ID'ing a Benedetto

[markb]

Can any tell or have an educated guess if this Benedetto is a carved top Bambino Elite? Or another model?
.

[fabiansey]

Yes, Bambino Elite.
I play the Bravo Elite which is a bit bigger. Wonderful guitar. Very acoustic sound through the great b6 pickup

[Gitterbug]

Agreed. The std Bambino doesn't have F-holes.

[jads57]

Always wanted to try one of these in person! I’m smitten with my Bambino Std. and feel very happy to own it again,Lol!

[markb]

Can anyone tell me the birthdate of this Bambino Elite? Did a quick search and didn't find much info.

[Steve Z]

Finding the date it was made… Best bet would be to give the Benedetto shop a call. Many years ago I called with questions about a bravo deluxe I bought. Very nice customer service.

[Gitterbug]

Hi! The Savannah operation was set up in 2006. "S" in the serial number means Savannah, and the serial numbers start from 1000. My Bravo is an early one, S1054. It came to Finland after NAMM 2007.

The current numbers are in the 3,000s, meaning over 2,000 guitars in 19 years. A couple of 2009 guitars have serial numbers around 1,800, suggesting that the pace of production has slowed down and/or focused on more expensive models. By intrapolation, 2008 is not wide off the mark for the Bambino Elite in question.

[sgosnell]

The Bambino Deluxe, in between the standard Bambino and the Elite, does have soundholes. I own one. It's a very nice guitar, but laminated, not solid carved. I've emailed the Benedetto shop several times searching for information on different guitars, and they have been very friendly and informative. They can tell you exactly when a guitar was made, from the serial number. Jackson Evans would be the contact to start with.
[email protected]

[markb]

I actually was actually able to talk with Howard Paul and he informed me that the guitar was made in April of 2008. I now own the guitar and it truly is an heirloom piece. Absolutely stunning. I'm probably not worthy but honored to be it's custodian. Here are a few unsolicited photos.

[Gitterbug]

Congratulations!!!

[markb]

Thank you for the information you gave earlier in this post.

[markb]

There's a bit of an issue with the pickup. The guitar was stored for years. Very low volume from what I think it should be and a possible ground issue. An easy fix hopefully.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Congratulations! It's a beautiful guitar and a true treasure for you.

I think that's an early Benedetto B6 pickup in it. These were designed for best tone when sitting well below the strings. There's even a fairly thick layer of epoxy between the pickup innards and the top of the case to make sure it's not too close to the strings. The specs suggest a hot pickup, but it's not at all high output. So even when running as intended, output is lower than many / most modern humbuckers.

The early ones had 4 wires, along with a bare ground lead. Green + bare are to be grounded together. Black is the signal lead. The red and the white were from the two coils, and they were to be connected together and protected with shrink wrap or tape for normal humbucking operation. You could also connect the red and white together to a switch that would let you ground them for a switchable single coil output.

If the red and white leads somehow got disconnected from each other, there'd be no output at all. So that's not the problem unless the white wire is now unintentionally grounded. It's possible that whatever insulation was over the red / white junction has come apart and there's contact with a grounded surface like the back of a pot (which would put it in single coil mode). But it's a bit more likely that your guitar has a push-pull or push-push pot to switch it to single coil, and you're just not aware of it. Try pulling up on the knobs - you'll know soon enough if one is push-pull. If that doesn't work, push on each knob. If one is a push-push, it'll depress and click. Hopefuly, that's all it is. My B7 is wired for splitting, and it works great - but there's a very noticeable reduction in output when set to single coil.

Single coil mode on my B7 is quite noisy where there's any electromagnetic interference. In SC mode, it was as noisy at the club in which I used to play regularly as any early Strat. This could cause you to suspect a grounding problem - but it's just a jazz box's version of the good old "sound of Fender".

Later ones (and I don't know the date of the change) have 2 insulated leads (B & W) plus a bare wire. Black is signal and bare is ground. For humbucking operation, the white is simply taped off. If you ground the white, you remove one coil from the circuit so it's operating as a SC with reduced output.

The B pickups are embedded in epoxy, so it's unikely that there's an internal problem in the pickup. You can check it with a multimeter across the black and green leads - the reading should be 12 kOhms with one lead disconnected from anything else. If it's significantly different from this (like 6 kOhm or below), there's an internal problem and the pickup needs to be replaced. but, again, this is pretty rare in a B 6 or 7.

[markb]

Congratulations! It's a beautiful guitar and a true treasure for you.

