Wood bridge vs Tune-o-Matic on Ibanez Artcore

**morroben** · 11-19-2011, 11:36 PM

The shop I do tech work at sells Artcores. Most have TOMs but a couple have wood bridges. I haven't researched the previous arguments on this, but I'm surprised that people say you can't hear the difference. I can't hear the difference between maple and rosewood fingerboard, or solid-body and thinline teles (all other things being equal), but I can hear the difference between a TOM and a wood bridge on a hollowbody.
I wouldn't say there's much volume difference, but a TOM makes a hollowbody lean toward semi-hollow tone more so than a wood bridge. Depends on the sound you're going for, but I definitely hear a difference on this one.

**monkmiles** · 11-20-2011, 12:29 AM

I have a wooden bridge on my Ibanez AK105SM. It came with two wood bridges but no TOM bridge. I agree with the above poster about hearing tonal difference with a wooden bridge vs TOM. I can't hear a difference between fretboard wood. I could between body tops though (say maple top vs all mahogany on a les paul). So for jazz, I think I orefr the wooden bridge. But the TOM obviously gives you better, or more control of, intonation.

There's an Ibanez parts website. You might be able to other parts from them if you can't find one.

**Kojo27** · 11-20-2011, 01:16 AM

Originally Posted by martinopass

I have a wooden bridge on my Ibanez AK105SM. It came with two wood bridges but no TOM bridge. I agree with the above poster about hearing tonal difference with a wooden bridge vs TOM. I can't hear a difference between fretboard wood. I could between body tops though (say maple top vs all mahogany on a les paul). So for jazz, I think I orefr the wooden bridge. But the TOM obviously gives you better, or more control of, intonation.

There's an Ibanez parts website. You might be able to other parts from them if you can't find one.

Thanks! I'll try to locate this website...is it part of Ibanez's main site? I play my AF95 unplugged 95% of the time, so I'm gonna go to a wooden bridge/saddle.

While we're talking about Artcores, dig this AF125 top-of-le-line killer deal (2 days left, $265 of this writing) -- a beauty, w/both bridges included: IBANEZ ARTCORE HOLLOW-BODY ELECTRIC JAZZ BLUES GUITAR AF125 CUSTODIAN NATURAL | eBay

**oldane** · 11-20-2011, 07:43 AM

I hear a very audible difference in tone.

The wood bridge sounds darker with less high frequencies. The sustain is often shorter than with a TOM bridge. Traditionally, the ebony bridges is said to be somewhat clearer and tighter in sound than the softer rosewood bridges. That is the general tendency, but in my experience individual wood bridges vary quite a lot depending on the particular piece of wood, the weigth of the bridge, the shape etc. I have one rosewood bridge which has more clarity, tightness and brightness in the tone than all of my ebony bridges. I have tried several wood bridges and even made a few myself through the years, and not two sound the same, despite being made of the same material.

The TOM has a greater clarity in the tones, each string stands out clearer. The all metal TOM bridges have a common trait - a tendency to a "bump" in the frequency spectrum around 2kHz, which is heard as a bit of shrillness or coldness and a little weakness of the low notes and it puts off people who wants a woody and more "acoustic" tone even when amplifed.

Graphtech makes the Resomax NV2 TOM bridge which is made of an aluminium alloy and is much lighter than the traditional TOM brass and steel bridges (like Gibson, Gotoh etc.). The saddles of the Resomax is made of the Graphtech "string saver" material (not metal) which is likely the same as their "Black Tusc" nut material. Reports from internet fora and reviews say that the Resomax NV2 maintains the clarity of a metal TOM but doesn't have the 2kHz bump, and as such it should have a sound between the metal TOM and the wood bridge.

Despite the 2 kHz bump, I have tended to prefer the sound of a TOM for electric playing - and of course I appreciate the precise intonation, but I will give the Resomax NV2 bridge a try in the near future. For acoustic playing, I use wood saddles despite their tuning compromizes.

