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10-23-2017 11:25 PM
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I'm going to be in the Bay Area in two weeks, and I'm planning to check it out.
If it's still there, I'll be happy to report.
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That D'Angelico sounds very nice.....very nice indeed.
I look forward to your review.
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I was making a lot of phone calls yesterday when that '57 ES175 deal fell through.
I did talk to Joe at Archtop.com about an older Epi Emperor Regent Deluxe, and we swapped cigar stories.
Once all that was done I asked him about the D'A at Gryphon - he sang his praises of what standup people they still are.
But he hadn't seen the guitar or the ad.
I say STILL because for over 15 years I worked less than a mile from them and was in Draper's on California Ave and the Gryphon store at least once a week... It's a far cry from a GC store, it feels more scholarly there, more about acoustic and music lessons. More in line with a store near Stanford University intellectually... So I asked Joe and he said that Gryphon had one of the best guitar repair staffs in the country, he specifically mentioned Frank Ford - he said if Frank repaired the neck then I'd be golden, that neck wouldn't be going anywhere. I was really considering the guitar.
So I called Gryphon and talked to one person a bit about it, then asked to talk to someone in repair about it's condition. I got Frank Ford who took a lot of time from his repair work to give me a thorough in hand estimation. He told me that the guitar came to Gryphon in it's current state - all they did was install the replica pick guard and tailpiece.
Frank confirmed there are breaks on both sides. I asked him, do you think the headstock was actually dangling the break being so bad, he said no, it's just got cracks on both sides. It also has been refretted (at least once) and that in the process corners of the block inlays were slightly lost (this guy really has a good eye for detail). It's had binding replacement along the fingerboard and of course was refinished.
So I asked him to hand me off to someone who I could negotiate with about the price considering all I now knew. I got someone else, also incredibly cordial, and we spoke at length. Bottom line is the guitar is on consignment and has been in the store and online only about 10 days. Photos were posted in a Jazz Guitar group on Facebook and they got a few people inquiring about it and asking for in hand descriptions. So they were going to contact the seller and find out what his best price was... I wait to hear back.
Being that it's only been there 10 days and is getting calls I would guess the seller's not that hungry yet, probably not interested in budging on the price. Take into consideration it's on consignment so Gryphon takes their piece of the selling price. When I find out I'll update you all. At the end of the day I didn't feel so lucky doing business and thanked them for their time...
I think if you really have to own a D'A and don't mind all the work and repairs and replacement parts that at some point it might be a decent deal (like in the 6.5k price range). It sure sounds pretty in the video... For some of us common folk this guitar is about as close to owning a D'A as we'll get - refin and all. Joe at Archtop.com said D'A didn't really make blonde guitars until after 1940 when Gibson was cranking out blonde L5s and such.
I hope this information is of help to you guys.
BigLast edited by BigMikeinNJ; 10-24-2017 at 08:48 AM.
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God the headstock on that guitar is the most elegant I've ever seen.
I'm not sure if its the camera angle but the radius on the fretboard seems to be more curved than normal.
I still say, since the guitar was badly damaged and it has issues, it could be restored better and it could be the keystone to anyones collection. If I had the money I would absolutely try to make it sparkle. It would go right to Chris Mirabella. What would you rather have a "Master Built" DA for 12,000 or a real D'Angelico that was made by the legend that is renewed to last another 80 years? For a total of $9,000.
For some reason this guitar has me thinking crazy thoughts.. You would get this guitar back from Chris and when you open the case you would have a hard time containing yourself.
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Here's a link to Gryphon's photo array for the guitar. As I said very nice people there, the atmosphere is more like that of a library (quiet) than say Guitar Center's usual din...
1942 D'Angelico Guitar Style B - Guitar - Gryphon Stringed Instruments
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It's mighty pretty, and sure sounds great!
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I sort of am doing a ( mental ) chart of the yay's vs nays....... The sound is a good plus, and the look is better - or at least fits it for sure.....' is a good match ' for the general condition.............
I think the kicker may be the refinish cost and what they guy thinks it's now worth...I can see his point - making the case that a natural Super 400 or L-5 is worth another ' x ' over any year burst......
...but maybe for we D'A aficionado's, that particular instrument never needed to be a blonde.....so then his price is a little high, just because it now has a ( needless ? ) refinish.....
........but I'd feel good -if I got it or lost it - knowing that there's some friendly & knowledgeable guys at that store whose word is worth something !......
....good luck !!!