I think that's an early Benedetto B6 pickup in it. These were designed for best tone when sitting well below the strings. There's even a fairly thick layer of epoxy between the pickup innards and the top of the case to make sure it's not too close to the strings. The specs suggest a hot pickup, but it's not at all high output. So even when running as intended, output is lower than many / most modern humbuckers.

The early ones had 4 wires, along with a bare ground lead. Green + bare are to be grounded together. Black is the signal lead. The red and the white were from the two coils, and they were to be connected together and protected with shrink wrap or tape for normal humbucking operation. You could also connect the red and white together to a switch that would let you ground them for a switchable single coil output.

If the red and white leads somehow got disconnected from each other, there'd be no output at all. So that's not the problem unless the white wire is now unintentionally grounded. It's possible that whatever insulation was over the red / white junction has come apart and there's contact with a grounded surface like the back of a pot (which would put it in single coil mode). But it's a bit more likely that your guitar has a push-pull or push-push pot to switch it to single coil, and you're just not aware of it. Try pulling up on the knobs - you'll know soon enough if one is push-pull. If that doesn't work, push on each knob. If one is a push-push, it'll depress and click. Hopefuly, that's all it is. My B7 is wired for splitting, and it works great - but there's a very noticeable reduction in output when set to single coil.

Single coil mode on my B7 is quite noisy where there's any electromagnetic interference. In SC mode, it was as noisy at the club in which I used to play regularly as any early Strat. This could cause you to suspect a grounding problem - but it's just a jazz box's version of the good old "sound of Fender".

Later ones (and I don't know the date of the change) have 2 insulated leads (B & W) plus a bare wire. Black is signal and bare is ground. For humbucking operation, the white is simply taped off. If you ground the white, you remove one coil from the circuit so it's operating as a SC with reduced output.

The B pickups are embedded in epoxy, so it's unikely that there's an internal problem in the pickup. You can check it with a multimeter across the black and green leads - the reading should be 12 kOhms with one lead disconnected from anything else. If it's significantly different from this (like 6 kOhm or below), there's an internal problem and the pickup needs to be replaced. but, again, this is pretty rare in a B 6 or 7.

Thank you @nevershouldofsoldit! The tone knob "pulled" into dual coil and wah lah. Feel a bit foolish for not knowing or noticing. And yes the depressed tone knob (single coil) is quite a lot lower in output with much more single coil noise. I don't see ever using the single coil option. It's interesting that the humbucker mode is the pulled up position. Or is it?? Thank you again from "pulling" me back from the ledge

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Thank you @nevershouldofsoldit! The tone knob "pulled" into dual coil and wah lah. Feel a bit foolish for not knowing or noticing. And yes the depressed tone knob (single coil) is quite a lot lower in output with much more single coil noise. I don't see ever using the single coil option. It's interesting that the humbucker mode is the pulled up position. Or is it?? Thank you again from "pulling" me back from the ledge

Depending on the switch in the switched pot, you may be able to reverse the connections so that it's in HB with the shaft collapsed. I use DPDT switched pots because I got a few on sale, and thse can be wired either way. Some CTS push-pull pots have SPST switches, so you'd have to be able to buy them "normally open" or "normally closed" to choose whether SC is engaged with shaft up or down. The StewMac website doesn't say whether the CTS pots are N-O or N-C and whether you get a choice.

Most of the push-pull pots I'e used stood well above the top when in pull mode, which I used to displike - so I usd push-[ush pots for years. But I've forgotten in which position I left it a few times and started to play with it set to the wrong position for what I was playing. So I now use push-pull pots with the "in" position wired for my more common setting (which is humbucking). I got used to having the knob a bit above the other one, and I far prefer knowing how it's set to having both knobs at the same height all the time.

The SC setting has a few good uses for me. It's less bass-y, which makes it more useful for chunky comping. When pretending I'm Freddie Green, I keep the volume lower so the noise is less obtrusive (and often unobtrusive). The tones from my set pickup archtops are more "acoustic" in SC, and there are tunes for which I prefer this. The SC setting is also more resistant to feedback, which comes in handy when I use an archtop on blues gigs. Pinch harmonics are also easier to create and control in SC.

Enjoy that beauty! I've looked long and often at 7 string versions of the working man's Benedettos - they're mighty tempting, and I'd love to have one.