A small, but not unimportant, practical detail: I don't know why, but many luthiers make bridges with a post spacing different from the standard Gibson spacing (which is 2 29/32") - often 3". If one ever has a bridge made (or a whole guitar), I suggest insisting on the standard Gibson post spacing. I have done that with two guitars I have had made in the last couple of years. That way, one can keep the (hopefully) well fitted bridge base and easily swap the saddle part of the bridge - there is a lot available with that standard post spacing.

**jayx123** · 11-20-2011, 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by jorgemg1984

Same question: Plugged or unplugged? Or both?

plugged it sounded warmer and darker, unplugged couldn't hear much difference

**Tom Karol** · 11-20-2011, 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by Philco

That metal retainer on my TOM is rattling and driving me insane! I can touch it with the plectrum and it stops for a while. Then it waits for a quiet passage and returns. I loath that sound.

You can take the metal retainer off; you just have to be more careful when changing strings.

**jorgemg1984** · 11-20-2011, 09:18 AM

Thanks! I always heard very different opinions about this subject - one of these days I might do a test myself. I thought it would change the unplugged sound but not the plugged sound so much but apparently that's not true.

I once changed the TOM tailpiece on my cheap 335 and did notice a difference in the sound but the stock tailpiece was a cheap one and I put a good Schaller. Maybe people are switching crappy Tom Tailpieces for very good ebony ones?

**Philco** · 11-20-2011, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by Tom Karol

You can take the metal retainer off; you just have to be more careful when changing strings.

Thanks Tom, I'll try that.

**mambosun** · 11-20-2011, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by jorgemg1984

Thanks! I always heard very different opinions about this subject - one of these days I might do a test myself. I thought it would change the unplugged sound but not the plugged sound so much but apparently that's not true.

I once changed the TOM tailpiece on my cheap 335 and did notice a difference in the sound but the stock tailpiece was a cheap one and I put a good Schaller. Maybe people are switching crappy Tom Tailpieces for very good ebony ones?

I doubt, while not being expert myself, that a good versus average TOM are very different tone wise, at least not as much as doing the conversion to wood brigde.
What is exactly your definition of good vs crappy? Intonation? Quality of the metal?

**monkmiles** · 11-20-2011, 11:17 PM

Originally Posted by Kojo27

Thanks! I'll try to locate this website...is it part of Ibanez's main site? I play my AF95 unplugged 95% of the time, so I'm gonna go to a wooden bridge/saddle.

While we're talking about Artcores, dig this AF125 top-of-le-line killer deal (2 days left, $265 of this writing) -- a beauty, w/both bridges included: IBANEZ ARTCORE HOLLOW-BODY ELECTRIC JAZZ BLUES GUITAR AF125 CUSTODIAN NATURAL | eBay

I think its just Ibanez.com | Parts.

That AF125 looks great and is at a great price if it stays that low.

**Kojo27** · 11-21-2011, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by martinopass

I think its just Ibanez.com | Parts.

That AF125 looks great and is at a great price if it stays that low.

Hey, thanks! I'll give a look.

(The AF125 is still low - $327 and 1 day left.)

**monkmiles** · 11-21-2011, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by Kojo27

Hey, thanks! I'll give a look.

(The AF125 is still low - $327 and 1 day left.)

No problem. Geez, if that AF125 remains near this low, someone is going to get a steal.

**Jx30510** · 02-01-2017, 01:34 AM

Reviving the thread, I've just recieved my Epiphone Es175 Premium and am experimenting wth a rosewood bridge Vs the TOM bridge.
For those who say there isn't really a difference?! The difference, to me, with that particular guitar, is night and day.
The wood bridge has less sustain, darker sound, I feel the playability a bit muffled with that definit thunk some love here. The notes have a slight looser attack and a short decay, lesser sustain and release (for those who play analog synths you might hear some known terms here)

The TOM bridge is the opposite, bright and very speedy attack, a lot more sustain and a more electric sound overall, I hear more the electric jazz sound I like with the TOM.

