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(This message is not for the "just a cord into an amp crowd")
Quite a while ago I had a pedal collection so I could tap dance through patches in a wedding band. Then, I got jazz fever and got rid of everything except a Pro Co Rat into my JC 120 (since the JC distortion is so cheesy).
Now, I'm starting to build back up as I get into some recording projects and throw a laptop in at the end of the chain. But, its a different world now. I'm having two competing thoughts:
1) Add some pedals to the mix, a compressor for the single coils, something for time based effects (like a Line 6 modeler), a wah, a looper.
2) Get an all-in-one like a Boss multi or a Line 6 Pod HD, maybe with a loop out to keep the Rat.
Any thoughts on this? I'm worried that the all-in-ones mean hours lost to figuring out how to tweak patches, but you can't deny the cost savings, particularly with looping included. What makes sense as you drift between straight-ahead and fusion?
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06-26-2012 12:29 PM
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I'm nit much of an effects guy, but i never met an "all in one" unit i cared for.
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Another path , check out a Fender Mustang Amp.
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I only need an overdrive, wah, chorus, delay and reverb to be happy. Sometimes a bit of fuzz can be fun. Although when playing jazz normally I go straight into the amp, if I'm feeling adventurous I'll add some delay.
Either I've always preferred stomp boxes as I feel they are far more intuitive.
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If I had to choose only one pedal, it would be echo/delay. The only other effects I would ever use would be chorus and reverb (both are on my amps), and maybe a wah very occasionally. I usually play clean.
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My pedal chain: Guitar-- Delay + Reverb + volume + preamp--amp. I use a Twintube preamp, which has tubes, in conjunction with a sold state amp (Henricksen), to give it a little of that "tube amp PRESENCE". If using a tube amp (65 RI Fender Twin), no need for preamp.
The goal is to sweeten/thicken the sound a smudge, a noticeable smattering without overwhelming it, without attenuating or distorting it. Absolutely NO bullshit grime/dirt/distortion/metal crap.
My thinking, anyway. YMMV.
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I play some rock music in a cover band. To me the by far most convenient solution is a Fender Mustang oder a Mustang floor. For each song i have the one, two or three sounds i need stored in the amp and simply switch between them.
The Mustang floor has the benefit of also having a volume/expression pedal and you could plug it into your favorite tube amp (or just an active speaker if you choose to do so) which then sounds even better. You can also use it as just a multi stomp box unit, it has a USB connection to your computer for recording or for editing sounds and and and ... The effects are all useable and generally sounds are easy to edit. The amp emulations sound damn good to me.
With the Mustang floor you could, however, bypass any amp emulation if you choose to do so and only have the effects (five per bank) available (total of 100 storage locations). As with practically all multieffect units the factory presets are hideously over-engineered and geared towards the heavy metal crowd. The first thing i did is to put just the pure amp simulations into the first twelve storage locations. To each you can assign five pedals that you can operate as you would operate normal pedals. So, twelve rigs at your disposal, all good sounding.
It takes about five minutes to figure out how that thing works and the fuse software used to edit sounds is easy to use, though not great in my opinion.
To me this is a combination of ease of use, versatility, sound (and price) that is hard to beat. I only ever had compliments for the sounds that come out of this setup (already two fellow guitar players bought one right after hearing it - and that despite my playing :-)). I go through the entire set hazzle free without dancing on the pedals all the time or having to adjust knobs at all. From bright clean, sparkling Fender twin sounds with delay and reverb to fat, overdriven Marshall sounds is just one step on the footswitch.
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If you just want effects check the Nova System - lots of great effects and no modelling. The weakest part are the ods but since you have a RAT you're covered on that.
Now my opinion is I like single pedals more. I sold the nova system and got a very small gator pedalboard and bag that I can fit 4 pedals with the power supply out of the board (but it fits inside the bag as well). It's as light as the Nova System and much more easy to tweak on gigs (and also you end up having better effects if you choose the right pedals)
It's a little more expensive because you need pedals and pedalboard and bag and power supply and patch cables... but worth it for me.
What effects do you need besides the RAT?
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If I were looking into adding effects, I would give serious consideration to the iStomp pedal by Digitech iStomp | DigiTech Guitar Effects
Two or three iStomps on a board would give you great versatility with the ability to load the appropriate apps/effects for a specific gig, next gig is different, change the effects without changing the pedals/board. No huge learning curve its a stomp box with interchangeable/down-loadable effects. The reviews I have read have been positive.
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For my money, I'd go with individual effects every time. I would never disrespect the choice of people to use a multi-effects unit but I personally can't stand them. I'm just very specific about things. I mean there are tons of options for every effect you could want and I find that more attractive than having only BOSS or Digitech effects.
Now if you're using the laptop you could have an amazing plugin rig and bypass all the hardware if you like save for some kind of controller.
Either way, you have a lot of options, but if you only need a handful of effects I'd go for individual units.
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Line 6 M13
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I had a Mustang III that I kinda liked, but I never really got all that into it. I ended up selling it and going with a ZT Lunchbox, which has a sort-of-reverb in the amp, a Tech 21 Blonde, and a Crybaby wah. That covers me for just about every situation I have. I'd like some more Tech 21 pedals, and I'd enjoy messing around with a chorus and a phaser if I can find ones I like, but I definitely don't need them.
