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I found 22 guitars to be a burden. Motorcycles are different. If you let them sit too long, a motor/trans/carb rebuild will be necessary along with a new battery. If you let a guitar sit too long, a fret polish and new set of strings gets you back up and going.
Originally Posted by Longways to Go
I have 2 motorcycles and 15 guitars. I am 60 years old. The goal by 70 is to be down to 1 motorcycle and 12 guitars. Something tells me I may buy a few more before I trim down (or as I trim down). But I think I have bought my last motorcycle (I am making progress
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Let us know how you like the 175. Show us pictures.....Last edited by Stringswinger; 12-07-2017 at 02:38 AM.
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12-07-2017 01:18 AM
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I can identify with this. With me it is classic cars (and related parts, etc.) and guitars. I've reached the point where I'm over the "acquiring" stage and starting to pare down. I have a long way to go. I always thought it would be difficult (mentally) when I reached this point, but not so at all. In fact, it is somewhat liberating. As with life in general, I have a good bit of "been there, done that" satisfaction that makes letting go quite acceptable. Paring down guitars is not as big a situation as cars, for obvious reasons. But very similar as far as the mind-set goes. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
I found 22 guitars to be a burden. Motorcycles are different. If you let them sit too long, a motor/trans/carb rebuild will be necessary along with a new battery. If you let a guitar sit too long, a fret polish and new set of strings gets you back up and going.
I have 2 motorcycles and 15 guitars. I am 60 years old. The goal by 70 is to be down to 1 motorcycle and 12 guitars. Something tells me I may buy a few more before I trim down (or as I trim down). But I think I have bought my last motorcycle (I am making progress)
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After playing this guitar for a few days, I have been able to adapt to the chunky neck. It is a C profile. My 2008 had a bit more of a D profile. It is a great playing and sounding jazz guitar. Still at 7 pounds 10 ounces, this is the heaviest 175 that I have owned. My Norlin 175's were just over 7 pounds. These 2016 Figured 175's are approaching 335 weight.
I dated this to March of 2017 and did find a small flaw. It has an almost undetectable blister (crack?) in the wood on the outside of the cutaway, right at the point where the binding is. You cannot feel it, but if you turn the guitar upside down and look at it in clear, bright light, you can see the flaw. Perhaps all of these CME guitars are flawed is some small way. At these prices, these tiny flaws are no problem.
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My 2016 ES175 Figured SB was 7 lbs 12 oz, so yeah, they run heavy. But they feel really solid in the hands. My VOS is 6 lbs 7 oz. which is about what the Epiphone ES175 Premium weighs too. I think that might be the main difference in the tone, along with TOM vs wood bridge. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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A TOM adds sustain and brightness. I will probably replace the TOM on my new 175 when the first string change happens. I am hoping that the wood saddle will work OK with the pinned bridge. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
My research tells me that ES-175's have varied over the years (and there is a variance from guitar to guitar in any given year as well) from 6 pounds to 8 pounds. These 2016 made "Figured ES-175's" are, from what I can tell, the most consistently heavy 175's yet. I do believe that the lighter guitars are more "resonant" and therefore impart a more "acoustic" tone (at least to the player). And as we age, lighter guitars (for most of us) simply are more comfortable.
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I was surprised by the weight/heft of this guitar too. But I play seated 99% of the time so it's not a big worry.
I think the thick neck goes along nicely with the heft
My amateur non-scientific theory on thick necks is that they increase resonance and structural stability.
I find this 175 to feel and sound quite different from the Epi 175 premium. Much more resonant acoustic sound.
Just a vibier experience overall -- which is what one would expect when looking at Gibson vs Epiphone.
I traded my Epi premium off some time ago. Not because it was bad or anything, in fact it was quite good . . . just moved on to the next.
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I haven't weighed my 175 yet. It weighs about the same as my Tal, which is surprising.
Standing in front of all my guitars last night I swiped my fingers across the strings on all of them. The 175 and the Tal sound almost exactly the same. Each string remains separated. The HJS18 is the loudest. The GJS is very throaty sounding. Both Johnny's have that swirly sound. I have a temporary rosewood bridge on the HJS18.
But the one guitar that sounded different to me was my 165. It was deeper. All the strings blended together. It had a more pleasing, full bodied tone that just screamed, George Benson's Ode to a Kudu, Weekend in L.A. album.
