Archtop Recommendations Under 1000 Euro

[Sigmund451]

If you want a compensating bridge you can grab one online. Just get the top portion, the saddle. I got one from Rall Guitar in germany. It was 13 euro plus shipping. With many guitars, if you use a wound string and the bridge is not compensated the G will never play in tune in both spots. Its a cheap easy fix to have a saddle for wound and unwound g's if you have not decided which you prefer. It just takes a few minutes to carefully space the srings and notch the top (shallow notches).

[Jx30510]

This is a good decision if you don't bond with it.
There are so many options

[frabarmus]

So the loar arrived! I played it for a few hours and inspected it. I noticed that the frets aren't beveled on the sides, as I'd expect on a mid-range instrument. No matter how you position the wooden bridge, you can never get the G string in tune at the 12 fret. The pickup doesn't produce a very warm sound, as I expected; it's bright and metallic. I didn't feel like I was holding a well-made guitar; I don't know why, but it's just my hands. I really wanted to fall in love with this guitar, but I think I'll return it.

I can't help but recommend going to a decent guitar shop (it's worth the trip), so you can try, hands on and hear with your own ears before buying. For a Grant Green tone an Epiphone Casino (just over 1000 euros, if I'm not mistaken) would fit the profile, and for a Jazzy feel and tone anything like an Ibanez AF55 is, in my opinion, good enough value for the money. I've got one and I swapped the neck pickup with a Gibson P94 and had it set up by a luthier. It sounds and plays great.

[frabarmus]

P.S. Sorry, the Casino is not "just over" 1000 Euros, it's actually well under (good news!).

EPIPHONE Casino Pro Natural | Strumenti Musicali .net

[Hammertone]

There are many excellent German archtop guitars available under your budget price. The Höfner 455/456/457/463 models have almost no vintage value, and many have already been modified or desperately need some refreshing after @50-60 years, so, they are easy to modify with whatever pickups and hardware you want. Here's one I just put together for a student out of old parts and new parts. Fantastic guitar.

[Hammertone]

Typical listings:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/135924234681...Bk9SR-zn3u_BZg

https://www.ebay.de/itm/157370985321...Bk9SR-rn3u_BZg

https://www.ebay.de/itm/326293011290...Bk9SR9Stg_DBZg

This one as already been subjected to the treatment:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/225477097186...Bk9SR6jghvDBZg

[Jx30510]

Hammertone, that's interesting. Which one of these German archtops is in the league of a Gibson ES125, or US Guild ?
The ones I see seem to have kinda high action and fragile neck joints..

[Hammertone]

Hammertone, that's interesting. Which one of these German archtops is in the league of a Gibson ES125, or US Guild ? The ones I see seem to have kinda high action and fragile neck joints..

I've handled hundred and hundreds of them since 1984. Plenty of them are in that league. More later ... on the road right now....

There is a fundamental difference between Höfner archtops built from the post-war period to @1969, and Höfner archtops built since then. I'll add pix (easy enough to find) later.

The earlier design is similar in most ways to that used for violins, violas, 'cellos and upright basses. The neck is joined to the body at the 14th fret with a shallow, tapered mortise joint, and the fretboard beyond the @15th fret floats over the top plate, supported by a spruce extension that is glued to the maple neck.

Höfner changed its laminate pressing molds @1969. They also changed many of their f-hole designs. The new plate curvatures made it easier to use much larger neck blocks, cut much larger slots for bolt-on (didn't last long) and glued-in necks, and have positive contact between the underside of the entire neck and the top of the guitar. They moved from tapered neck heel mortises, first to a no-heel design (like gluing a Fender neck into a guitar) to straight neck heel mortises that look more American.

The later design is quite similar to that used on many American guitars. Höfner did not make large quantities of any these archtop guitars from @1970-2018, when they stopped making any of them. Many of the models made from @1970-1990 sell for remarkably little money on platforms like ebay.de, but they are excellent guitars, as good as any comparable models from Gibson or Guild.

There were new and updated archtop model introductions @1999/2000 and beyond, but those instruments (Jazzica Custom, New President, Vice President, Thin President, Chancellor, New Committee) typically resell for well above your stated budget.

One of the members here, QsDuesBlues, has at least a couple of archtops from the post-1969 period, and can speak to their quality. Here are pix of his 17"+ Model 477 and his 16"+ Model 457/S. Neither have pickups but those would be very easy to install, and versions with pickups are more typical. More pix of examples of other "modern" electric models as well, attached. These are typically all-laminated Models 477/S/E1 & E2 (17" w/Florentine cutaway), 457/S/E2 (16"), and 463/S/E2 (16" w/coloured purfiling). Mostly a bit above your budget, but many sell below that number as well, because very few people now or care about them. Excellent guitars.

