Very early pics of Pat Metheny's Gibson ES-175

[Stbatz]

It seems that the 175 Methenys underwent several metamorphoses through its long history, here with two mics and an unusual position for the toggle switch
Does anyone here know the history of the this guitar?

[dconeill]

See history of Metheny's guitar here

[Stbatz]

Cool,thanks!

[rio]

Interesting. I had read most of that from other sources but didn't know that he had the hole with the duct tape fixed. I always found it interesting that not only did he not want to change anything but not even have the frets worked on - considering that he cut the hole in it, it isn't like it hasn't seen any changes. I also wonder if he still has flats on it since he now uses round wounds on his Ibanez.


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[cosmic gumbo]

Here's an even earlier picture of his guitar.

[Stbatz]

Where is the toothbrush?

[blille]

Where is the toothbrush?

Tailpiece




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[docbop]

What I read was the guitar originally was a single PUP 175 then the second PUP added and why the toggle switch isn't in the traditional position. Then all the touring was taking a toll on the guitar and endorsements he retired it from the road. Checking Pat's guitars in the DVD's over the past few years you can see all his guitars have their share of issues from touring.

[MaxTwang]

Uhhhh... file Metheny's shirt in the 1st post under "Things you can't unsee".


Metheny's brilliant at image and marketing. That may be a great old guitar but that guitar and all its idiosyncrasies became part of the image and mystique, like the stripped shirts and his hair. Kinda nice that he can back it up with some incredible chops, great writing and the ability to make odd time signatures sound natural to a wide audience (anybody want to play the counting game with First Circle?).

[lawson-stone]

I think Metheny looks like the young Mark Hamill/Luke Skywalker in those pics.

[lawson-stone]

Uhhhh... file Metheny's shirt in the 1st post under "Things you can't unsee".


Metheny's brilliant at image and marketing. That may be a great old guitar but that guitar and all its idiosyncrasies became part of the image and mystique, like the stripped shirts and his hair. Kinda nice that he can back it up with some incredible chops, great writing and the ability to make odd time signatures sound natural to a wide audience (anybody want to play the counting game with First Circle?).

Funny how First Circle opens with clapping the tempo... maybe they had to do that to play it!

[docbop]

Uhhhh... file Metheny's shirt in the 1st post under "Things you can't unsee".


Metheny's brilliant at image and marketing. That may be a great old guitar but that guitar and all its idiosyncrasies became part of the image and mystique, like the stripped shirts and his hair. Kinda nice that he can back it up with some incredible chops, great writing and the ability to make odd time signatures sound natural to a wide audience (anybody want to play the counting game with First Circle?).

I imagine that was a big part of what he learned from Gary Burton. Same as Herbie Hancock credits much of his financial and long career success to the things Donald Byrd taught him. Most the Jazz musicians who have had long career can name the person who mentored them on the business side of music.

[SierraTango]

I imagine that was a big part of what he learned from Gary Burton. Same as Herbie Hancock credits much of his financial and long career success to the things Donald Bird taught him. Most the Jazz musicians who have had long career can name the person who mentored them on the business side of music.

Donald Byrd (note correct spelling) was a friend and mentor to me. I met him later in his career when I worked at the Sound Factory. Also was privileged to be on a record with him. He was a great educator and was always open to teaching. It was through him that I became fascinated with the possibilities and tonality of a guitar and trumpet duo, and I still gig in that format.
One very cool cat-RIP Donald.

[Cunamara]

There were some podcast interviews I heard with Pat Metheny (via Apple, probably still out there) in which he talked about learning how to run a band from Gary Burton- musical, personnel and business sides. By Metheny's admission he is a perfectionist and a bit of a control freak (e.g., for the PMG he chooses the drummer's drums and cymbals, for example)- his name is on the band and everything has to sound the way he wants it to sound. He must not be a tyrant, though, given how long people play in his band with him. He also speaks very highly of the musicians he works with. Metheny pushes himself, too- famously he is at the venue warming up for two hours before the gig. I warm up for about 5 minutes before the gig... I think there may be a reason or two that Metheny is so much better than I will ever be, and it's not just natural talent...

He also mentioned that Burton would grill him after gigs, even to the level of detail like "in the 5th bar of your solo on XXX you played an Eb. Is that what you meant to do?" Burton was also very specific about setting limits on Metheny's solos, at least at first. He credited Burton wth helping him develop into the player he became- he didn't just hire Metheny as a side man, he educated him and shaped him as a musician. This is something I think is a rare opportunity in these latter days of jazz, compared to the old days of touring bands and 200 one-nighters a year. We've got to learn do this in ways that are different than they used to be, for better or for worse.

There were also some very interesting Gary Burton interviews amongst the podcasts.

[Cavalier]

This is a recent interview that covers those formative days.

[MaxTwang]

Funny how First Circle opens with clapping the tempo... maybe they had to do that to play it!

Here's a Master's Thesis on The First Circle from a student at the University of Melbourne. Table 1, pg. 40, lays out the time signatures.

http://www.stuartgreenbaum.com/downl...cle-thesis.pdf

I suppose the PMG could provide the audience with a copy so the audience could fully appreciate the Metheny/Mays' writing and skill of the performers ... but Metheny seems content with letting people just enjoy the performance.

[BigMikeinNJ]

Only photos I have of the old 175 are from the Parallel Realities show at Paul Masson Winery (that is what it was called then) from June 1990. I had tickets for two nights in a row. about 15th row right off the center aisle. You were allowed to bring in an SLR camera if it did NOT have a flash attachment. I borrowed one. Also allowed to shoot photos during the first 3 tunes, while it was light out. I was there super early both nights. Got in when the gates open. When Pat's tech Carolyn put his gear out I walked up close and shot this picture and some others of his gear (there was a rack of guitars, mostly synths and one Ovation classical). At the time he had his Roland GR300 box on the floor, a Zoom and some other 1990 era stuff at his "station" on the stage. Amazing shows. During the show I stood up and got one shot of him BLOWING on a solo. It was great seeing him as a sideman with Herbie Hancock, Jack Dejonette and Dave Holland.
Gotta say I love George Bensons shows and I saw Hendrix, Joplin and the Beatles and countless other amazing groups. But for JAZZ this was really about as close to Nirvana as you ge


The sticker on the top of the guitar in between the pickup/taped areas says NEW KIDS ON THE BLOCI. The bridge is taped in place for quick string swaps (I asked once) and it had oodles of duct tape holding it together... It was B Fugly but he made it SING... Notice the bound headstock ??

t.

[Woody Sound]

Here's an even earlier picture of his guitar.

But even earlier yet, when luthiers still had easy pickins of choice woods:

[docbop]

Here's an even earlier picture of his guitar.

We have to wait awhile for Orville Gibson to grow up and start a guitar company.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Uhhhh... file Metheny's shirt in the 1st post under "Things you can't unsee".


Metheny's brilliant at image and marketing. That may be a great old guitar but that guitar and all its idiosyncrasies became part of the image and mystique, like the stripped shirts and his hair. Kinda nice that he can back it up with some incredible chops, great writing and the ability to make odd time signatures sound natural to a wide audience (anybody want to play the counting game with First Circle?).

Ain't nothing wrong with a brotha making a living playing his ass off -- no matter how he dresses.

/Inb4 KISS comments