Fender 68 Custom Vibro Champ Reverb

[Jim Soloway]

I'm talking about the modern reimaging of the 5 watt tube amp, digital reverb and a 10" speaker. Ignoring the retail price, does anyone have one, had one, have any opinions on it etc.

[ruger9]

I've never played one, but I've got my eye on it. Every demo/review I have seen, even impromptu ones (meaning people talking about the amp without have been given one by Fender to review), is raves. Everybody loves that little thing.

[stevo58]

I never played the Fender, but ten years ago, when I was building a lot of amps, I built four Vibro Champ Reverbs. It seemed like such an obvious thing to do. Of all the amps I built, those were the ones that players would try and want. Five watts, reverb, killer tremolo, light, small … what more can you ask for?

Mine were a bit different than the Fender - tube reverb, with mix and dwell; a couple had much bigger output transformers; they all had footswitchable “raw” controls; and a variety of speaker configurations - but still a Champ at heart.

It’s a great blueprint for a great little amp. I’ve been wanting to test the Fender, I’ll bet it’s perfect.

[Little Jay]

I’ve played one in a rehearsal room and I really liked it. It held it’s ground with a (not loud) drummer . To me it sounded like a mini twin reverb , classic BF/SF tone, just not as loud.

[Jim Soloway]

Hello. If you are in the market for a 1x10 with all tube reverb and tremolo, the Supro Amulet combo is a nice sounding amp and option to the Fender Vibro Champ. It also has a 3-way switchable power attenuator for 15watts, 5watts, and 1watt. Lists for $1199.00 and sells for around $1020.00 new. Same price range as the Fender Champ also.
Amulet 1x10 - Supro USA

My interest stems primarily from the fact that there's a used one available ten minutes from my home.

[Woodstove]

My interest stems primarily from the fact that there's a used one available ten minutes from my home.

Can you stop by and test it out Jim? Please let us know what you think if you do.

[Jim Soloway]

Can you stop by and test it out Jim? Please let us know what you think if you do.

I suggested a price I might be willing to pay and he said no. So unless he changes his mind, I won't get the opportunity.

[Alter]

A friend has one, I played it loud and really liked it. Unlike the older champs it had great headroom, definitely loud enough for quiet gigs. It really reminded me of my vintage Princeton reverb. I'm buying it at some point for sure.

Only thing I didn't like was the digital reverb. It was a nice hall type reverb, but a spring one would be more appropriate for my taste.

[Sam Sherry]

Actually, I just took the opposite approach: ca. 1983 Fender "Rivera" Super Champ.
> Champ box w/ 10" speaker, 2x 6V6 and spring reverb
> Hand-wired all-tube (but solid-state rectifier)
> Basic circuit is very Princeton-like but solid-state rectifier and biased hot @ 18W
> Nice master-volume
> Doodads like recording line-out and pull +mid
> Pull for cascading distortion (unfortunately utilizing the reverb recovery stage, but I never use it anyway)

Mine came with a 1974 Jensen P10N rated at 50W. With the master running hot it delivers surprising bottom at home. I was planning to bring it out tomorrow night; we'll see how it goes in a club.

[John H. Power]

A friend has one, I played it loud and really liked it. Unlike the older champs it had great headroom, definitely loud enough for quiet gigs. It really reminded me of my vintage Princeton reverb. I'm buying it at some point for sure.

Only thing I didn't like was the digital reverb. It was a nice hall type reverb, but a spring one would be more appropriate for my taste.

I just took delivery on one and when I turned it on after about 30 seconds I heard what I would describe as a low hum. Just enough to make me think something isn't right. Nothing plugged in and turning any and all knobs had no effect. When I unplugged the speaker cable it stopped.

My friend has a new Princeton and when that is turned on there is no low hum sound. It is quiet. So my question is simple. When you initially turned on the amp was it quiet or did you notice any type of hum? If you do not remember maybe you could ask your friend if he has noticed that. I like the amp but if what I am hearing is not what should be expected with this model I may send it back.

