Cabs: Do they matter?

**NSJ** · 04-13-2017, 05:55 PM

I ask not knowing much about this. The only cab I have is my Henricksen 1x 10, that goes with my Henriksen head.

The only reason I still have these I was unable to sell or trade them.

Does a cab matter or is it, as they, all in the head? How much effect does speaker choice make in a jazz amp? If consequential, is there a recommended speaker to go with a stand-alone cab?

That said, what's the best stand alone cab for jazz amps/jazz guitars?

**sgosnell** · 04-13-2017, 06:03 PM

This is a deep subject, and subject to hot and intense debate. There are long threads here about speakers and cabinets, and combos. It seems the consensus is that yes, the speaker has a large effect, just as it does in a combo, but the best is entirely subjective. IMO the best standalone cabinet for jazz is Raezer's Edge. Not everyone agrees with me, of course, and perhaps not even the majority. In the end, it's the cabinet that sounds best to you, and only your ears can, or should, be the judge.

**Stringswinger** · 04-13-2017, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by sgosnell

This is a deep subject, and subject to hot and intense debate. There are long threads here about speakers and cabinets, and combos. It seems the consensus is that yes, the speaker has a large effect, just as it does in a combo, but the best is entirely subjective. IMO the best standalone cabinet for jazz is Raezer's Edge. Not everyone agrees with me, of course, and perhaps not even the majority. In the end, it's the cabinet that sounds best to you, and only your ears can, or should, be the judge.

+1 on the Raezer's Edge being the best cabinet for Jazz

**mr. beaumont** · 04-13-2017, 06:17 PM

I a/b'd Raezers and Redstone, ended up buying Redstone. Both were great, Redstone had better bass thump in their 8", that was the deal.

Sadly, out of biz...is anyone still making Raezers?

**christianm77** · 04-13-2017, 07:06 PM

Short answer - yes

Long answer

Speaker choice is very important. IMO you need something efficient above all.

I rate the eminence cannibas Rex and lil buddy speakers which are efficient, clean and have a dark sound (hemp) but I'm sure others have recommendations.

In terms of the cab itself, well I have less knowledge but I understand players can be particular about that too.

Also whether you have open or closed back is a big deal.

**Stringswinger** · 04-13-2017, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

I a/b'd Raezers and Redstone, ended up buying Redstone. Both were great, Redstone had better bass thump in their 8", that was the deal.

Sadly, out of biz...is anyone still making Raezers?

Raezer's Edge is alive and well

Raezer's Edge - Speaker Cabinets for Guitar & Bass

**sgosnell** · 04-13-2017, 10:56 PM

The Raezer's Edge brand was purchased soon after Rich was killed, and has been in business ever since. Not the highest volume manufacturer, but volume != quality, nor value. Once upon a time, while Rich was still building them, his cabinets were the end-all and be-all of jazz cabs. I think the brand suffered a little after his death because the new owners didn't seem to be as active and well-known in the industry. Rich got around, and knew everyone.

**mr. beaumont** · 04-13-2017, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by Stringswinger

Raezer's Edge is alive and well

Raezer's Edge - Speaker Cabinets for Guitar & Bass

Good to hear. Wasn't there an affiliation with Jeff hale''s shop for a while? Jeff unfortunately sort of fell off the map. It was his place where I was able to compare the raezer and the redstone.

**Stringswinger** · 04-13-2017, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

Good to hear. Wasn't there an affiliation with Jeff hale''s shop for a while? Jeff unfortunately sort of fell off the map. It was his place where I was able to compare the raezer and the redstone.

Jeff Hale bought the brand and all the tooling and designs from the Raezer family after Rich's death. Jeff retired a few years ago and sold Raezer's Edge to his shop foreman who runs it to this day as a one man operation, much as Rich did in the early days.

**oldane** · 04-14-2017, 04:19 AM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

I a/b'd Raezers and Redstone, ended up buying Redstone. Both were great, Redstone had better bass thump in their 8", that was the deal.

