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By the same token isn’t one of Bill’s guitars a Mexican fender thinline tele with a pickup swap?
Originally Posted by medblues
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08-21-2018 08:18 AM
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One guitar?? That's news to me! Originally Posted by christianm77
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Yes, but what, exactly IS a 'jazz' guitar or a 'rock' guitar. Seems that maybe Bill Frisell and Ted Nugent are playing the wrong instrument for their respective genres. Maybe the 'guitar police' should go out and remedy the situation. IMHO, I think that some (not all) jazz players or 'wanta be' jazz players are of the misguided opinion that showing up with an L-5 or Super 400 makes them look the part. I'm glad to finally start seeing players using what works best for them (Teles, Strats, LPs, etc.). Nothing wrong with archtops, either, but they're not a prerequisite for playing jazz. Originally Posted by christianm77
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Any guitar can be a jazz guitar. That’s kind of the point. Originally Posted by Skip Ellis
I think some players in London think primarily in pastiching the style and playing the guitar sounds for the gig. And the scene strongly incentivises players to think this way.
Oh it’s a country gig, I’ll get the tele. Oh it’s a rock gig, I’ll get the superstrat and so on. Important when your job is to play the exact solos from Michael Jackson for a show or whatever. And it takes a lot of skill.
But to me real jazz is about finding your own sound. And to me, that process is in sharp opposition to the man of a thousand faces vibe of commercial work. That’s a NYC thing to my mind, and everyone in NYC seems resigned to making no money playing :-) (afaik it’s about the European festivals and so on.)
Anyway I tend to gravitate towards my 175 now, so I’m basically going to play that on every gig I can. But it could have been the tele.Last edited by christianm77; 08-21-2018 at 10:56 AM.
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Image is important though. A rocker with a big archtop looks cool man! In general the rock crowd is more open minded too. Tradition doesn't mean s..t there, but in jazz it means a lot to a lot of people. But hey, another jazzman with another archtop? Yawn. Gimme jazz on a Flying V, I'll buy such album on the spot!
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Another advantage of standard gear is that it's easy to get it serviced. Not such a big deal for guitars, but really exotic amp can be a curveball for a tech. Originally Posted by christianm77
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.......That's for sure ! It just keeps reinforcing my opinion that it may be as valuable ( or more so ) to spend the time it takes to find a good luthier and a good amp tech as one spends finding a guitar and an amp. Originally Posted by Boston Joe
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There’s got to be some mid 70s Flying V fusion, surely? Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
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Despite what the artist purity police say, a guitar can be much more than a tool. It can be a reward, it can be a friend, it can be fashion.
To the OP, let your heart, hands, head and guts be your guide. You are reaching a milestone and there is nothing wrong with reaching for a guitar that is special to you.
Personally, buying a stock Tele would be like rewarding myself with a Honda Civic (with VTEC power!!!). That is probably empirically the most practical car and best bang for your buck, I still wouldn’t buy one to commemorate a milestone. I have a Tele clone with near identical specs to Cunmara’s, so I’m not anti Teles.
But if having a high end boutique Tele will bring a smile on your face every time you pick it up, then that is the right guitar for you. You are not required to get only the most utilitarian guitar you can find.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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I've bought a few milestone guitars and they will never be on the chopping block. That said, I tend to play my modded BP Tele most of the time. My other main squeeze -- Dupont DM-50 -- is not a milestone guitar but is pretty much the best gypsy guitar you can get.
I keep looking at my stacks of guitars and thinking I can get by just fine with 3:
Fender BP Tele (modded)
Dupont DM-50
60's Fender Champ lap steel
Note the lack of archtops in the above list
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A ‘gypsy jazz guitar’ is the clearest example I can think of a guitar having a style and genre attached beyond maybe pointy superstrats and 8 string Djent machines.
(Even with an archtop you have rock, funk and country players who use them)
The annoying thing is that in the 30s Selmer guitars were simply the professional guitars available in Europe. The cult of Django and his influence on the subsequent Manouche jazz tradition has meant that this instrument is now like wearing a badge.
As a result I kind of want to avoid playing it. Not because I don’t like it or gypsy jazz, it just means that people see you as ‘that type’ of player and Gypsy jazz gets seen in a certain light by promoters, musicians and so on. It’s bs of course.
As a player who is at least as much influenced by American swing and bop it’s actually quite annoying, esp as that guitar is very useful. I see it as the acoustic equivalent of a telecaster!
Also it’s hard to amplify which is a convenient excuse.
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Yeah that’s what I’ve heard said, I think by Adam Levy but would have to check. Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
I have to say it’s true of around 75-80% of the NYC jazz guitarists I can think of.
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So i went and tried a bunch of production model fenders that were either custom shop or american elite series and above. Im going to go play a bunch of botique models today hopefully... for the cost, they better knock my socks (and shoes) off. We shall see!
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Good to hear. I like the attitude and way you're going about this. I'd add one thing though. Not all guitars are created equal, even those of the same model from the same builder. Since you're now testing hands on, keep your eyes open for that one special guitar that really speaks to you with no other preconditions. It's never a certainty that one guitar will jump out but if it does, be ready to let go of some preconceptions and accept your intuition. Originally Posted by Thelonious1
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Jim,
Heavy stuff, but there's an unspeakable amount of truth to that concept. Once i walked in looking for an andersen streamline. And walked out with an eastman 1/5 the price and 2x as loud. Just because that particular guitar felt better. I think it was also a different style. Needless to say, im not all that attached to the idea of the image a tele carries (frankly im not all that hip to that idea at all) but i saw two instruments stolen one recovered and one broken within the last year.... none of which were stolen were mine. I did however own yhe broken one... unfortunate but apparently 339's have really hit or miss qc on their necks... such is life... so with all the latest chaos, i was hoping to not have to take a relatively delicate instrument i care about to places that may not be "studio safe" environments.
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Yea, everyone struggles here, we all can only afford one guitar! Originally Posted by christianm77
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I seriously understand that. I just flew from Canada to Mexico with my #1 guitar in an $80 ultralight case. It's about as sturdy a guitar as I've ever owned. Three flights and gate checked into and out of the luggage hold on all three. Never worried about it and it came off the last flight in perfect condition and still in tune. There's a LOT to be said for that kind of durability. Originally Posted by Thelonious1
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Haha... I always thought it was because you live in tiny shoeboxes on the 30th floor. Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
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Really? What case? Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
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The Gator Gl_electric . I've shipped hundreds of guitars in this type of case and flown with them a bunch of times all with close to zero problems. The cases break down eventually but the they do a brilliant job of protecting the guitar and they're incredibly light weight. There are lots of versions of these cases from various vendors. The features many vary but the basic structure is the same on all of them. Originally Posted by christianm77
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Actually it's a tiny shoebox under the 1 st floor. Originally Posted by christianm77
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yeah that’s true, the ones on the 30th floor have views. Can’t afford those. Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
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Cool, what were you taking, a solid body? Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
The Gator Gl_electric . I've shipped hundreds of guitars in this type of case and flown with them a bunch of times all with close to zero problems. The cases break down eventually but the they do a brilliant job of protecting the guitar and they're incredibly light weight. There are lots of versions of these cases from various vendors. The features many vary but the basic structure is the same on all of them.
I don’t think I can get away with playing a tele for my gypsy jazz gigs unfortunately. I might need a touring guitar and hiscox case
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(Which goes back to the point above lol)
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It does indeed Originally Posted by christianm77
. The same applies to acoustics. You can either go for the whole box along with a heavy case and some significant risk level or you can go for something more practical and more secure that can at least get you in the neigborhood tonally. For most of us mortals there's no real third alternative.
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