I really love exploring the nuances that differ between each guitar. The clarity of the new 175 is really one of its great attributes. Also Playability, which is off the charts..
JD
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My ES175 Figured weighs 7 pounds 12 ounces; the VOS 1959 weighs 6 pounds 7 ounces. I'll be really interested to know how much your new ES175 weighs. I think the weight has a big impact on the tone. Originally Posted by Max405
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I am not sure to what extent weight or poly vs nitro affects tone. I do believe that every component of guitar production does have some part in the final tone. When John Lennon had his 1965 Epiphone Casino refinished, both John and George Harrison thought the tone was considerably improved (George promptly had his Casino refinished as well). Originally Posted by lawson-stone
In the 1970's it was thought that the heavier the guitar, the more it would sustain. We saw 10 pound Strats and 12 pound Les Pauls in those days.
I am sure that Nitro ages better than Poly and is easier to repair. I am also sure that it is easier to do a 4 hour gig with a 7 pound guitar rather than an 8 pound guitar. So regardless of the affect on tone, I prefer Nitro finished guitars that are lightweight.
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I have never owned a 175 but they all sound like varying degrees of really good to great ( in clips ) to my ears. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
What are the chances of the New One
'opening up' resonance -wise and being a
real Tone Machine...that you will not sell ?
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I have found brand new Gibson laminate guitars take about 5 years to really open up. My 2010 sounded dead when new. Now it sings.
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Some of us old fossils here might not be sure we even HAVE five years! As we get older, maybe there is sense in buying used! No time for a break-in period! Originally Posted by vinnyv1k
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Being a "heavy " example, my new one sounds acoustically dead compared to my 63 and my 97, both of which are way lighter. Putting a wood saddle on helped quite a bit (and the pinned bridge intonates perfectly with a wood saddle BTW). Time might also help. I am not sure how much laminate tops open up, but all wood changes over time so who knows? Originally Posted by vinnyv1k
I am adapting to the thicker neck and the 7 pound 10 oz. guitar is still within my comfort range. Soon I will replace the factory round wounds with TI flats (I always try rounds on every new guitar to: a) hear what it sounds like with strings that are not dead and b) remind myself how much better I like flats than rounds).
If I like this guitar after a few months of gigging with her, she will get a strap pin in the heel and the Grover buttons will be replaced with Keystone buttons. For me, a Gibson headstock without Keystone buttons is simply covered in wrong sauce (except on the low end models).
She might be a keeper (time will tell) and I am quite glad to have bought a brand new blonde 175 for under $2300.
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You must remember a new laminate is water logged during construction. My 2010 is much lighter now than when new.
My Tal is a 2014. It is getting sweeter every year. Most don't buy into this with plywood but as they dry out they get better and lighter just like a carved axe does. Plywood just takes a bit longer. They still get better with time IMO.
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Perhaps, but some of us just want to hang in their long enough to call dibs on 1 of Vinny's fine collection! And I hope that's a long time yet to come! Yes sirree! Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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Excellent point Lawson. In three weeks its 70 for me. I'm at the stage where I placed a note in the case pocket of each guitar estimating the value so my kids don't sell them at a yard sale for $10 or so.Originally posted by Lawson-Stone:
Some of us old fossils here might not be sure we even HAVE five years! As we get older, maybe there is sense in buying used! No time for a break-in period!
Tony D.
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Ha ha! My wife & I are sitting on the front porch this evening and she says "can't I just stick your guitars out by the curb when you die, or give them away or something?" I very calmly tried to explain to her that there might be a few thousand $$$ if she took one or two to a local guitar shop or even a pawn shop . . . Originally Posted by pilotony
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Tony, that is a great idea. After I heard that Patrick did that, I did that with mine. Each note tells my wife/children what I am in the guitar and an estimate of value. I have also explained to them that values fluctuate and that my value estimates may be different than what the market will bear at the time of my passing. Originally Posted by pilotony
I don't want them to need therapy thinking they left money on the table.
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No doubt bro. Originally Posted by vinnyv1k
I remember early this past year, I took the Tal to an open mic night and after 2 hours of playing Nile Rodgers and Eric Gale like rhythm, that guitar opened up, wide. It was a different guitar after that. I’m not sure it was me, or the guitar that came alive but the guitar has been better ever since. Best thing you can do with a new laminate, is play it.
