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Hello!
Just acquired this guitar, it is said to be from between 1972-1976. Anyone know anything about it or seen one like it? No serial number...
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02-15-2017 03:04 PM
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I wouldn't call it a "lawsuit" guitar. Though that term has a bit of flexibility, it normally denotes Japanese made copies of Gibson guitars that looked so much like Gibsons that they triggered a lawsuit. The headstock specifically was a point of contention. But this guitar has a very different headstock, very different tailpiece. Still, if it's really from the 1970's and MiJ, it's likely a nice guitar. Just as Gibson was going through a low ebb in perceived quality, the Japanese luthiers brought their own tradition of fine woodworking together with factory economics to produce some really splendid guitars. If this is one of them, you have something really nice. Even if not, it could still be an excellent guitar. I never hear anything negative about Ibanez from any period.
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definately post lawsuit. it's a 2616cs from1976
the 175 copy is the 2355, different model
the maxon super 70s are a bit hotter than PAFs (super 58s on the other hand are very close to PAFs)
excellent guitar and should be good value for money
try posting on ibanez collectors worldf forum for more infoLast edited by Ray175; 02-15-2017 at 03:23 PM.
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Thanks for the replies! Nice link to the catalogue!
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Yes the "Castle" headstock shape, embossed Super 70s, star inlays. Nice guitar, neck probably a bit slim but fast and comfortable. Good value. Stop using the term Lawsuit, if it had the Gibson open book shape at the top of the headstock then it might qualify to be called that. This was when Ibanez was pulling away (as in a race pulling away) from doing Gibson copies. And there was no lawsuit, only the threat of a lawsuit, but as I said Ibanez was already starting to pull away from Gibson cloning by doing guitars like the Ibanez GB10, the 335 copy that eventually became the AS200, the AR300s. All great stuff.
Enjoy !!
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Interesting 'lawsuit' reading...
WHAT IS UP WITH THAT LAWSUIT?
Ibanez "Lawsuit Era" Les Paul Custom Copy
A Brief History of Ibanez Guitars: From Importer to Industry | Reverb
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Wasn't there some kind of cease-and-desist order made against Ibanez?
Originally Posted by BigMikeinNJ
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Yes, and more specifically on the headstock shape - by the time the desist order had been placed the headstock had already moved to a Guild shape, but no lawsut from them..... go figure
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This model is a little closer to a Gibson ES-175.
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Both of these pictures are from the same 1975 Ibanez catalog. So, if you want to call your guitar from the same time period as the open book headstock that looked like a Gibson headstock, you are correct. Your guitar may indeed be older not later, than my 2355 I posted above. You can't make it out, but my 2355 is a 1976 and does NOT have the open book headstock.
Last edited by icr; 02-15-2017 at 05:42 PM.
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Now that we've beat the fleas off that horse how do you like the way it plays and sounds ?? Back in the mid 80s I was on a Pat Metheny jag and wanted a 175 and a GR303 like Pat had. Found one a lot like yours - it had a lot of flame on the back and sides... Show us the backside, is there a VOLUTE by chance ??
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Not for the castle headstock shape, unless White Castle filed one...
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Haha! Yeah, it's a great sounding and great playing guitar. I bought (and part traded it for an old American traditional strat that has been lying around my closet for years) from a professional musician who sets up his own guitars, I really like the action. Lesson learned, won't call it law suit guitar (but law suit era) Originally Posted by BigMikeinNJ
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Here's a pic from the back! What's a volute?
Sent from my A0001 using TapatalkLast edited by mikee; 02-16-2017 at 03:43 AM.
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Mikee, "what's a volute?" See below. its the bit that transitions from the neck to headstock at the back of the guitar. It's supposed to add strength to the neck around the nut/headstock to reduce the risk of breaking. Hated by many and associated with the Norlin era of Gibson. I have no preference either way
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?I don't know if Gibson was the first (I think not) but during their skinny neck 60s phase they had a lot of guitars coming back for repair. Wintermoon could likely really fill you (and us) in on that bit of history. So they started putting the volute on the necks thinking it would solve that problem. And as Ray175 says that was the Norlin Gibson era. Now funny thing is Ibanez and others were copying Gibson pretty seriously and started putting volutes on also. And in the case of many models that debuted as original designs in the latter part of the 70s and are still going strong they have volutes. Can't stand them on those Norlin Gibsons (wouldn't likely own one) but don't even notice them on Ibanez.
Here's a 2005 Ibanez AWD102 (sort of a PRS hollow copy if you will) with a volute. Very nice guitar by the way. Notice the volute on this neck, most don't stretch out this long, this just flows with the shape of the headstock
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After playing it for a couple of weeks, I've got some things to add: Originally Posted by BigMikeinNJ
The neck feels a bit on the thin side for me. And the output on the neck pickup is slightly too high. I might experiment with lowering all pots when I've got a couple of hours to experiment. The bridge pickup is pretty much spot on (not that I use it that much) The sustain is amazing, compared it to my peerless Manhattan, and it's such a huge difference.
And what I've noticed more and more is that it generally feels like an expensive instrument. Or maybe I'm just fooled by the weight
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