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I was never that much into effects even back in the day. Amp reverb, my TC Electronic phaser/flanger and I'm set. I would like to get an Auto-Wah, but it would probably collect more dust than be used. Still have my old MXR Dyna-Comp and ShoBud volume pedal I used for Country gigs. Pedals I used to have and miss was an original Roland Chorus pedal, modd'd by Paul Rivera and my Uni-Vibe. Those might see daylight if I still had them. I also had original Echoplex also modd'd by Paul Rivera, but can only remember using it once for a pit band gig. It was funny I ran into a guy who wanted a real Echoplex so bad, so I sold it to him. Two weeks later he'd grown tired of it and sold it to someone else.
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Whats an effects pedal ?
just kidding , i don't use any , only the amps eq and reverb , but i do see the benefit of good compressors / eq pedal and good reverb if your amp hasn't got nice reverb ,
and i also favour individual pedals, to multi fx , like with guitars each companies offering of same effect varies enough to want to pick each one separately for its merits , and often its cheaper to get multi fx but as mr B said i too have to hear a multi fx that does it all to my liking ,
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I understand the general hate against multi-fx because most are terrible but the Nova System is a very nice machine. The M13 also seems nice but it's bigger, more expensive and you can only have 4 effects at the time. I still like individual effects better specially because I only used eq / delay / reverb from the Nova System but it's much better than the average multi-fx from Boss.
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Axe-Fx.
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I'm an M13 fan and would be a Nova G fan if I had more $$ to spend. The M13 has more than most would need, even if you play different genres - from polka to metal to jazz and back. Some don't like the distortion effects, but for jazz you don't have to be so picky about distortion. It's extremely versatile, easy for novices, detailed for techies and experimenters. It really is more like having the stomp boxes at your feet than other multi's. If the M13 has too many options for you, an M9 might be the thing. I suggested an M9 for a bass playing friend that doesn't need 4 boxes going at once.
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Just a fun update to the discussion.
I found a manual (what's that? :-) for a JC-120 that lists effects loop as a feature. I tried wiring my Alesis QuadraVerb in here to see what it would do, answer is "nothing". The jacks on the JC-120 are marked "line out" and a left and right "main in". I'm guessing main in is really from an external amp and not line level signals, and my JC-120 ('83 or so) might be older than the current manual. Oh well. The thought was just use delay/reverb in a rack mount unit, and just worry about some boutique pedals for the fun things. If anyone has experience with JC-10 line out jacks I'll drag that conversation to another thread.
I think I'll end up with a pedal collection plus a switchable unit, and use the switchable unit for mostly time based things (delay switching, mostly). The current set up is now two Pro Co rats (one set aggressive, one set subtle), a MXR compressor (thickens up the single coils), and a cry baby. This allows a wide variety of distortion/compression sounds and very controllable through the volume knob on the guitar as well. I may add something like the line 6 MM4 or something, or I might go with the Line 6 HD400 which has an effects loop to get footswitchable programmable delays and the looper.
The more interesting thing is I just picked up an Ibanez AS103, which is another whole story, but holy smokes, what a difference better pickups make. I thought I'd end up with an ES-335, but in the end I'm used to the Ibanez necks and this one felt like the GB10 but has the feedback rejection from the solid through neck. After I get to play it a little more I'll post pictures and comments in another thread.
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For time-based effects I really like the Strymon TimeLine. This is a lot more than just another programmable delay; as I see it, the TimeLine's nearest competition is the Eventide Eclipse (which costs four times as much, requires a rack case and a MIDI controller, and has patch-change times measured in seconds).
The ElectroHarmonix Superego does what they call "particle" or "granular" synthesis. Basically, tiny samples of your guitar sound get captured and replayed. It's kind of like a sampler that holds just one note (or chord), except that the held sound "evolves" to give the impression of being played by an actual instrument. There are several parameters to adjust on the Superego, allowing a variety of capture techniques and tone shaping. The Superego also has a built-in effects loop for the captured sound; I've found that flange, chorus and tremolo can all be used to add some interesting "motion" to the held sound.
As a child of the 60's, I've always had a fondness for the sound of a guitar played through a Leslie speaker. Unfortunately, that's a really difficult effect to do convincingly. Among the Leslie pedals, I'd recommend the Boss RT-20 despite that stupid rotating light display. It takes a good ear for an authentic Leslie sound to find the right settings on the RT-20, but I haven't found anything better. (Despite Strymon's good work on the TimeLine, their Lex rotary pedal was disappointing to me.)
If you want to get deeper into synthesis without modifying your guitar, combine the Sonuus G2M (guitar-to-MIDI) with your choice of MIDI sound module. The GM2 can only track single lines; that's the price you pay for not having to modify your guitar for a hex pickup.
Or, if you want to try a full-on synth rig, take a look at the Roland GR-55. This also has an OK multiFX processor for your guitar. I've done performances with nothing but the GK-equipped guitar and the GR-55.
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OK . . . just so that we're all clear on what a dinosaur I am . . . Here's the last effects I bought. It's a DigiTech 944 chain reaction with a muli floor pedal. It has parametric EQ, digital delay, flange/chorus and distortion. When I bought it . . it was state of the art . . . top end . . . super duper abbra cadabbra stuff man. All I use now is a cord straight into my amp for the archie and semi's.
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Wow, that's going on 30 years old. And I see indications that it was a DOD product before Digitech acquired it...
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Sometimes I insert just a touch of stereo chorus. Usually not.
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I don't know anything about the DOD affiliation.?.? All I know is that it still works fine. Funny though ... I bought my 12 year old grand son an RP 250 and it really blows this thing away.
Originally Posted by TieDyedDevil
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Yah, I highly recommend the current-generation RPs. For clean-ish sounds and for effects, they're difficult to beat at any price. The only real drawbacks, AFAIC, are the restricted control over individual effects within a patch and the simplistic looper.
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i like the boss ME70
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