Joe D
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Last night I decided to ditch the factory Gibson roundwound strings and installed a set of TI 13 flats. Woah! What a difference in tone. When I first got the guitar, I thought it was a bit overly bright. I knew that some of that was the TOM (I hate TOM's on an archtop. They do brighten the tone and add some metallic overtones) and replaced the TOM with a rosewood saddle.
The difference in tone with the TI's is dramatic. The Gibson strings are very bright and tinny sounding. Now the guitar is warm and fat. Played through my Polytone/RE rig, this guitar now has the classic Joe Pass tone in spades (Joe used 13 flats). And I love that tone.
I did have to adjust the trussrod after installing the new strings. I was happy that the trussrod is fully functional.
With my adapting to the the chunky neck and getting the tone dialed in, I am thinking that this guitar could stick around for quite awhile. Perhaps long enough to find out if I have the same long term experience as Vinny. My "twelve step program for guitar" is in serious danger. These CME deals have provided me with two wonderful Gibsons. When Gibson gets it right, there is no guitar that can touch them. Why any guitarist would buy anything else for jazz, when these CME deals can still be had is beyond me. I am 2 for 2 with the CME Gibson floor model program. Time for me to go out, swing through the trees and beat my chest.
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I sent back three guitars to CME. The first was a cherry 339 with severely bent bridge posts; the next was a faded light burst 335 with mildly bent posts but very heavy and dull sounding; the last was a burst 175 that was gorgeous but had an obvious fret buzz at the 11th and 12th frets (which probably could have been taken care of by a tech - I'm not equipped to evaluate whether it's a fret issue or a neck hump or twist), but also sounded very dead in the lower register.
CME took them all back with absolutely no problem. They asked me what qualities were important to me (and, of course, I told them that almost everything was important). They then recommended that they pull one for me and inspect it before I get the next one shipped. So they did, and last night was my first ever. . .
NGDx2!!!
They sent me a gorgeous Sunset Burst ES-339 that, as far as I can tell so far, is absolutely flawless and was a virtual steal at the price I paid with the additional 15% off.
They also sent me a figured natural 175 that's a LITTLE on the heavy side, but manageable, and seems to be as close to perfect as I need a guitar to be. I'm still tweaking the setup and want to check the truss rod. Then I'll flip the neck pickup ring and replace the truss rod cover with a historic one I have, and vacuum the sawdust (???) out of the case. It's what I'd call mildly flamed but that's good enough.
I'll post some pics in a separate thread for you to check out, but I feel the trial-and-error has proven to be a worthwhile investment in time (and that's really the only investment) and I now have two phenomenal examples for basically better-than-used prices. I'll echo what others have said; when you find one that they got right, it's magnificent.
There's Only One Jeep, and there's Only One ES-175.
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My 175 is a little on the heavy side, but manageable, the flame is mild, but good enough and I too had to vacuum out the case. And there is only one ES-175 (but I now own three of them!) Congrats on yours! Originally Posted by Fusionshred
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Lol ! Long ago I had a Gibson J50 Acoustic which was a very good Guitar and sounded Good with Others playing Martins because the Gibson was fairly dark sounding..thicker top wood or heavy bracing ( ? ) . Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Every Martin smoked it - and it never really broke in .
Martins are like a Steinway Piano and the J50 was like a muted polite Baldwin Piano.
I noticed the first year mostly on Acoustics getting louder and more sensitive...but 5 years ...is a looooong time to wait.
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Agreed, my Tal is a 2013 and the tone also seems to have improved , now almost approaching Originally Posted by vinnyv1k
L5 quality. I have reverted to using Monster Cables in lieu of Van Damme with neutrik jacks
there is a perceived further improvement unless i'm mistaken. Does anyone disagree ?
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Interesting story to me. I play a Gibson J-45 custom weekly with a handful of Martin players and it always does a nice job of standing out -- mostly because it has a sweet top end I think. Also, I have a wonderful Martin D-28 -- but it tends to get buried in the mix . . . with the rest of the Martin/Steinways. So I've been leaning toward the J-45 as a better standout. Curious Originally Posted by Robertkoa
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