Tailpiece Earthing?

[JazzNote]

Ha, jazznote, I certainly can't imagine myself going to all that trouble. But thanks anyway.

Rob, on page 7 he shows how he uses superglue or epoxy to cover the wiring so that it can't be pulled off by accident. Maybe you could do the same with the sections that don't need to make contact with the strings. On neatomics pic the wire across the tail piece looks as if it was glued at the ends only.

[oldane]

A piece of narrow copper self-adhesive tape, available many places, might work better for the contact along the strings than a piece of wire, but if it's not readily available the wire will work. The tape can also be used for the run from the strings to the tailpiece end. That's what I've used in the past on one of my instruments, and it works okay. I bought a roll of tape ~3/16" wide, and still have most of it on hand, and it wasn't expensive. I don't know what is available over there, though.

There have been several suggested solutions - some quite elaborate and labor intensive - but yours lives up to the "KISS" principle (Keep It Simple Stupid) and it would be my choice too. Since it's on the back side of the tailpiece where nobody sees it, it doesn't have to be pretty as long as it works. Self adhesive copper tape or sheets are available from suppliers of Luthiers tools like StewMac but likely also from other sources. I bought a sheet for lining the cavities of my partscaster when I assembled it. It was easy to cut and work with.

I may add that not all luthiers ground the strings. My Benedetto Fratello from 1997 doesn't have any string grounding and its S6 pickup (the older Armstrong variant) is not noisy despite of that.

[oldane]

There have been several suggested solutions - some quite elaborate and labor intensive - but yours lives up to the "KISS" principle (Keep It Simple Stupid) and it would be my choice too. Since it's on the back side of the tailpiece where nobody sees it, it doesn't have to be pretty as long as it works. Self adhesive copper tape or sheets are available from suppliers of Luthiers tools like StewMac but also from other sources. Check Amazon or eBay, there's plenty available in UK. I bought a sheet for lining the cavities of my partscaster when I assembled it. It was easy to cut and work with.

I may add that not all luthiers ground the strings. My Benedetto Fratello from 1997 doesn't have any string grounding and its S6 pickup (the older Armstrong variant) is not noisy despite of that.

This was supposed to be an edit, but by accident ended up as a reply. I apologize for the confusion.

[Rob MacKillop]

Yes, it's not a major problem or deal breaker. It's just that, when you've just bought the guitar, you don't want this hassle. Sending it back to London for such a small job would be a pain. I could maybe fix it, or get someone locally to fix it, but there goes the warranty. Seems to work fine through an amp as it is, so maybe I could just leave it.

[grahambop]

Yes, it's not a major problem or deal breaker. It's just that, when you've just bought the guitar, you don't want this hassle. Sending it back to London for such a small job would be a pain. I could maybe fix it, or get someone locally to fix it, but there goes the warranty. Seems to work fine through an amp as it is, so maybe I could just leave it.

You won't get electrocuted will you Rob?

Actually I remember seeing some crummy old 1960s film or TV thing many years ago, where a guy was found dead and the detective said someone had interfered with his guitar and made it electrocute him. I think they showed the guitar lead plugged straight into the mains!

[Rob MacKillop]

Okay, Now you've got me worried!

[Matt Cushman]

If it works the way it is you may not need to have the strings grounded as oldane pointed out. The problem with the setup on this T P is the wire that the strings were intended to contact is not anchored down in a way that forces the string to ride against it while under tension. The string and the often painted ball end only have contact in a very small area of the T P. A larger contact area than that offered by a thin bare wire is likely needed. The copper foil tape idea suggested is a good one and helps solve the problem of poor contact with the string. I have used strips of fine braided copper wire epoxied over the string holes with good results. There is no doubt that a well shielded circuit may not need any string grounding at all.

[Rob MacKillop]

Cheers, Matt. Okay, I'm not panicking. No reply from the shop yet, but there's no need to return the guitar. I'll get it seen to soon enough.

[ptchristopher3]

Hi Rob,

As Matt mentions, a reasonably well shielded system can be just fine with ungrounded strings.

In a very dry (unlikely a problem where you are) environment there is a very small chance of trouble from static crackle from the ungrounded strings even if there is otherwise adequate shielding.

But with even with only a string or two grounded, your hands tend to make adequate contact and even discharge static from any ungrounded strings.

The mentioned danger of electrocution is in NO WAY increased by your situation.

Nor are guitars ever accidentally plugged into the mains.

The very real danger of electrocution was considerably more common in past when mains plugs (in the USA anyway) were both ungrounded and unpolarized.

It was very possible for chasis ground to end up at mains voltage.

The danger came from your amp, OR the PA, or the amp from the idiot bass player having the “ground” be at mains voltage.

The classic injury was a remarkably unpleasant spark from your lip to the microphone.

In days of old we would all plug in a power up then walk around very carefully touching everything expecting a spark.

We were idiots. Fortunately the USA has Nancy-boy 120 VAC. So serious injury was possible, but took some talent for disaster.

Chris

[Rob MacKillop]

Haha. Cheers, Chris. Those were the days, eh? Apparently Keith Richards was knocked out cold when he touched a mic stand while holding his guitar. They all thought he was dead...But as we now know, he is indestructible!

[ptchristopher3]

Haha. Cheers, Chris. Those were the days, eh? Apparently Keith Richards was knocked out cold when he touched a mic stand while holding his guitar. They all thought he was dead...But as we now know, he is indestructible!

Indeed. The funny thing is that I still see ancient Fender amps heads for sale here at places like Guitar Center with unpolarised two-prong plugs, and the widow-maker “ground” switch. One can be sued for bad t-shirt choices, yet they sell these amps “as is”.

I started luthiating for a living in the very late 70’s. Les Pauls were made with a full metal shield around the pot cavity and ungrounded strings. It did not work all that well, and we routinely pulled a tailpiece threaded stud out, drilled through to the control cavity, and added ground wire running from the stud to ground.

Most musicians smoked in those days and every work surface had a Les Paul throwaway control cavity shield as an ashtray.

Good times, cough-cough,...

Seriously, you may very well be just fine with no string ground at all. If not, Matt is a solid source of simple effective solutions.

I over-complicate.

In assume your are in the north?

Chris

[Rob MacKillop]

Scotland...north, but not north enough, of England

[neatomic]

as long as that "traverse" wire is still connected to one side of the tailpiece/ strings you'll still get grounding effect..not optimal but...

the end of that traverse wire just needs to be fitted back in place on the first string side..the end of the wire just pops into a small hole...easier if next time you take the strings off, you unscrew the tailpiece altogether..that'll let you reattach traverse wire easier...no big deal


cheers

[Rob MacKillop]

Thanks, Neatomic.

[rolijen]

Rob,

I think we have this all wrong... on closer inspection, it appears that your Peerless is still very young. That hanging wire is a baby string. It’ll come in thicker as your baby grows into the lovely 7-string she was destined to be.

Roli

[Rob MacKillop]