[Gitterbug]

My Bravo (A6 PU) is HB push, SC pull. Very handy switching between solo and comping mode, the latter being brighter. This feature was removed from later models for reasons unknown to me. You need a pretty hot PU for the single-coil mode to be of any use. I felt the original PUs on my Yamaha SA-2200 were too hot and had them replaced with Seymour Duncans (Jazz on neck, JB on bridge). Cleaner HB sound with no "sawtooth" around chords, but feeble single-coil.

[markb]

My Bravo (A6 PU) is HB push, SC pull. Very handy switching between solo and comping mode, the latter being brighter. This feature was removed from later models for reasons unknown to me. You need a pretty hot PU for the single-coil mode to be of any use. I felt the original PUs on my Yamaha SA-2200 were too hot and had them replaced with Seymour Duncans (Jazz on neck, JB on bridge). Cleaner HB sound with no "sawtooth" around chords, but feeble single-coil.

Nice! I get having the option between single and HB depending on the tune or phrase. Interesting that mine has the single coil enabled with the tone knob in the pulled (up) position. The volume drop in single mode is pretty dramatic though. As nevershouldhavesoldit pointed out I may look into "reversing" the operation of the push/pull and at the same time check why there may be such a volume difference. Thank you for your comments and knowledge.

[sgosnell]

Having the push-pull reversed, along with the low volume, indicates to me that someone may have rewired the guitar, and possibly miswired it. Benedetto will provide a wiring diagram for how it should be wired. Rewiring one of those isn't the easiest job that could be imagined, but it's doable. If you're worried, have a competent tech do the work.

[markb]

Having the push-pull reversed, along with the low volume, indicates to me that someone may have rewired the guitar, and possibly miswired it. Benedetto will provide a wiring diagram for how it should be wired. Rewiring one of those isn't the easiest job that could be imagined, but it's doable. If you're worried, have a competent tech do the work.

Yes. After texting with Howard Paul I may remove (have it done) the split coil option all together. He gave me the information lead I or my tech would need to do so. Or at least have it reversed. If it were a Strat or Tele I'd attempt to do it myself but not with this guitar.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Yes. After texting with Howard Paul I may remove (have it done) the split coil option all together. He gave me the information lead I or my tech would need to do so. Or at least have it reversed. If it were a Strat or Tele I'd attempt to do it myself but not with this guitar.

You first said that the tone knob “pulled into dual coil”, which would be backwards. But you then said that it pulls inti SC, which is correct.

I suspect the guitar is fine and exactly as it came from the factory if pulling up on the knob puts it in SC. The volume drop and noise are normal in SC. I’d leave it alone and love it. If you never use it, you can ignore the coil split switch.

I strongly doubt that anyone would have reversed the switch wiring.

[Jabberwocky]

Congrats, markb. I'd have loved a carved top Bambino Élite.

[markb]

Long day..I was right the first time. HB engaged with the tone knob pulled up. Single coil when depressed. Which I thought was odd. Every other coil tap guitar that I've had or been around that had a push/pull the split coil was in the up/pulled position. Sorry for the confusion.

"I suspect the guitar is fine and exactly as it came from the factory if pulling up on the knob puts it in SC. The volume drop and noise are normal in SC. I’d leave it alone and love it. If you never use it, you can ignore the coil split switch."

Exactly! Even if it's backwards I could live with that.

[fabiansey]

So beautiful.
The prices for new Instruments are really high but for a used Instrument they are in reach.
To me the new Benedettos have the highest build quality I have ever seen and I have owned several L5 had a Koentopp and own a GREAT Trenier. Of course sound is more subjectiv. My Bravo Elite is extremely acoustic so very different to a Gibson ces model. I prefer the acoustic sound for my fingerstyle stuff, especially when you use a mix of the acoustic and electric sound.
enjoy your great guitar

[fabiansey]

My Bravo (A6 PU) is HB push, SC pull. Very handy switching between solo and comping mode, the latter being brighter. This feature was removed from later models for reasons unknown to me. You need a pretty hot PU for the single-coil mode to be of any use. I felt the original PUs on my Yamaha SA-2200 were too hot and had them replaced with Seymour Duncans (Jazz on neck, JB on bridge). Cleaner HB sound with no "sawtooth" around chords, but feeble single-coil.

I read that several guitars with coil tap developed Problems so it was stopped. I once had a Bambino with coil tap and when switching the Sound sometimes stopped

[markb]

I read that several guitars with coil tap developed Problems so it was stopped. I once had a Bambino with coil tap and when switching the Sound sometimes stopped

Yes. In my conversion with Howard he alluded to this. He pretty much encouraged removing the coil tap altogether.