Sadly, out of biz...is anyone still making Raezers?

+1 for Redstone cabs. I have a 10" and have no plans of getting rid of it anytime soon. It sounds fine with both an AI and a Mambo head and it's rugged and roadworthy. They (at least the 10") have a more tight bass end than RE, making the bass notes better defined, but some may say they lose a bit depth as compared to RE. They were also priced favorably, considering it was a high quality handassembled product. If I remember correctly, I paid around $500 including shipping to Europe, customs and VAT (25%). And yes, they shut down the business after only a few meager years and the total production was not big (rumours say around 300 cabinets), so they may be hard to find on the used market. But if an opportunity presents itself, by all means grab it.

**Frank67** · 04-14-2017, 05:49 AM

Marshall claims that 90% of the sound is coming from the cab itself. I don't know about that, but the same speaker, say vintage 30, sounds very different in different cabs. Obviously closed vs open matters a lot too.

**jorgemg1984** · 04-14-2017, 06:26 AM

I use a digital rig and changing IRs (cab / speaker / mics snapshots) changes the sound A LOT. They really matter.

**mad dog** · 04-14-2017, 06:51 AM

Yes. Everything matters. I've had some really good cabs, and some really not so good ones. Wish I could say exactly what reliably makes them good or bad. I tend to prefer pine, and open back cabs.

Even trickier with speakers. The speaker that sounds best in cab A may be nothing special in cab B. I just keep trying stuff until I find something that works. Which right now are two: A not too big 1x12 ported, closed back cab that came with my Pure 64 Mean Streets head, with a ceramic speaker of their design. Huge sound. And a pine 12+10 cab from Pinetone loaded with WGS G12C, G10C.
MD

**vernon** · 04-14-2017, 08:57 AM

Yes, cabs greatly impact guitar tone... at least as much as the amp. As has been said, Redstone and Raezer's Edge are fantastic jazz speaker cabs. No doubt about it. Between the two I liked the Redstone a bit better. Then... I took a chance and bought a used Buscarino Chameleon 8" cab. I've been playing through it for several months and find it to be even a couple of notches above the RE and Redstone. Really! I sold the Stealth 10 and the Redstone 8 about a month ago. The Buscarino stays.

**konstantine** · 04-16-2017, 06:01 AM

Cabs and speakers are very important IMO as their impact in tone is sometimes greater than some of the other elements that we can get easier obsessed with.

**Mellow-G** · 04-16-2017, 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by vernon

Yes, cabs greatly impact guitar tone... at least as much as the amp. As has been said, Redstone and Raezer's Edge are fantastic jazz speaker cabs. No doubt about it. Between the two I liked the Redstone a bit better. Then... I took a chance and bought a used Buscarino Chameleon 8" cab. I've been playing through it for several months and find it to be even a couple of notches above the RE and Redstone. Really! I sold the Stealth 10 and the Redstone 8 about a month ago. The Buscarino stays.

Hi Vernon
Do you know which model of Redstone 8's & 10's you preferred for Archtop and do you know the actual speakers they used.

**Naquat** · 04-16-2017, 07:47 AM

I agree that there are differences in speakers and cabinets especially if it's a closed back cabinet because they need to be designed around a specific speaker.

The differences also become more obvious when one is able to A/B cabinets. Not to belittle any one company but there's a saying "No high's, No low's.....must be.....". Well I had one of these PA speakers an did an A/B comparison with two different speakers and the difference was not only obvious but I was a bit surprised that the "saying" was very accurate, at least to my ears.

The bottom line, as many have said, is the cab that you like but, recommendations can give you direction.

**vernon** · 04-16-2017, 02:39 PM

Mellow-G... I had an RS 10 (not ported) and an RS 8 (ported). My fav with archtops was the 8" ported. I never took the backs off to investigate the speakers however... some other forum members might be privy to such information. The RS 8 had a nice open top end in addition to a pretty full rich tone. Raezer's Edge Stealth 10 (to my ear) has a smokier slightly covered jazz tone... if you're going for that sound, it's got it.

