Did Joe Pass NOT care much for his Ibanez JP20??

[Sleeko]

I have a question maybe someone can help me with please? I have an L4CES and the pickup is mounted right at the end of the fingerboard. No gap. On the ES-175 there is a noticeable gap and I'm not sure why that is? The bodies, while different materials, are the same exact shape and scale. There doesn't seem to be a problem with the gap on the Gibson model yet it seems to be an issue with this Joe Pass model. Yes different guitars but along the same premise. I'm confused.

[John A.]

I have a question maybe someone can help me with please? I have an L4CES and the pickup is mounted right at the end of the fingerboard. No gap. On the ES-175 there is a noticeable gap and I'm not sure why that is? The bodies, while different materials, are the same exact shape and scale. There doesn't seem to be a problem with the gap on the Gibson model yet it seems to be an issue with this Joe Pass model. Yes different guitars but along the same premise. I'm confused.

175 and L4 both have 20 fret necks. The gap moves the pickup about an inch closer to the bridge on the 175, which makes a slight difference in brightness. I’m not sure why Gibson did that, but my guess is that they thought the positions on each guitar complemented each guitar’s overall tone (lam maple is a darker tone than carved spruce).

JP20 has a 22 fret neck with a gap, which pushes the pickup another inch or so closer to the bridge than on a 175. This makes more of a difference in brightness and makes the JP20 sound a lot different from the ES175.

[PAG]

I had the privileged of having met Joe Pass in person, attended one of his courses in Vienna, besides – together with Les Wise, my teacher at the time – we had a pizza together for lunch. I don't know what he thought about the Ibanez model named after him, but it is certain that he had a Gibson 175 with him, which had its brand name taped with black duct tape

[Lionelsax]

I had the privileged of having met Joe Pass in person, attended one of his courses in Vienna, besides – together with Les Wise, my teacher at the time – we had a pizza together for lunch. I don't know what he thought about the Ibanez model named after him, but it is certain that he had a Gibson 175 with him, which had its brand name taped with black duct tape

This is his last guitar, maybe it was the one you saw.

[floatingpickup]

What is the serial number (back of the headstock). If it's an early one, it might well be Joe's but if it's a later one, it more than likely isn't.
Although we don't know how many he went through.
He might haven given them away or left them around like candy. Or he might have had just one, which would make his a very early example. Likely the first!

If you look closely at any pictures of the JP-20 that Joe played for many years, it had a unique headstock inlay that I have never seen on any other production JP-20’s. Any guitar that has the typical “JP” inlay would have to be a different guitar than that one. I assume his was a prototype and I have never run across another one with that inlay (although there could be others out there somewhere). He may have owned more than one JP-20, but I have never seen him playing one other than the one in the picture below.
Keith

[PAG]

This is his last guitar, maybe it was the one you saw.

On February 12, 1992, he had his solo concert in Vienna at Reigen, which was connected to the workshop, so it happened then.

[Lionelsax]

This is what Joe said about the Ibanez JP20Attachment 16019

Great !
If someone wrote this today, there would be a lot of protests.
"Mister Pass, we are heavy and fat but comfortable !"

My wife loves Joe Pass because he is humble and has got a permanent smile.

[Stringswinger]

Great !
If someone wrote this today, there would be a lot of protests.
"Mister Pass, we are heavy and fat but comfortable !"

My wife loves Joe Pass because he is humble and has got a permanent smile.

People spend too much time being offended these days instead of enjoying life (which is much shorter than most people think).

Fat chicks have never interested me, but some guys like them. To each their own. Same with guitars. Fat guitars (as in say a Dreadnought) have never interested me, but some guys like them. That said, my Ibanez Joe Pass was not the lightest archtop that I have owned, but she was a fine guitar with a great neck profile. If that guitar had a 24.75 scale, i might still own it. But maybe not. I tend to gravitate to the Gibson ES-175, as did Joe Pass. Here is a stylized picture of me playing one of my 175's at a gig last week (sent to me by an audience member):

[John A.]

On February 12, 1992, he had his solo concert in Vienna at Reigen, which was connected to the workshop, so it happened then.

Are you sure he had tape over the label? Barney Kessel was known for doing that because he didn’t want to give Gibson free publicity. But I never heard of Joe Pass doing that. By 92 he was mostly playing the custom 175 and occasionally playing the Epi Joe Pass. It seems strange that he would have covered the label of a brand he was being paid to play.

[Stringswinger]

Are you sure he had tape over the label? Barney Kessel was known for doing that because he didn’t want to give Gibson free publicity. But I never heard of Joe Pass doing that. By 92 he was mostly playing the custom 175 and occasionally playing the Epi Joe Pass. It seems strange that he would have covered the label of a brand he was being paid to play.