Thanks.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

I just took delivery on one and when I turned it on after about 30 seconds I heard what I would describe as a low hum. Just enough to make me think something isn't right. Nothing plugged in and turning any and all knobs had no effect. When I unplugged the speaker cable it stopped.

When you unplug the speaker cable, no sound will come out regardless of what the amp is doing. That’s not a test of anything.

FWIW, most traditional tube amps do not tolerate an open output circuit. Run a high level signal into the input and you can blow output tubes rather dramatically.

[alltunes]

I bought one played through it for about an hour and promptly returned it. I especially did not like it next to my 78 Vibro Champ which sounded bigger and fuller. And I agree the reverb was so so.

The Victoria 518 is a far superior amp but alas they have crept up in price the last few years.

My solution to getting a Champ style amp but with reverb was an expensive one….a Headstrong Santa Cruz with a 10”. But I absolutely love it.

[John H. Power]

When you unplug the speaker cable, no sound will come out regardless of what the amp is doing. That’s not a test of anything.

FWIW, most traditional tube amps do not tolerate an open output circuit. Run a high level signal into the input and you can blow output tubes rather dramatically.

Thanks but I would still appreciate an answer if you can give it to my main question. When you turned it on and before you started playing anything did you hear an type of discernible hum?

I do not know what an open output circuit is but I will look it up and I am not sure what produce a "a high level signal." My knowledge of amplifiers is limited since I have be playing mainly unamplified acoustic instruments hence the several posts/questions I have posted on this forum relating to amplifiers.

[Tal_175]

I’ve played one in a rehearsal room and I really liked it. It held it’s ground with a (not loud) drummer . To me it sounded like a mini twin reverb , classic BF/SF tone, just not as loud.

So is it like a low wattage and lighter Princeton?

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Thanks but I would still appreciate an answer if you can give it to my main question. When you turned it on and before you started playing anything did you hear an type of discernible hum?

I do not know what an open output circuit is but I will look it up and I am not sure what produce a "a high level signal." My knowledge of amplifiers is limited since I have be playing mainly unamplified acoustic instruments hence the several posts/questions I have posted on this forum relating to amplifiers.

An open output circuit is what you have when there’s nothing connected to the speaker jack or wires - the resistance to the output signal is infinite. Connecting the speaker leads (or the terminals on the speaker output jack) together creates a shorted circuit, which is zero Ohms. Most tube amps will not run safely into either situation - open or shorted - when an input signal is applied. This also applies to older SS amps that lacked onboard output attenuators or open & short circuit protection (fuses or breakers).

The signal level applied to the input is coming from your guitar and depends on the pickup. It’s the input signal level that determines the output - the volume pot on your amp attenuates the input signal. Most guitar amps will reach their rated output power with an unattenuated input signal (ie volume pot at maximum) of somewhere around 2 volts.

Electrical noise is also a signal, and how strong it is depends on what’s causing it and where in the circuit it originates. So if there’s enough noise in an amp because of an electrical problem, it will drive the output stage just like your guitar does - and it will likewise put the amp at risk if the speaker is disconnected or shorted for any reason.

The higher the input signal, the higher the output signal. A tube amp will be OK with no load on the output (ie an open circuit - nothing connecting the speaker leads together) if there’s no signal, because there’s no significant output at the speaker leads. If you add an input signal (eg play your guitar through it with the amp’s volume pot turned up) and no load on the output, you risk blowing output tubes and then the fuse.

[John H. Power]

Thanks for the information and I see I am asking you the wrong question about whether or not the amp had a hum when you played it. It was alltunes and alter who actually played on so I will direct that question to them.

[John H. Power]

I bought one played through it for about an hour and promptly returned it. I especially did not like it next to my 78 Vibro Champ which sounded bigger and fuller. And I agree the reverb was so so.

The Victoria 518 is a far superior amp but alas they have crept up in price the last few years.

My solution to getting a Champ style amp but with reverb was an expensive one….a Headstrong Santa Cruz with a 10”. But I absolutely love it.