What I could blame the rosewood bridge for is in my opinion giving the impression that the guitar is a bit restrained in it's resonnance capabilities. It was if like something was keeping the strings from giving all it's vibrating potential.

So the difference is just evident for me, and that's pretty cool since it opens the sonic possibilities a lot. I mean the choice you have in the set up, rosewood bridge, TOM, flatwounds, roundwounds, with the mix of all these options, gives you a big flexibility.

For the moment the Epiphone is strung with Pyramid 11s ' and the rosewood bridge (I sanded the base flush with the arch).

It is superb sounding in all ways, the greatest jazz sound I ever had. But I'm not sure yet if I like the muffled "thunk" that much..

I'm going to try the opposite, the TOM with d'Addarios 11-49 roundwounds and see what it'll give.

But overall the Epi Es175 is just a wow guitar, I've had a lot, this one is on par with the best american made I've had considering quality and pure guitaristic pleasure (not hollowbodies, I have never had enough money to buy american jazz brands)

**mambosun** · 02-01-2017, 05:02 AM

Originally Posted by Jx30510

Reviving the thread, I've just recieved my Epiphone Es175 Premium and am experimenting wth a rosewood bridge Vs the TOM bridge.
For those who say there isn't really a difference?! The difference, to me, with that particular guitar, is night and day.
The wood bridge has less sustain, darker sound, I feel the playability a bit muffled with that definit thunk some love here. The notes have a slight looser attack and a short decay, lesser sustain and release (for those who play analog synths you might hear some known terms here)

The TOM bridge is the opposite, bright and very speedy attack, a lot more sustain and a more electric sound overall, I hear more the electric jazz sound I like with the TOM.

What I could blame the rosewood bridge for is in my opinion giving the impression that the guitar is a bit restrained in it's resonnance capabilities. It was if like something was keeping the strings from giving all it's vibrating potential.

So the difference is just evident for me, and that's pretty cool since it opens the sonic possibilities a lot. I mean the choice you have in the set up, rosewood bridge, TOM, flatwounds, roundwounds, with the mix of all these options, gives you a big flexibility.

For the moment the Epiphone is strung with Pyramid 11s ' and the rosewood bridge (I sanded the base flush with the arch).

It is superb sounding in all ways, the greatest jazz sound I ever had. But I'm not sure yet if I like the muffled "thunk" that much..

I'm going to try the opposite, the TOM with d'Addarios 11-49 roundwounds and see what it'll give.

But overall the Epi Es175 is just a wow guitar, I've had a lot, this one is on par with the best american made I've had considering quality and pure guitaristic pleasure (not hollowbodies, I have never had enough money to buy american jazz brands)

Thank you for this very interesting insight, not to mention this could help people like me who dreamt for years about having the real but unaffordable Es 175 to think about it twice !
While I share your findings about Rosewood vs TOM bridge in terms of sustain and intonation, I prefer the former in terms of overall tone.

**Jx30510** · 02-01-2017, 07:26 AM

Yes the Epi really sounds great and has all I have searched in a jazz guitar.
I've had essantially Peerless guitars (Gigmaster, Retromatic), a Washburn J6 and also an Epiphone Sheraton 2 (1995 MIK)
The Premium is superior, the pickups must be a big reason, but the neck is great. A one piece mahogany neck, 100%, even the headstock.
I'm pretty sure this has a positive effect in the vibration transfer. The fretwork is also top notch, and overall construction simple, clean, flawless.
A superb value, and just plain simple great instrument.
I'll change the tuners and have a bone nut made just for pure pleasure bonus, because everything is fine as is.

**HansOlthof** · 02-06-2017, 01:49 AM

Hi,
I've got an AF125 and both bridges. The wooden one is rosewood as is the common base. I replaced the TOM with a Gotoh one.
I the wooden one is more dull to my ears. It's also a pain for intonation.
The Gotoh replacement was definitely a step up over the original TOM.
I got a bigger overall improvement in tone by ensuring that the bridge feet were correctly shaped to the top.
Hope this helps.
Hans

**r_cc_c** · 02-06-2017, 02:18 AM

I used to have a Ibanez AF75. I started with the TOM and later switch to a wood bridge.

