Speaker recommendation, 10" 8 Ohms

**s1track3d** · 05-30-2015, 12:21 PM

Hi,

I am looking for a smooth, dark, very efficient 10" 8 Ohms speaker for a 65W solid state amp. (Peavey studio pro 110)

Eminence used to have a Delta Demon model, 10" 8 Ohms - 100 Watts, however it is out of production.

Any recommendations of what to get instead? Any make and model welcome but again, I'm looking for something to help max out the volume of the amp while retaining desirable 'jazz' tones, i.e smooth and dark...

Thanks

**kris** · 05-30-2015, 12:35 PM

i use delta demon.. maybe Jensen...?

**Franz 1997** · 05-30-2015, 01:17 PM

Ragin' Cajun 10" is very efficient; not dark, but equally not too bright either. Strong midrange. 75w I think.

**Greentone** · 05-30-2015, 01:56 PM

Weber Ceramic Michigan 10. It is a 100-watt speaker. The Michigan series is Weber's tribute to the old SRO EV speakers, that were made in Buchanan, Michigan. The Weber speaker, like the SRO speakers, are loud, uncolored, and pretty neutral. They aren't bright--like the old JBL speakers (or, like the Weber "California" series speakers designed to replace the JBLs).

For a 100-watt amp that uses a 10-inch speaker, I would use the Weber. I have had great success with Weber speakers.

**hans halmackenreuter** · 05-30-2015, 02:15 PM

I use to have the same amp (teal strip) and I tried it with an eminence delta demon and it sounded not bad. I even tried it with my favorite 10" the copperhead, which suited a little better for my taste. I ended up staying with the speaker it already had, since it interacted better with the eq and if it's not broken, I don't see really a reason to swap speaker - but it would work and it wouldn't sound bad with an upgrade speaker. This amp is really versatile. The only thing I would really change is the heavey cab.

One thing you should keep in mind. make sure your amp is dead quit, otherwise an upgrade speaker might double the noise.

btw. it was the only amp in which I really enjoyed the spring reverbs - just beautiful. Normaly and don't like springs at all.

**marcwhy** · 05-30-2015, 02:35 PM

Check out: https://wgs4.com/g10c

**monkmiles** · 05-30-2015, 03:04 PM

I like the Eminence Lil Buddy for 10" speakers. Smooth, warm and can be dark. Pretty loud (99db sensitivity) but not over the top.

**Teddyfm** · 05-30-2015, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by hallpass

I like the Eminence Lil Buddy for 10" speakers. Smooth, warm and can be dark. Pretty loud (99db sensitivity) but not over the top.

Happy with my Lil Buddy too. Not too dark in my opinion. As you said, smooth and warm.

**ruger9** · 05-30-2015, 05:18 PM

Smooth and dark = hemp cone = Emi Lil Buddy, or check out Tone Tubby offerings.

**s1track3d** · 05-31-2015, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by hans halmackenreuter

I use to have the same amp (teal strip) and I tried it with an eminence delta demon and it sounded not bad. I even tried it with my favorite 10" the copperhead, which suited a little better for my taste. I ended up staying with the speaker it already had, since it interacted better with the eq and if it's not broken, I don't see really a reason to swap speaker - but it would work and it wouldn't sound bad with an upgrade speaker. This amp is really versatile. The only thing I would really change is the heavey cab.

One thing you should keep in mind. make sure your amp is dead quit, otherwise an upgrade speaker might double the noise.

btw. it was the only amp in which I really enjoyed the spring reverbs - just beautiful. Normaly and don't like springs at all.

teal strip, yeah, that's the one. I used to write it off as just a practice amp but apparently it's a bit of a sleeper and very capable. Last time I played it in a quartet rehearsal years ago, I remember it just didn't have enough to keep up, I was hoping that an efficient speaker would put it into the ballpark and it could be used in a light group setting. I agree, the cabinet is heavy (and solid!) but it's still smaller and lighter than the other amps i have. Did you notice an increase in output volume with the other speakers?

**s1track3d** · 05-31-2015, 12:13 AM

Thanks everyone, some good suggestions here

**hans halmackenreuter** · 06-07-2015, 05:33 AM

Originally Posted by s1track3d

teal strip, yeah, that's the one. I used to write it off as just a practice amp but apparently it's a bit of a sleeper and very capable. Last time I played it in a quartet rehearsal years ago, I remember it just didn't have enough to keep up, I was hoping that an efficient speaker would put it into the ballpark and it could be used in a light group setting. I agree, the cabinet is heavy (and solid!) but it's still smaller and lighter than the other amps i have. Did you notice an increase in output volume with the other speakers?

