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" Both sounded very dark and muddy. Lacking presence or chime"
there's a presence knob for that.
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06-19-2016 11:11 AM
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I don't find any lack of clarity or chime in my amp but it was fully serviced less than a year ago. I got a bag of 15 or so electrolytic caps and 5 or 6 resistors and the amp is real quite for such an old amp. I have herd comments like these but I think my amp tech put it best. He said these amps are cleaner than the tweeds but don't have the mid-scoop of the black face amps. And I can hear this compared to my 1964 Tremolux. Am currently testing the amp with a JBL D130F in a separate open back cab against the Jensen P15N and I really like the sound of each one but the Jensen gives the amp a bit more break up at a little lower volume. I did notice the Jensen was re-built by Orange County Speaker at one time The JBL has the orig. cone. I am exploring this amp with various guitars but it makes all of them sound great. I did notice that the power tubes are Mesa STR 402 6L6 so I bought a matched pair of NOS JAN Phillips 6L6WGB from a friend. I thought an amp like this deserves some better tubes but I am not so sure I will be able to tell the difference. Any one feel free to throw down any comments especially those of you with more tube experience than me.
Thanks John
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Do a side by side with a blackface or late 50s tweed. That's what I did and was disappointment every time. But again. Tone is a matter of taste. I've been building amps for 20 years and one thing I do like about the brown amps is the vibrato.
Presence does not affect the tone in a way that will change the overall character of the amp.
Can't argue that they are the sexiest off all though!Last edited by abelljo; 06-19-2016 at 11:56 AM.
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As I said I have a 1964 Tremolux and have several speaker cab with JBL's, Altecs, EVM's, English greenback and others. I haven't tried all the combinations but it nice to have the two speaker outputs on the amp. Do I need to worry about some of the cabs wired up 4 ohm for Tremolux and running them with the 8 ohm Pro?
I find the tone of the black face Tremolux and the Pro to be quite different but not as different as the tremolo! I don't know how to explain it but the Pro is very punchy and clear and the tone is thick and tubular. There is quite a difference between the stock Jensen and the JBL D130F as would be expected. With the JBL it is very clean while the Jensen definitely warm it up a bit. I haven't check the specs on the Jensen but would guess it is less efficient than the JBL. I wonder what the Utah speaker they used sounds like? Thanks JohnLast edited by powerwagonjohn; 06-19-2016 at 01:21 PM.
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I have a feeling those NOS 6L6WGB tubes are a great choice for your brown pro. I tried several different power tubes in my Pro, including a pair of old 6L6WGBs. They were sold to me as "ANOS", lightly used, but were clearly played out. Didn't sound good. A pair of NOS Tung Sol 5881s (not hugely different from the newer 6L6WGBs) did sound wonderful in that amp. As did a set of old RCA blackplates.
Speaker choice is even more personal, subject to personal taste. My Pro came to me with a reconed JBL D130. Which did have it's good points. But somehow, JBLs never quite work for me. I ended up with a Weber California ceramic with an aluminum dome. Allegedly JBL like, but not so much to my ears. Warmer.
If I still had that amp, I'd be trying an Altec Lansing 418b. Had always been curious about them. Just got one in great shape with the original cone, using it in a pine cab with an Allen Accomplice head. Hard to generalize, but it's probably the best sounding 15" ceramic speaker I've heard, out of many tried. Bet it would be great in a brown Pro too.
MD
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I have a set of Altec 417 in one of the cabs and really like the sound of them, especially with my hollow bodies. I also have a pair of JBL E120 and they are really brutal, very loud and clear The D130F are more polite so to speak.
Thanks John
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The 418b spec sheet says it's Alnico, which may explain why it sounds so good. IMO the Altec alnico speakers are the most balanced and satisfying of them all - or at least the 417H 12" is. I have never heard a better guitar speaker.
Originally Posted by mad dog
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man! you have a nice collection of classic vintage speakers there..wow..all the good ones!!
the reconed jensen is the least of them
i'd stick with alnico magnet..and even though fender amps are rugged and can run at mismatched impedence, i wouldnt run them long and hard that way...chance you'll take out a power tube and screen resistor and possibly even the transformer...as i said leo f built them right, but can happen..especially if power tubes are less than stellar
btw..just for info...orange county speaker is no more..they got bought out and dropped speaker repair...their ex head recone guy started up his own service co, but ocs is done
cheers
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Yea I heard OCS stopped repairing speakers but there shop guy is opening his own shop. I never dealt with them my self but I have heard nothing but good about them. I was into speakers for a while and was watching craigslist for them. I also have a cab with a pair of EVM 12's and another cab with a pair of 12" English Celestion green backs I have had a while. Old habit's die hard, I think I need to find a 15" Altec.
Thanks John
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I have a 418b for sale in the for sale forum. It works, but will need a recone for optimal performance. I had its partner reconed and it sounds fantastic. PM if interested. I can certainly be negotiable. Originally Posted by powerwagonjohn
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Yes I noticed your speaker for sale. What was the cost of a re-cone? I would guess you had it re-coned at Great Plains Audio.
Thanks John
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The pro I had was anything but dark. It had tons of high end and presence (and a presence knob ...), and I usually had the treble dialed down pretty far to avoid icepick-in-the-ear syndrome. Even within the same nominal model/tolex-color-era there are different circuits. Plus, in stuff this old there are often accretions of mods (deliberate and inadvertent), drifting of component values, etc. I've found it very difficult to generalize about eras of Fender. Stuff you thought would sound one way often sounds different. Originally Posted by abelljo
John
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I just wanted to bump this thread to thank all who encouraged me to buy the 1962 Fender Pro. It's been a little over 6 mo. now and I find this amp to be the best I have EVER OWNED. You guys certainly steered me in the right direction. I picked up a 2X15 cab at Music Go Round this summer and it was loaded with a pair of mid 1960's Jensen LMI Vibranto speakers with 6.5 Lb. alnico magnets. These are me new favorites. Thanks a million and I hope you all have a great new year.
JohnLast edited by powerwagonjohn; 01-07-2017 at 10:22 PM.
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John, Originally Posted by powerwagonjohn
Do you still have the amp? I'm looking for a cab for a 61 Pro chassis.
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Yes I still have the amp. Plus I bought a 1962 Vibrolux a couple years ago which is another fantastic amp. There are plenty of cabinet builders out there. My amp are not going anywhere. Have a great new year all. Thanks John
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