**coolvinny** · 04-17-2017, 05:46 PM

Cabs definitely matter, but what's 'best' depends on your overall set-up and playing situation.

I've never tried the Redstone cabs, but I'm really happy with my Raezer's Edge 6 (you'd never guess it was just a 6" speaker from hearing it) which was designed with heavy input from Michael Biller at Sound Island.

I also have a RE JG10 which is kind of heavy for a 10" (29 lbs) but it can be oriented vertically or horizontally for different sound signatures, so is almost like two cabs in one. Very useful in big band where sometimes I want a more acoustic vibe for chunking it out (vertical cab orientation for this) on Basie type charts

**ronjazz** · 04-18-2017, 08:22 PM

Bose Compact. Subwoofer in amp section, line array extends above your head slightly, sends the sound throughout the room without the directionality of cabinets. Also light and easy to work, but needs a preamp of some sort, because the Bose is clinical-sounding, great for a miced flamenco guitar, but electric needs the dirt and colors of a guitar amp. I use Digitech or Zoom or Korg or Boss pedals with great success after tweaking a bit, and a $50 ART tube mic preamp warms everything right up if you favor a tube sound.You can actually make a preamp rig that can be carried in the pocket of most gig bags.

**Hammertone** · 04-19-2017, 01:39 AM

Nothing wrong with smaller cabs, but I prefer the sound of larger cabs, so long as I don't need to move them myself, or they are manageable in size and weight. Here are a few of each for your amusement:

One of my faves is a custom-built, open back, Stone Age cab, loaded with a 15" Altec 418B from an old Standel. Not too heavy, not too big - it's slightly smaller (15"x23"x23") than an Ampeg B-15S cab (15 3/4"x24"x26").

Of course, compact comes in handy as well. Here's the same head on a small 1x15" speaker cab (that used to be a craptastic, rear-ported Traynor SS bass combo amp). Nice little mini-me half-stack. The amp got tossed years ago but the plywood box is light and robust. The speaker is an underbuilt POS but still emits a decent enough sound. - I'll eventually replace it with an extended range old JBL K-130, Altec 418B, or a Weber copy. Anyone have one for sale? It's sitting on an Ampeg V-4 4x12" cab, which makes a dandy endtable.

Still, my favourite for sound quality is a nice 4x12" cab, but I don't use them for gigs - too much of a PITA. The TV is long gone but the rig is in the same spot I put it on the day I got it.

Here's another one that doesn't get moved, paired with Polytone's stupidest amp, the "Barely Works" - sounds glorious but too damned heavy:

This one does get moved when called for on louder gigs - an Ampeg VT-22 2x12" front-ported cab. These were offered by Ampeg for @five minutes as matching cabs for the Ampeg V-2 head. Very practical size and weight with normal speakers. This one has the optional Altecs (and has had the grille cloth replaced) to make it less practical.

Of course for really compact I use an early '80s Polytone 80 watt BabyBrute 8" combo. The teeny cab is a massive compromise in the name of weight and portability, but it gets plenty of use. For even MORE compact I use an Eden 5" combo, built in the early 1970's in Massachusetts, and still going strong. It puts out @20 watts-4 ohms/40 watts-2 ohms - here's a terrible shot of the back, and a partial front shot. I built a matching cab for it many years ago that's around somewhere. I've installed speaker cut switches on both of these little amps to be able to use them as heads, which significantly extends their utility. If anyone knows anything about the Eden amp, I'd love to know more:

Here's a compact open-back 1x12" cab with a matching head. Some guy in Minneapolis said he was going to buy it, but now he won't even return my emails. Sheesh, some people. Whatever, I've decided to keep it because it matches the jumpsuit I wear when I gig.