As I stated in a previous post when I first turned this amp on I immediately noticed a low pitched hum. It did not go away and still is there when I turn the amp on. It was just loud enough not to be right as far as I was concerned so my question to you is whether or not when you tried this amp out did it have any kind of hum when you turned it on or was it silent. I have a friend who has a reissue Princeton and I went over to his house yesterday and turned his amp on and it was completely quiet . No hum at all.

I do like the tone I'm getting from it but if that hum shouldn't be there I will need to send it back and try a different one. Thanks.

[John H. Power]

A friend has one, I played it loud and really liked it. Unlike the older champs it had great headroom, definitely loud enough for quiet gigs. It really reminded me of my vintage Princeton reverb. I'm buying it at some point for sure.

Only thing I didn't like was the digital reverb. It was a nice hall type reverb, but a spring one would be more appropriate for my taste.

I asked the following question to Alltunes since he also indicated he has played one:

As I stated in a previous post when I first turned this amp on I immediately noticed a low pitched hum. It did not go away and still is there when I turn the amp on. It was just loud enough not to be right as far as I was concerned so my question to you is whether or not when you tried this amp out did it have any kind of hum when you turned it on or was it silent. I have a friend who has a reissue Princeton and I went over to his house yesterday and turned his amp on and it was completely quiet . No hum at all.

I do like the tone I'm getting from it but if that hum shouldn't be there I will need to send it back and try a different one. Thanks.

[alltunes]

I asked the following question to Alltunes since he also indicated he has played one:

As I stated in a previous post when I first turned this amp on I immediately noticed a low pitched hum. It did not go away and still is there when I turn the amp on. It was just loud enough not to be right as far as I was concerned so my question to you is whether or not when you tried this amp out did it have any kind of hum when you turned it on or was it silent. I have a friend who has a reissue Princeton and I went over to his house yesterday and turned his amp on and it was completely quiet . No hum at all.

I do like the tone I'm getting from it but if that hum shouldn't be there I will need to send it back and try a different one. Thanks.

to be honest, it was several years ago maybe longer…whenever they first came out I don’t recall necessarily a hum just that it was sort of cheap sounding. Keep in mind though I’m kind of spoiled with some boutique tube amps

[rpjazzguitar]

I just took delivery on one and when I turned it on after about 30 seconds I heard what I would describe as a low hum. Just enough to make me think something isn't right. Nothing plugged in and turning any and all knobs had no effect. When I unplugged the speaker cable it stopped.

My friend has a new Princeton and when that is turned on there is no low hum sound. It is quiet. So my question is simple. When you initially turned on the amp was it quiet or did you notice any type of hum? If you do not remember maybe you could ask your friend if he has noticed that. I like the amp but if what I am hearing is not what should be expected with this model I may send it back.

Thanks.

I would hope that an annoying hum isn't expected.

But, I'm writing to ask a more general question.

Is there a way to figure out what's likely to be wrong based on the pitch or character of the hum?

There's a low hum that I've always assumed was AC getting past the rectifier (heard, for example, in an old amp with deteriorating filter caps). But isn't there a type of hum that's an octave higher than that? If I've got that right, what do the different hum types suggest?

And, what is the hum when you plug the amp end of the cable in before the guitar end? What causes that hum? I know it's normal, but I don't understand the physics.

Is there any other hum-type worth knowing about?

[John H. Power]

I can only tell you that the one I hear though low pitched is noticeable from at least eight to 10 feet from the amp. When I plug in the cable to the amp first I get the standard buzz you get and we all have done that. My main question was whether or not you remembered hearing any noticeable hum when you tried out that fender before you actually started playing.

[Jx30510]

I had one for a while.
The stock tubes are hit or miss, more likely miss from what I've read around diverse threads.
Mine had white noise, the tremolo clicked at every cycle, strange cracks and electric artifacts noises.
One of the preamp tubes was dead right out the box .
Changed it, and everything was fine after that.
Pretty soon after the 6V6 power Tube died.. changed it.
The amp sounded much better with a good set of valves.
John H. Power, the hum on yours is very likely a bad tube.
I've read a LOT of owners having problems with the crappy valves Fender puts in these amps.

