Is this humbucker out of phase with itself?

[Herbie]

I have a 1984 Gibson ES-175. It has the Shaw humbuckers and I play usually only the neck pickup, which I like a lot.

Sometimes I wonder the thin sound of the bridge pickup. Could the coils in it be in out of phase?

Or do all the ES-175 bridge pickups sound as thin as this?

1984 ES-175 – Is the bridge pu out of phase? - YouTube

The pickups are about as close to the strings:

[John A.]

That sounds normal to me. It's common for the bridge pickup to be thinner/quieter than the neck pickup, all else equal. That's why it has also become common for people to use hotter pickups in the bridge position and/or set the two pickups at different heights.

[garybaldy]

Mine sounds like that

[icr]

Sounds normal to me also. I use the bridge humbucker frequently. I know Gibson's recommendation, but I just measured all my Gibson archtops with bridge humbuckers and I have set them from 4 to 5 mm to get a nice neck-position tone through a clean amp.

You might try lowering the pickup and seeing how that affects the sound.

[Bob_Ross]

Sometimes I wonder the thin sound of the bridge pickup. Could the coils in it be in out of phase?

They'd better be, otherwise it wouldn't be humbucking!

[GuyBoden]

They'd better be, otherwise it wouldn't be humbucking!

Humbuckers have two coils with opposite wind and opposite polarity, the wire is connected. It's a bit different than out of phase.

[Bob_Ross]

Humbuckers have two coils with opposite wind and opposite polarity, the wire is connected. It's a bit different than out of phase.

I was assuming that OP was making the common colloquial error of equating "phase" with "polarity"

I'm also assuming that you know there is no difference between
A) having two coils in the same pickup wired "out of phase" and
B) having those two coils in the same pickup wired with "opposite polarity"

The "opposite wind" (direction) is of course part of what makes a humbucking pickup work...but that's a mechanical feature that can't be measured with a polarity tester or a phase scope.

[twtunes]

Unless wound much fatter than the neck pickup, a bridge pickup will have a smaller output, given the smaller string movement.

I set my neck pickup as low as possible, to balance with the bridge p.u. (And this with underwound neck pickup.) A reason for the characteristic Telecaster sound is its fat bridge pickup and very small neck p.u.

[Herbie]

I was assuming that OP was making the common colloquial error of equating "phase" with "polarity"

I'm also assuming that you know there is no difference between
A) having two coils in the same pickup wired "out of phase" and
B) having those two coils in the same pickup wired with "opposite polarity"

The "opposite wind" (direction) is of course part of what makes a humbucking pickup work...but that's a mechanical feature that can't be measured with a polarity tester or a phase scope.

No, I know how the humbucker coils are wound. In ”out of phase” I mean the ”out of phase” sound, that sharp thin out of phase sound.

I could have tested it by changing the wires of another coil in the humbucker, but this is 40 years old guitar and nobody has touched to the electronics, so I rather don’t be the one who starts to tinker with it.

[pcjazz]

I don’t know about the pickups but I think that’s one of Ed Bickert’s shirts.

[Strat-itis]

Echoing the first 2 comments saying it's normal. Traditional PAFs are wound similarly between the neck and bridge so the neck's aperture makes it full but the bridge's will be quite thin. If you don't want this you have to take it upon yourself to remedy it somehow, not blame the pickups that are built like that. Eq, darker pots and cap for that pickup, hotter pickup, double thick mag, etc.

[Bob_Ross]

No, I know how the humbucker coils are wound. In ”out of phase” I mean the ”out of phase” sound, that sharp thin out of phase sound.

Right, that sound is achieved by being "out of phase" (aka out of polarity) with regards to the other pickup, not between two coils of the same pickup.

[Herbie]

I don’t know about the pickups but I think that’s one of Ed Bickert’s shirts.

Hah! I bought the shirt last summer from a second hand store in Tampere, Finland, so that’s where his old clothings have arrived!

I have to try it on me on my next gig, if it finally helped to free the master inside me! Or at least play the solos in the right key!

[Herbie]

That sounds normal to me. It's common for the bridge pickup to be thinner/quieter than the neck pickup, all else equal. That's why it has also become common for people to use hotter pickups in the bridge position and/or set the two pickups at different heights.

I have played Les Pauls with hb’s for decades, but now I realise that this in my first ES-175 with two hb’s, so the thinness of the bridge pu sound was kind of a surprise. With LPs and roundwound strings it somehow is more ”natural”. Especially with overdrive pedal on!