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Hello,
For my taste Tal Farlow had such a great tone, probably my favorite overall.
I love that percussive and somehow bright woody tone he could achieve; not the usual expected blanket smooth dark tone.
It is a pity not much 25.5 laminated maple body and top cheap archtop are available for experimentation; most of them are ether spruce top or 24 3/4...
Would be nice Epiphone would make a Tal Farlow or an ES 350T (25.5 not Birdland scale)
I am in the process of butchering my Epi Regent which is a 25.5 spruce top, routing it with a Gibson classic 57.
I intend to use the very same electronics as Gibson use and experiment with that.
I know spruce is smoother than maple and it might not deliver that snapping tone by nature, but in any case I love to experiment with these cheap Epiphones.
Maybe the thick layer of poly will have some effect on the tone...
Anyway I guess I will have fun experimenting...
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02-01-2014 10:14 AM
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looks like a gretsch 16" with dearmond s/c pickups. Very distinctive sharp attack, fast decay..those dearmonds are good at that..Bean was a master player IMO, and his hands look normal size..
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It's not cheap, but The Sadowsky LS-17 might interest you (17 in, maple laminate construction, 25.5 in scale length).
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Seems like the Gibson Re-Issue Tal guitars show up in the 3K range. I think they are longer scale than the originals, though. You are right the one's from the 60's are super expensive. Also, didn't Tal design an amp that doubled as a seat?
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I have found them used asking for between $2495 and $2895 in Sunburst. Viceroy Brown or Natural may fetch a little more. Wine Red a little lower.
Originally Posted by SierraTango
The TF Reissues have 25.5" scale length.
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I don't know what the budget is but the Peerless Contessa fits the specs: 25.5" scale length and carved spruce top. I thick you cold probably get one for about $1800-$1900 new.
http://www.peerlessguitars.com.au/products.html&pID=9
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Many old Japanese L-5CES copies w/long scale should get you close. 99% of them are all-laminated.
- Yamaha made the AE-11, AE-12 and AE-18, which preceded the AE-1200 series by a few years. Cheap when you find them. Not sure of the scale. Very good laminated 17" archtop guitars.
- cheaper and crappier are early Japanese L-5CES copies labeled Ventura, Raven, Conrad (and more, I'm sure); these make excellent platforms for improvement. Not sure of the scale on these. They look like they all came from the same factory in the 1960s.Last edited by Hammertone; 02-01-2014 at 09:16 PM.
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Vinlander, a few years ago there was a line of guitars called "Fusion Blues". The importer, Switch, is no longer in business, however some of these are lurking around music stores. I found one called a Villager that is a Howard Roberts knockoff, but they had some laminated maple top, back and sides models with a L-5 vibe. I paid $350 for the Villager and it's become my travel axe. I think they were all 25.5 scale.
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Ebay has a nice Heritage H550. 25 1/2" maple top.
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Reverb.com has an Epi Broadway(two pick-up) $500.
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Happily, I'm the proud owner of a Gibson Tal Farlow model. Easily the finest instrument I've ever played and absolutely perfect for both solo and ensemble playing. Before this I used a Samick HJ series and that was a fine maple laminated instrument as well. I had a Gibson '57 classic humbucker in there and the sound was excellent indeed. I paid about $500 for it and got my money back after I got the Tal. Still see the Samicks around once in a while for about the same price used...
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Broadway Elitist or the standard model? Originally Posted by Archtop Guy
People complain the standard model fall apart or come nearly disassembled out of the box. I almost bought one because I saw the opportunity to get an L-5 -esque tone for a cheap price. Then I read a bunch of reviews and changed my mind.
They could all be lying though, I don't know
All I know is the Elitists sell for way more now that they're out of production.
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I played a Triggs laminate with 25.5 scale that was amazing.
Wish I had bought it, the price was around $1400.
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Whenever I hear this sound I'm always thinking that the strings are very "dead" flat wounds.
Would you agree?
If so, this would bring into play a different approach to eq on the amp. I mean you would have no hesitation to crank the treble a lot and use less bass.
There is a "bounce" to the 4 wound strings. Very short sustain and nice pick attack (which also makes me believe that the treble is up)
The guy probably just plugged into his amp and cranked the treble because the strings were dead……as per usual.
Benson…….although a totally unique tone... always sounds a bit this way to me. Dead strings and cranked highs.
Perhaps it makes the strings sound a certain way……and brings out that midrange in the body of the guitar.
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Yep - even though the actual archtop is important - to get a Tal type sound, some flats and the right amp eq settings will go a long way to arriving at that tone. Also, a Fender medium tortoiseshell pick with the flats will really help getting that Tal 'doonk!' sound on the bass strings. Originally Posted by Philco
A good recipe for approximating 50's Tal, would be: laminate archtop, flats (TI's), medium fender tortoise and a blues junior.
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+1 on the TI's.