Information to come about the earlier Höfners, which can be excellent guitars so long as their necks are properly set and their hardware is properly serviced or replaced. One of my mottos: "I reset the necks on Höfner archtops every 50 years, whether they need it or not."

[Jx30510]

Thanks. Good to hear !

[Giannig]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I've been playing the Loar a few times these days. I've noticed that by turning the mids and bass down to almost zero and leaving a little treble on my amp the sound becomes more manageable and less harsh. I'm still trying to decide whether or not to send it back to the seller. I've noticed that I can hear something strange on the fretboard when I go towards the higher frets. Does anyone know anything about Loar fretboards and how to tell if they're made properly?

[Giannig]

I also tried an Eastman AR 503CE these days and was pleasantly surprised by the neck and fingerboard. The acoustic sound was very balanced and the volume and tone pots also worked well. It seemed like a good quality instrument and would only cost €150 more than my loar.

[Sigmund451]

Im really happy with my Eastman 810. I put on a different pickup and did a little fret work but I really love it.
Eastman pots are weird as you will read in reviews.
If I were performing Id change them. They are very touchy and heavily crowned at one end.

[Bill C]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I've been playing the Loar a few times these days. I've noticed that by turning the mids and bass down to almost zero and leaving a little treble on my amp the sound becomes more manageable and less harsh. I'm still trying to decide whether or not to send it back to the seller. I've noticed that I can hear something strange on the fretboard when I go towards the higher frets. Does anyone know anything about Loar fretboards and how to tell if they're made properly?

could the odd sound be a little “back buzz” - ie the string resonating between the nut and where you are fretting the string?

I’ve had this on one or two new guitars and adjusting the truss rod just a touch to add a little more “bow” fixed it if I remember correctly.

[Giannig]

Questo strano suono potrebbe essere dovuto a un leggero "back buzz", ovvero la corda che risuona tra il capotasto e il punto in cui la si preme?

Ho avuto questo problema su una o due chitarre nuove e, se non ricordo male, ho risolto il problema regolando leggermente il truss rod per aggiungere un po' più di "archetto".

No, I'm not talking about that. It's more about the feel of the neck and the fingerboard.

[Giannig]

Im really happy with my Eastman 810. I put on a different pickup and did a little fret work but I really love it.
Eastman pots are weird as you will read in reviews.
If I were performing Id change them. They are very touchy and heavily crowned at one end.

I didn't notice. I was too busy playing it and trying out voicings on the upper part of the fretboard which I found wide and comfortable.

[AllanAllen]

Hammertone, that's interesting. Which one of these German archtops is in the league of a Gibson ES125, or US Guild ?
The ones I see seem to have kinda high action and fragile neck joints..

A Kay, Silvertone or Harmony is in the same league as an ES125. They're overpriced because they say Gibson. So disappointing to find one and try it out. Cardboard archtop.

I think I'm feeling grumpy today

[Sigmund451]

It sound like you might have found your guitar.

Go back and play it again. You might bring it home.

Im glad I have mine.

[joe2758]

A Kay, Silvertone or Harmony is in the same league as an ES125. They're overpriced because they say Gibson. So disappointing to find one and try it out. Cardboard archtop.

I think I'm feeling grumpy today

How many have you played? I had one for a few years, it was my first expensive guitar. 1964 I think. I can see your point about a cheaper feel SORT of, but those other brands can't be set up to play perfectly and they don't sound good.

[joe2758]

Although I did have Harmony parlor that I loved and played nice...but i can't say it sounded any better than "charming"

[Bill C]

How many have you played? I had one for a few years, it was my first expensive guitar. 1964 I think. I can see your point about a cheaper feel SORT of, but those other brands can't be set up to play perfectly and they don't sound good.

Yes, the 125 is a really good guitar and pretty similar to a P90 175. OK, the neck joins the body without the “elevation” (is that what it’s called?) you have on the 175, there’s no cutaway or fancy cosmetics, but it’s old Gibson wood/laminate and that counts for a lot in terms of tone and playability (imo). I owned one about 15 years ago and turned down a P90 175 because the 125 sounded and played better.

[Jx30510]

So an ES125 is just a ES175 without the cutaway (not talking about the pickups)?

[Bill C]

The 125 fingerboard is flush to the top of the body, like a flat-top, not elevated like the 175. The body and neck construction use the same woods as typically found on the 175, ie laminated body, mahogany neck, rosewood fretboard. The sound isn’t the same, the 175 typically has a little more of the “thunk”” to my ears. The non-cutaway body is arguably superior acoustically.

[Christian Miller]

My advice would be to get a professional setup if you decide to keep it


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[bananafist]

I agree with Christian Millers comment re setup, but it sounds as though the Eastman is appealing more to you. They are well made. A good setup is always worthwhile to get the best from a guitar. Good luck.

[Christian Miller]

Tbh I bought the Loar because it has that strident early archtop sound. Those guitars don’t sound like Eastman’s.


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