In fact, when Joe died, he had two examples of that 175 in his possession and was working with Gibson on a signature model (I suspect the estate dispute between his third wife, Ellen and his adopted children from his marriage to wife number two got in the way of that guitar coming to market). I find it hard to believe that Joe would cover up the Gibson logo while working with the company on a signature model. That makes no sense.

[PAG]

Are you sure he had tape over the label? Barney Kessel was known for doing that because he didn’t want to give Gibson free publicity. But I never heard of Joe Pass doing that. By 92 he was mostly playing the custom 175 and occasionally playing the Epi Joe Pass. It seems strange that he would have covered the label of a brand he was being paid to play.

Absolutely sure! A friend of mine and I sat through his master course and we even talked about how striking the duct tape was. But it didn't seem like he was interested in it at all that everyone can recognise it. For many years, John Scofield played on AS 200s from the early '80s and not the model named after him (maybe still, I don't know because I've seen him with a black Ibanez, which I'm sure is a newer instrument). A serious guitarist will not compromise for any amount of money, to be not fully satisfied with the guitar he takes to the stage.

[PAG]

This is a fact, I saw it with my own eyes.

[Lionelsax]

They really know the guitar world, they know they listen with their eyes.
You put a big name on it, you sound better.

[floatingpickup]

Are you sure he had tape over the label? Barney Kessel was known for doing that because he didn’t want to give Gibson free publicity. But I never heard of Joe Pass doing that. By 92 he was mostly playing the custom 175 and occasionally playing the Epi Joe Pass. It seems strange that he would have covered the label of a brand he was being paid to play.

I have seen videos of him playing the Ibanez with tape over the label, after entered into the endorsement arrangement with Epiphone. Here is an example:

Keith

[John A.]

Absolutely sure! A friend of mine and I sat through his master course and we even talked about how striking the duct tape was. But it didn't seem like he was interested in it at all that everyone can recognise it. For many years, John Scofield played on AS 200s from the early '80s and not the model named after him (maybe still, I don't know because I've seen him with a black Ibanez, which I'm sure is a newer instrument). A serious guitarist will not compromise for any amount of money, to be not fully satisfied with the guitar he takes to the stage.

This is a fact, I saw it with my own eyes.

Interesting. I wonder what the story behind that was.

[frabarmus]

The pick also looks interesting... looks like a thin, small teardrop (358) with the tip and the head cut off...?

[dot75]

Someone asked JP about this very guitar at a gig in October 1985 - see post #87

[dot75]

The pick also looks interesting... looks like a thin, small teardrop (358) with the tip and the head cut off...?

He used to bite the tip off - saw him do it more than once.

[lawson-stone]

Absolutely sure! A friend of mine and I sat through his master course and we even talked about how striking the duct tape was. But it didn't seem like he was interested in it at all that everyone can recognise it. For many years, John Scofield played on AS 200s from the early '80s and not the model named after him (maybe still, I don't know because I've seen him with a black Ibanez, which I'm sure is a newer instrument). A serious guitarist will not compromise for any amount of money, to be not fully satisfied with the guitar he takes to the stage.

I don't know the timing, but if he was setting up the Ibanez endorsement, maybe they wanted him to chill on making the Gibson brand name so prominent?

[floatingpickup]

He used to bite the tip off - saw him do it more than once.

I saw him take a brand new pick and break it up into little pieces before using it.
Keith

[John A.]

I don't know the timing, but if he was setting up the Ibanez endorsement, maybe they wanted him to chill on making the Gibson brand name so prominent?

He said ‘92, which would have been around the time the Epi endorsement was happening (and after the Ibanez deal had ended). So maybe it was a negotiating tactic?

[grahambop]

Joe also used to cut picks in half, he said he preferred them small. Here’s a photo from an interview he did in a guitar magazine. Also quite usefully it shows his right-hand fingernails.

[PAG]

The pick also looks interesting... looks like a thin, small teardrop (358) with the tip and the head cut off...?

Yes, almost exactly. The head was cut off (he said at the workshop that he likes his hands to be close to the strings), but the tip broke off while playing.

[lawson-stone]

He said ‘92, which would have been around the time the Epi endorsement was happening (and after the Ibanez deal had ended). So maybe it was a negotiating tactic?

For some reason I keep forgetting about that Epiphone endorsement. Other than instructional videos, was there ever any public performance where Joe played the Epiphone?

[John A.]

For some reason I keep forgetting about that Epiphone endorsement. Other than instructional videos, was there ever any public performance where Joe played the Epiphone?

Yes. I saw him play it in a solo performance in 93.