Differences Between Gibson ES-175 and ES-165 (FLOATING PU)

**Sphereacidburn** · 02-16-2012, 10:47 PM

Differences Between ES-175 and ES-165 (FLOATING PU) other than the obvious fact in the pickups. What is the difference in sound? is one thicker than the other? Woodier? Better Sounding? Please give me details!

**SamBooka** · 02-16-2012, 11:29 PM

Unplugged I couldnt tell the difference.. my 165 obviously sounded different from the ones in the store but I will chalk that up to things like mine had newish flats and was set up to my taste vs light 11s roundwound and not setup at all ..

I cant really compare anymore tho since I put an ebony bridge on the 165 (which I love)

My 96 165 (set hb) is the same body as a 175 minus the bridge pickup, supposedly a thicker neck (I dont remember but Gibson lists it that way in their literature) and no crown inlay on the headstock.

It took me a LOOOOOONG time to warm up to that guitar and I still think it is hideous (gold hardware and the flamed top bugs me) and I am still pissed about the junky tailpiece (and the fact gibson wont even sell a decent replacement) but 2 years later it is still my main guitar despite having had the means to replace it .

If you want a Gibson and cant afford a 175 (or like me could afford one but hated having the bridge pickup) then I think they are still a bargain. If you arent married to the Gibson name there are better "175s" being made by other companies (Eastman springs to mind and Loars if you have a few you can pick and choose from)

**Sphereacidburn** · 02-17-2012, 07:47 AM

But, Do you know anything about the floating pickup?

**ruiner54** · 02-17-2012, 08:10 AM

I feel embarrassed that I have never heard tell of the 165 before....I just checked out some pictures....and it's awesome. I too have absolutely no use for the bridge pickup and find it clutters up a jazz box and can make it uglier. Is there a substantial price diff between the 165 and 175?

I think the 165 looks MUCH better without the bridge PuP

**Sphereacidburn** · 02-17-2012, 05:42 PM

I believe the 165 is about 1000-1500 dollars cheaper!

**SamBooka** · 02-17-2012, 07:19 PM

I overpaid for mine
Paid 1850ish with case and 57classic plus pickup

My Personal opinion is that on a 16in laninated top guitar floater don't change much
The fact that it is a different pickup has a greater impact and if you WANT the 175 tone the floater wouldn't get you as close

**Eddyberte** · 02-03-2015, 04:27 AM

Would it be a good idea to change the floating pu in a fixed humbucker, to get an equal sound as the 175?

**redwater** · 02-03-2015, 05:26 AM

Do the math: 2000$ for a ES165 + 100$ replacement pick up + 165$ for the guitar tech to install it. For 2300$ you get a decent ES175. Plus the resale value wich would have gone after routing the top of the 165.

Another thaught on the ES165. The prices seem to rise rapididly here in Germany. Greg Hilden (Vintage Guitar Dealer here in Germany) sold the wine red 165 (set HB) for 2400€ (nobody wants to play the red one) last Dezember. These guitars are getting rare, because the catz realise the practical value of the 165. In the future I see the 165 more expensive then the regular ES175...

**Para** · 02-03-2015, 07:09 AM

All this doesn't really help the OP. The ES165 has a BJB floating humbucker, it was designed by Bruce Bolan (Gibson) and is a redesigned version of their Johnny Smith it has more midrange and is punchier overall, have no experience with one but I would think being floating you might get a bit more acoustic sound with it they are reputed to be warm and articulate sounding.
Archtopheaven recently bought a guitar with a BJB floter you could try sending him PM and ask his opinion. You might get some information in the Gibson forums.

**Eddyberte** · 02-03-2015, 07:47 AM

Thanks. I own a 175 and a 165, this one with floating pu. I want to sell one of both and buy something else. I like the es 175 sound very much. The 165 floating indeed sounds a bit more acoustic. The only thing that i do not like is that the pu is close to the neck, exactly where my playing position is. So many times I touch the pu with my plectrum.
That's the reason why I would like to ha a humbucker instead.

**pubylakeg** · 02-03-2015, 06:16 PM

I've noticed on the ES-165s equipped with a floater, there is a screw through the pickguard located near the strings but at the bridge end of the pickguard. Can anyone tell me what this is for ? and does it go right through into the top of the guitar?.

**entresz** · 02-03-2015, 06:20 PM

I don't think a floating pickup makes much sense on a ES175 guitar (thick, laminate). The main benefit that I see, is that you can put whatever pickup you want on there as there is no pre-existing rout. If it was me I would be fitting a CC pickup on one.

**pubylakeg** · 02-03-2015, 06:21 PM

You can see it on this picture, near the bridge by the bottom E string.

Any ideas what that screw is doing ?.

**Eddyberte** · 02-04-2015, 05:25 AM

I will have a look next week. Suppose this os normal.

**Para** · 02-04-2015, 05:31 AM

It won't be screwed into the top it's probably holding some sort of spacer to keep the pickguard height.

**oldane** · 02-04-2015, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by entresz

I don't think a floating pickup makes much sense on a ES175 guitar (thick, laminate). The main benefit that I see, is that you can put whatever pickup you want on there as there is no pre-existing rout. If it was me I would be fitting a CC pickup on one.

Agree that a floater doesn't make sense on a laminate guitar. A built in humbucker is also very versatile in that sense that there's hardly any type of pickup which isn't available in humbucker mount from one maker or another (P90, CC - you name it). And it's so easy to drop another PU into a HB mount.

**vinnyv1k** · 02-04-2015, 06:24 PM

I have a floater ES165. That extra screw on the pickguard goes through a plastic spacer and screws into the top of the guitar for added pickguard support. IMO the BJB floater ES165 sounds lousy compared to a set humbucker 175. It has a thin acoustic sound with no way to get it sounding thick and warm. Also with no pole adjustment screws on the pickup you get unbalanced string volumes that you can do nothing about. With no tone control it is a one trick pony also. Mine is also a feedback monster and no matter what I do the high E is way quieter than all the other strings.

**pubylakeg** · 02-04-2015, 06:31 PM

Many thanks for the info vinnyv1k, I was curious because I was thinking along similar lines to entresz, with regards to fitting a CC p/up in an ES-165. So that means that there would be a screw hole in the top that would require some cosmetic attention. Maybe not such a big deal if another pickguard was to be installed though.

**vinnyv1k** · 02-04-2015, 06:51 PM

Just leave the rear screw in. It does anchor the pickguard so it is rock solid. It is a plastic tube type spacer just like the front screw uses that you could shorten to bring the pickguard closer to the top if needed. Or you can buy a new pickguard and use a felt spacer like a L5 Wesmo that would sit on top of the hole and hide it.

**pubylakeg** · 02-05-2015, 07:52 AM

It's curious though, I don't believe that p/guard fixing arrangement occurs on any other Gibson archtop.

**oldane** · 02-05-2015, 08:17 AM

Originally Posted by pubylakeg

It's curious though, I don't believe that p/guard fixing arrangement occurs on any other Gibson archtop.

Could that extra screw into the top be to fix the position of the floating pickup more precisely? With the three point fixation instead of the normal two point fixation, the pickguard can't wobble. For all I know, those BJB pickups are fixed to the pickguard and not the neck extention (I have one in the drawer and it is fitted with a tab for mounting on the pickguard).

Are similar screws found on Johnny Smith guitars and other Gibson guitars with floating pickups?