes all the difference in the world to the Jazz sound. I still make them but with no name on them. The design was to give a big Jazz sound it has 5,000 turns of 42.5 gauge wire per coil and two steel bars one in each coil with two alnico 5 magnets bridging the two steels. There are no bobbins in this epoxy pick-up so the coils are very close to the steels to give max power and tone. I make the same PU in plain top poled … It is the same recipe I’ve used for years."

[skykomishone]

Nevershouldhavesoldit,
That's a great sound!
Makes me think of Doug Raney's sound. Nice playing.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Nevershouldhavesoldit,
That's a great sound!
Makes me think of Doug Rainey's sound. Nice playing.

Thanks! I think the Duncan built Benedetto B and TI heavy Bensons bring out the best tone I’ve gotten from the AF since I bought it new in ‘97. I’ve never tried a KA built B, but I’m sure it’s an excellent pickup - I have one of his hand wound 14 pole set HBs in one of my carved Eastmans and I love it.

I’m so happy with this guitar / pickup / string combination that I can’t imagine ever changing anything.

[Cunamara]

Nevershouldhavesoldit,
That's a great sound!
Makes me think of Doug Raney's sound. Nice playing.

High praise! I think Doug Raney had about the best jazz tone ever. Perfect balance.

[arnie65]

I need to understand where to solder the which leads. I currently don't know, and until I do, It's useless to me.
So far, I've found this info from an old ebay listing for a similar KA B6 that gives some history from Kent Armstrong, which makes it different than the SD version that might be interesting to share.

I'm sure the info is somewhere online, but you can give Ken a quick call at 802-843-1065 and he'll guide you through the connections. He's on eastern time.


Arnie...

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Both the old 4 wire version and the current 3 wire version of the Benedetto B6 and B7 (all built by SD) have a coil split tap. Grounding the white wire on the 3 lead version (which is what SD makes now) shunts one coil to ground, turning it into a single coil pickup.

When I installed the B7 in the Ibby, I wired it to a push-pull pot just for the heck of it - but I never really used it or tried to get the most out of it. This thread got me thinking about the possibilities, so I played with it this morning while practicing. The SC mode really changes the nature of the device, delivering a brighter but still balanced tone. I think it makes the laminated AF207 sound a lot more acoustic and gives it that sparkle that fans of the Benedetto sound will probably like. I hear no added noise in our apartment, although there was enough electrical noise on stage at the club in which I used to play to keep me from using the SC position. Compare it to the first track I posted earlier in this thread as a humbucker.

[Cunamara]

Now more along the lines of Johnny Smith tones rather than Doug Raney. That's not problematic either...