Beside the tone different mentioned, TOM give you a smoother decay on the high frequency overtone which sound more like a solid body electric guitar.
The wood bridge produce a more staccato sound, where the high frequency overtone decay much faster. To me, this sound more like a jazz guitar.

AF75 has laminated top, back and side.

**KirkP** · 02-06-2017, 03:24 AM

I was much happier with my Ibanez AF105 once I replaced the TOM with an Ibanez wood bridge. It got rid of a metalic "tink" that was bugging me, and seemed to make the wound vs unwound strings sound more uniform in tone. I dislike having a change in tone between the wound and unwound strings. I'm using Rotosound Monel flatwound strings on that instrument.

**balthazar** · 02-06-2017, 02:30 PM

Hi,

Using an Ibanez AG95 with TI flatwound 12-50, I switched from a TOM to an ebony bridge.
I have found the sound I was looking for!
But it's a matter of taste.

**coolvinny** · 02-06-2017, 07:30 PM

There is a third option for any archtop guitar with a floating bridge: have a bone saddle made for your wooden bridge (or have a new bridge made with a bone saddle). It will give you a bit more acoustic volume and a slightly brighter tone. Not quite as bright as a tune-a-matic. If you have a new ebony bridge with a bone saddle carved I think it will cost around $100.

**palindrome** · 02-07-2017, 05:30 AM

I've owned three Artcore Customs (AF105, AK105, PM35) plus a bunch of rosewood and TOM bridges (a welcome spinoff of buying and selling these specific guitars), which I switched at least a dozen times on each of the three.

I kept coming back to the rosewood bridges, and I agree that the difference was very noticeable. The intonation tradeoffs were acceptable (YMMV). One real shortcoming was that the rosewood bridges were liable to introduce one or two specific notes which I found to be deader than acceptable (i.e. sustain just _too_ short), which was a non-issue with the TOM bridges.

**Jx30510** · 02-07-2017, 07:12 AM

I've tried the two options on my Epiphone Es175 Premium.
I definately prefer the TOM bridge with Roundwounds.. rather than the rosewood with flatwounds. I'm not enough of a jazz guitarist to content myself of the classic jazz setup.
I feel very much more confortamble with Rounds and Tom. In fact I play much better, because the ringing overtones that the Rounds + TOM suit my style better.
I will have to try the rosewood bridge with the roundwounds though. That may be a good mix for me. Experimenting is very nice on hollowbodies, it's easy to search for YOUR tone, which is very positive to find ones proper identity.

**Fak0u** · 03-22-2017, 09:36 AM

Wood bridge vs Tune-o-Matic on Ibanez Artcore-9950491_800-jpg

Anyone tried this bridge ?
wooden bridge with movable plastic saddles.
I can't stand the rattling sound coming from my TOM on my ES175 but I'm very picky about intonation !

Göldo HW157 Jazz-Guitar Bridge - Thomann UK

**Jx30510** · 03-22-2017, 10:31 AM

Well it looks strange and has an odd design.
But why wouldn't it work ? Wes had nylon saddles on his L5 didn't he?
And it's less than 20€ so no big deal after all. If it doesn't work you can send it back
no fuss trying in my view

**Aquilador** · 05-01-2017, 05:16 AM

Originally Posted by balthazar

Hi,

Using an Ibanez AG95 with TI flatwound 12-50, I switched from a TOM to an ebony bridge.
I have found the sound I was looking for!
But it's a matter of taste.

Great to hear you say this as I have an AG95 with a TOM and have just ordered a cheap ebony bridge to try out.
I am expecting to have intonation problems but it may be that step in the right direction to find that 'muted' sound that I love.
I, too, have TI flat 12s on mine and was even contemplating a set of 13s next time, but I'm not sure that the nut will take them, so trying the ebony bridge will be a nice venture for me.