I used to string my Gibson Herb Ellis(ES-175 based guitar) with TI Bebops. I would get some of the qualities of the Tal sound, but still a long way to go though. The Tal is based on one of those L-5 -ish models, I'm pretty sure it's the super 400. So a guitar with those qualities would probably get you close to that tone.
My Gibson Herb Ellis is extremely bright unless I string it with La Bellas, which I prefer. However, the TI's gave it that Tal vibe as a side effect so that was pretty cool.
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The Tal Farlow model was essentially an ES-350 with different ornamentation.
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I'd like to offer a different approach. I know it works because I have inadvertently done it--more than once. It takes time, but it's the surest method I know of. It works so well that it will happen even if you don't intend for it to happen, even if don't want it to happen.
To get someone else's sound, my method has only 2 steps. They must be repeated over and over and over again.
1. Listen to the artist you love. Listen a lot.
2. Play. Play a lot.
Eventually you will sound like them. That's all there is to it. You may not even realize it when it happens. Other people will tell you that you sound like Tal Farlow. You don't need to have the same equipment, but it helps if yours is roughly similar to theirs. In fact, without executing steps 1 and 2 you will never sound like your hero, even if you have the exact same guitar, amp, pick, clothes, and mannerisms. The steps cause you to unconsciously develop the touch and sensibility necessary to reproduce the sound and feel that you're after.
So, I've been sitting here listening to some Tal Farlow on YouTube. He has a lovely, very natural sound. Doesn't sound like the tone control is rolled off, at least not very much. And he's not playing very loud. That's important.
Most any archtop with a humbucker into a medium power tube amp should get you close. It's all about soaking up the sound and feel. It may take a year or two. It has to become second nature.
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I completely agree. A laminate archtop with medium gauge nickel wound flatwounds like TI Swing (as opposed to stainless steel wound) should get you there (paired with proper EQ settings). TI are one of the few brands out there who offers nickel flatwounds (Pyramid does too, but they are unbalanced volumewise on my guitars). As for the pick, the Dunlop Jazztone 205 gets me in the ballpark (it's brighter than say ProPlec, which one might choose to get a Jim Hall'ish sound), but it's easy and cheap to experiment with picks. I also like my Biltoft HCC pickups, but to be fair, the difference in sound of various pickups can be levelled out with EQ tweak. Originally Posted by 3625
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thank you guys, I will experiment and try some of your advices
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Nobody sounds like Tal Farlow.
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I agree on the Tal, though I don't deserve mine :-) Tal Farlow actually made a mini red plastic guitar sound wonderful, he had magic in his hands. Originally Posted by General_Lee
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I believe that the red guitar is a custom-painted Gibson ES-140. Unless you're talking about ANOTHER mini red guitar. Originally Posted by GNAPPI
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not to be the contrarian but, this is the first occurrence that i can recall when people were praising Tal Farlow's tone.
his playing, the size of his hands (as if that has anything to do with music), his bebop chops, how he could play standards for hours without looking at his guitar etc. are frequently cited.
his tone reminded struck me like someone scratching on a blackboard, but that's just me. it always sounded boxy. heavy strings, and electrified pounding on a cardboard box.
of course i didn't check out Tal until after i'd heard Christian, Kessel, Ellis, Pass, Hall, Benson, Martino, McLaughlin, Coryell, Metheny, Holdsworth, etc.
I always thought he sounded like a sloppier version of Pass. For this style, I really think that he was overshadowed by Pass. sorry.
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Very interested in the above posts. I suspect Tal's chair actually contained his amp. I suggest this because close inspection of photos shows his guitar plugging into the chair and IIRC I'm pretty certain I remember an interview where he says his home made "frequency divider" (octaver) was built into the chair too. However I've also seen footage where he's using the chair but his amp (Fender Twin) is not contained therein. Regarding the TF signature, it's thinner than an ES350. Latterly Tal was endorsing D'Addario (probably Chromes) strings and using Dunlop Jazz picks. He was also using an MXR Commande series analogue delay pedal almost set to a slapback setting. Additionally, at home he played through his hi-fi via a mains powered Ibanez GE-100 graphic equalizer.
You don't say if you've installed the h/bucker in your Epi yet but perhaps a P90 or even a CC might be more evocative of Tal's vintage tone. BTW if your'e interested, I'm pretty certain the CC type Tal had fitted to his ES350 was the ES250 type p/up, that is, the type with the blade serrated between the strings.
Regarding a cheap(ish) new guitar with TF spec the Peerless Jazz City is maple top, 25 & 1/2 scale.
New GibsonTal Farlow models are still available at this time, round the £4000 GBP mark. Additionally the TF signature has a great neck shape. It's one of the few guitars that will allow a moderately sized hand to get the thumb over the bass side to simultaneously fret the 6th and 5th strings.(A real Farlow signature sound).
Best wishes with your project, It would be great to hear of your progress on this thread.
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