With the delta demon the amp had more mids and it was a tiny little bit louder and the copperhead is even more efficient and therefore louder, but I don't remember how much louder it was and I don't want to misguide you with my experience.

**mambosun** · 06-07-2015, 07:13 AM

Very happy since I swapped the stock speaker to Little Buddy on my Superchamp XD.

I get now a deeper and bolder sound, with more headroom, perfect for a classic smooth jazz clean tone.
It has the darker sound rendition which I was looking for, but this is a matter of taste.

**TheGrandWazoo** · 06-07-2015, 07:18 AM

I tried an Eminence 820H which is an 8" hemp cone in a Vibrochamp and it was very rolled off on the high end. The 10" from that line might be similar.Great mids presence but I was looking more for the brightness of a Jensen. If I had been looking for a darker speaker I would have picked it.

**jzucker** · 06-07-2015, 07:29 AM

this is what I ordered for my mambo. The eminence beta 10 that many of the jazz amps use is very dark and cannot get the benson jazz sound.

18 Sound 10NMB GUITAR 250 Watt 8ohm 10 Neodymium Driver

Oops, misunderstood your posting. If you want smooth and dark, go for the emi beta 10

**JOHNV** · 07-06-2015, 02:37 PM

Few years back I was looking for a pair of 10's for a strat/blues rock thing. The Delta Demons were a bit too soft up top for that but they are a great flavor. They were in the 2-10 cabinet for a week or so, got broken in. I went to Copperheads for that more glassy thing. As for the Demons, they're here on a shelf in original boxes...

**jzucker** · 07-06-2015, 03:56 PM

i wouldn't have recommended this 2 weeks ago but now that I've tried it I can heartily recommend the Eminence Beta 10. Great and efficient speaker that sounds good for a wide range of styles.

**Franz 1997** · 07-07-2015, 06:15 AM

Originally Posted by jzucker

i wouldn't have recommended this 2 weeks ago but now that I've tried it I can heartily recommend the Eminence Beta 10. Great and efficient speaker that sounds good for a wide range of styles.

This 'jazz speaker' thing is very interesting. The beta speaker is used a lot in jazz amps for a reason

You might think that the beta 10 is not very efficient, @ 97db. But if you dig deeper into the published efficiency numbers and look at the response graph, you see that the beta speaker has a relatively flat response right down to 150hz - in other words, it maintains the same level of efficiency in the area of all the guitar's fundamental notes ( e.g. top E string, 5th fret= 440hz). So this tends to give the beta a lot of firmness and 'weight' in the top strings as well as the bass strings, creating a more balanced response - whereas many speakers roll off the response quite steeply downwards from maybe 500hz. Of course, this is at the expense of some upper harmonics, but that's the trade=off.

Some speakers. e.g. the legendary EVs, focus more on maintaining a flat response area around 1 kHz, which would mean that the upper notes and harmonics are more 'balanced', but the bass strings sound leaner - just what you want for pop and rock, but less so for jazz IMO.

I find that you can tell far more about how a speaker will sound by looking at the response graph in the area from 200hz to 1khz, than you can from just looking at an overall efficiency rating. Often, a very high treble efficiency will push the average rating right upwards, but at the expense of weight and loudness in the fundamental notes.

An example is the 12" Celestion Century, which has a rating of 102 db - but if you replace a beta speaker ( e.g. beta 12 @ 98 db) with the celestion @ 102 db, surprisingly you find that the fundamental notes get thinner, not louder. And, the amp's hiss becomes much more apparent. The Century has far more efficiency in the high treble, pushing up the overall rating by around 5 db.

It's all a question of trade-offs - but I'd say look at the speaker response graph as a whole, rather than just the published average sensitivity rating, which can be very misleading. A high rating doesn't just mean ''louder'' - you have to ask yourself ''louder, where??''...

**iim7V7IM7** · 07-07-2015, 09:16 AM

Very interesting analysis Franz...

I have been and remain quite happy with my Emi Beta in my Evans RE 200. I get a very natural sound to my ear (I never considered it "dark"). Yeah, the fundamentals sans harmonic content (which is important) fall between 82 - 1,047 Hz for most guitars with the lions-share of notes falling in the 100-700 Hz range. I also think beyond the anechoic measurements; much of the actual performance beyond the amp's pre-amp is influenced by the cabinet design and amp location relative to the floor and walls. I am sure that the same Beta 10 in different cabinets and room locations will be perceived differently.

Thanks,

Bob