For the sound, it was nice but kind of generic. Nothing exceptional.
But it was a great pedal plateform, and shined with good preamp pedals, delay, modulation.
I really liked the on board reverb. Plate ? Modulated? Not sure but I much prefered it to the standard spring reverbs. Much more modern and versatile. But that's personnal taste.

I sold it because, in the end, I found it to be overpriced for what it was at the time.. but I'm on the fence buying one back, because it's quite unique : powerful, small, beautiful looking, good reverb and tremolo, light, superb pedal plateform.. great package in the end.

Reading this thread makes me want to pull the trigger

[Cunamara]

Low hum in the bass range is at 50-60 Hz (depending on what your local AC standard is; for a comparison of the note, the low open E string is 82.4 Hz), then there is an octave higher buzz at 100-120 Hz. I have been told (and this could be wrong) that the low frequency hum is AC mains interference leaking past the filter caps, whereas buzz is electromagnetic interference usually coming through the guitar such as single coil pickup buzz. Potential causes include a bad cable between the guitar and the amp, ground loops, tubes going bad, filter caps going bad, ground/earth problems in the guitar or the amp, other noise sources on the power circuit such as electric motors, etc. Or it could be a problem with the amp.

Potential cures: try a different cable, try a different guitar, remove pedals out of the circuit one at a time, try the reverb and/or tremolo on and off, try a different outlet (and check the outlets for proper grounding and polarity), etc.

I had hum develop in a tweed Deluxe clone that I built which I could not track down. Took it to a tech (Savage Audio in Savage MN, great tech) who isolated a solder joint that had cracked. He fixed it, no more hum.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Is there a way to figure out what's likely to be wrong based on the pitch or character of the hum?

Hum at the frequency of your main voltage source is usually either a power supply issue (e.g. bad filter cap) or induced in a wire in the signal path by poor internal lead dressing (e.g. a wire carrying AC line voltage that's running parallel to a wire in the signal path). The closer to the input jack the signal wire is, the more sensitive it will be to hum from an adjacent parallel power wire (because the gain is highest in the preamp stages). But you can even induce 60 Hz hum by bundling the main power cord alongside the speaker leads for 2 or 3 feet. I've seen people tie wrap power and speaker cables together because it looked neater to them

All line voltage level wires should cross all signal path wires at a 90 degree angle to minimize induced noise. I've seen very poor lead dressing and routing in new amps. The same problems occured in point-to-point amps too. But most of the techs who made them were more knowledgeable about lead dress and cared more. When you're just popping PCBs into an amp, the leads coming off the board are often left hanging in mid air.

Hum at twice the line frequency (and/or otherwise noisier than pure 60 Hz hum) is often from ground loops and shielding problems. The induced power line interference is at line frequency. But with multiple paths to ground and ways for the interference to get into the signal path, harmonics are generated. The most common one (i.e. most likely to make it to your speaker) is the second hamonic, which is twice the fundamental frequency.

The reason you get a buzzing noise when you touch the tip of a cable plugged into your amp is that our bodies are antennae. We attract electromagnetic energy, and it will enter the amp through the cable if we touch ithe tip. Those stories about people who hear radio stations in their heads through their fillings are not fantasy. Strong AM radio signals can induce enough vibration in some dental restorations (most often old style silver amalgam) to cause people to hear the program material in their heads. I usd to play in a club with a cell phone tower right outside the stage. We could sometimes hear fragments of garbled phone conversations through our amps or the house system, and there was a lot of background noise in our systems when the tower was very active.

[Jim Soloway]

You guys are making me glad the deal didn't go through when I started this thread. In fact, I suspect my days of playing through a guitar amplifier is coming to and end. At home I play exclusively through a computer and a pair of nice open back headphones. It's entirely satisfying with lower cost, incredible control, and way less hassle once you get a handle on how it all works.