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I go to Gryphon several times a year when I'm visiting my son at Stanford and it is a great place to check out guitars. Right now I wish that guitar was in back in September, I'm sure it will be gone by the time I get back down there. They are usually pretty firm on consignment prices though. I'd think that guitar would stay there for months before they talked to the owner about a lower price because someone will want it in that neighborhood.
I'd say the pricing there is fair, you aren't going to feel you got a screaming deal or ripped off. For sure the repair staff is very knowledgeable but some of the floor staff isn't really up about archtops and amps. Most of the gear is centered around flatops, banjos, mandolins and nylons with enough of everything else to make it fun to explore. The best thing is the atmosphere and the hands on approach they have. If you want to try a guitar they'll encourage you to try several. Last time I was there I finally got to play a Hofner Jazzica and was well pleased.
I should correct myself on the good deal end though. Every now and then there is a bargain. I'm still kicking myself about a 60s Byrdland and a Ibanez Joe Pass.
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As a DA owner (3 of them) who has studied the market quite well, I would say this guitar is priced at the high end of its value. IMO, the range is 6500-8500. It is not like you can find a players grade DA every day of the week.
John D'Angelico put the same workmanship into a Style B as he did an Excel or New Yorker. The only difference is a lower grade of cosmetic appointnents.
IMO, his guitars are without peer.
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Gryphon's Frank Ford is a guitar repair legend. I've seen some of his work on pre-war Martins and it is amazing what he can do. He even worked his magic on my lowly GB10.
Frank Ford - Gryphon Stringed Instruments
That being said, I'd still avoid buying such a high end archtop without personally checking it at the shop...especially if repairs have been disclosed.
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The owner isn't getting the high end of the range because of the commission of course. Now if we could get their black book of the owners names.....
Originally Posted by Stringswinger
Of course if they aren't there getting commissions we lose a fabulous place to check out guitars. If it stays there into the winter there may be some concessions.
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The owner is getting as much (or more) after the commission as he/she probably would selling it on Reverb or EBay and has a better chance of finding a top dollar customer (Many folks are understandably afraid of buying a high end guitar from a private party. Gryphon has a sterling reputation).
If you buy from a top drawer retailer, you will pay top dollar, but you are getting the guarantee of dealing with a reputable business.
I predict that this guitar will sell for more than $6500. It is rare. It sounds great. It is beautiful. And for those of us who have not hit it big in the high tech world, it is doable. Try finding a real D'Angelico for less.
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I understand everyone's price driven excitement over this guitar - and its certainly a fine looking and great sounding DA.
But - should you guys pursue this purchase just please be prepared to accept the cumulative condition Issues which are quite numerous.
I Just don't want anyone to have buyers remorse, or conversely
be a buzz kill - just think it through carefully and don't pay too much.
Just my two cents
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If only that git could talk...
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I'm not in the running. I'm months out and pretty careful when I do go in there. I had to tell them to quit trying to hand me a prewar L5 once. There is only so much torment anybody should have to handle.
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You only live once. Go get it BM!
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True Dat Man... Originally Posted by QAman
Me I have no trouble dating bottle blondes or being married to them (LOL), but if I'm gonna spring for a DA it's gonna be a totally stock blonde, probably a Excel from the later 40s... and it won't be no $8500.00. Probably 2 1/2 times that - then I'd sell some lesser guitars (Byrdland, Hamiltone, HDA, Triggs New Yorker) and hang up my spurs.
This place is fomenting a feeding frenzy over this guitar, anyone with the pockets to do it, take your time because if you buy it you would have a hard time selling it... Don't get too sucked up in the hype. Do what I did, grab a cigar, go sit on the porch smoking it and reflect on how great your life already is... We all have so much gear. The GAS really is getting heavy around here.
Big
Good luck fellas....
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Very wise advice BigMike - Originally Posted by BigMikeinNJ
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Just for comparison - during one of the last Guernsey auctions a very nice period correct style A ( lot 246) sold for $6000 plus buyers premium of 25%($1500), for a total investment of $7500.
This was a beautiful guitar -ok not a style B - but no laundry list of valuation killers such replaced hardware, exposed tuner holes , thinned out inlays , cleats , neck breaks , refin , replaced binding etc etc. I'll stop now.
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Someone made a great buy on that Style A.....It is worth much more.
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I agree with QAman. There are a fair number of issues with that guitar. I owned a 1939 Style B that was professionally refinished, but had no other issues. I eventually sold the guitar for less than I had paid for it 10 years earlier. I always feel that it is better to spend the extra money for a guitar in original condition. You will pay more, but it will be much easier to sell if you decide to. A really good refin is one thing, but a headstock repair is a deal breaker for me. Originally Posted by QAman
Keith
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