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It's funny how similar the hifi/audiophile world to the guitar world when it comes to opinions about what makes a good amplifier. Solid state vs tube, vintage vs modern, even harmonic distortion vs odd harmonic distortion, small class D vs heavy class A etc.
One of my stereo amps broke. I am debating whether to get a cheap, class D amp, like these ones:
Mini Amplifier– doukaudio
or
TB10A 2 Ch Amplifier Receiver Hi-Fi Class D Integrated Amp
I've always wanted a vintage Marantz, Yamaha or McIntosh with analogue volume meters and lights and all. Mostly for the aesthetics. But now I am tempted to order and try one of these class D amplifiers. They seem to be making a lot of noise right now. I need the amp to power mid-level bookshelf speakers (A pair of Totem Rainmaker's) in my home office. Do you have experience with these small, desktop style amplifiers?
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02-28-2025 02:43 PM
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I've been an audiophile since I built my first amplifier from a Radio Shack kit when I was about 10. I had both classic / vintage and state of the art systems for many years, including a pair of Infinity Reference Standard II speaker systems that I got cheap because the orignal owner's wife told him not to even bother unpacking them when he got them home.
Those are 12" woofers, and I had them tri-amplified with a Hafler 500 on the bottom, a Yamaha B2 in the middle, and a Marantz 8b on top. My wife tolerated them for about a year before asking me very persuasively to please sell them and get something smaller. My current serious system is a PrimaLuna tube amp driving a pair of Focal towers. I still use the Thorens TD125 turntble with SME arm that I bought in 1969 with a Parasound preamp. But most of my listening has been digital for years and the DACs in my best systems are from SMSL and iFi.
At the publisher's request, I wrote an analysis and comparison of class D amplifiers a few years ago for audiophilestyle.com and covered a lot of ground that may help you. I bought and evaluated many of them and loved a few so much that I kept them. We have 3 in daily use at home and I can't imagine going back. Sure, my PrimaLuna (along with the many great preamps and amps I had before it) packs a bit more punch and is a little sweeter at the top with slightly better definition of instruments and individual notes. But the Douk ST-01 comes very very close to it and I rarely use my "best" system any more. The onboard DAC is as good as the best 4 figure DACs of only a few years ago.
I've recommended the Douk ST-01 to many people, and everyone's thrilled with them. The sound quality is excellent, especially through good speakers - they're amazing through my Focals. There are many fine little class D amps now at prices that wouldn't buy you a set of output tubes for that old Mac or Marantz. Unless you want to spend a fortune on stuff that will need costly attention, I wouldn't even think about vintage tube amps. If you really want to experience tubes, PrimaLuna does a wonderful job for less than a good classic amp will cost you. I bought my power amp in 2012 and it's still fine (on its original tubes) with no intervention at all. But I can wholeheartedly recommend a good class D amp. LIke my article says, it's not your father's class D!
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Thanks for the great info.
Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
Have you tried their none-tube models? Do you think having a tube preamp in a small D design is more than a gimmick? It looks like they introduced a new model, A5, that's all solid state but has a removable glass top to allow for easily swapping Op-amps:
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I have a McIntosh MX-110 tube preamp-tuner, along with Thorens turntable TD-166II. I plug these into a Douk ST-01 integrated amp (hybrid tube preamp and Class D power section). It's quite good sounding. Given that I already had a preamp-tuner in one box, it's the perfect feature set for my uses (it has optical S/PDIF and bluetooth inputs). And it has meters and tubes that look cool. Originally Posted by Tal_175
Before picking up the Douk I had a Yamaha receiver that died after about 20 years (at which point I rescued and revived the MX-110* and got the Douk). The Thorens->MX-110-> Douk sounds better than Thorens->Yamaha. I also had (but didn't want to use to keep for reasons of space and features) a Carver M500T amp. That definitely can get louder than the Douk, but doesn't sound better in any way that I'm able to notice at comfortable listening volumes. LIstening right now to the first Kenny Burrell Prestige album. It sounds really f*cking good TBH. Way better than something this tiny and cheap has any business sounding.
* which had been sitting in a closet in my sister's/parents' apartment for many, many years
I bought the Douk partly based on David's article -- having it owned it for a while now, I can say that he was right on the money. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
Last edited by John A.; 03-01-2025 at 03:44 PM.
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I haven't been able to confirm my suspicion that the tubes in the ST-01 are the buffer stage between the preamp and the class D output stage. But based on my knowledge of electronics (which is somewhere between novice and engineer), I think that's most likely. If I'm correct, they're not actually acting as a preamp. But even as a buffer, tubes do affect the signal passing through them. I don't think it's a gimmick, and the smooth detailed midrange I'm hearing suggests to me that either the tubes are doing something or the preamp chip is pure magic. I've listened extensively to the Douk through a variety of excellent speakers including the Rogers LS3/5as that I bought new in 1975. The LS3/5a is still among the absolute best studio monitors in history, and these are very revealing of aberrance in the electronics driving them. Originally Posted by Tal_175
Having said that, I also have a few newer little class D amps that are pure SS and they sound excellent too. We use this $45 Facmogu 100WPC amp with Edifier speakers in our patio room, and it sounds really fine (although not quite as sweet as the Douk) -
Don't get me wrong. These ~$100 amps do not sound as good as a $10k product. But they do sound as good as some of the best audio equipment of the not so distant past, and they please a lot of sophisticated audiophiles who listen with their ears rather than their egos, eyes and wallets. Class D amps put out a lot of clean power, with tight deep bass and presence that's clear without being piercing. The value is huge.
As for the Douk A5, it's a fantastic little amp that sounds really good (especially for less than $100). It has some shortcomings (as does the ST-01), e.g. the connectors are a bit flimsy and too close together for my taste (especially the RCA input jacks). But it's a cool little amp that should really be a lot of fun if you want to roll chips. I bet it'll sound even better with Burson V7 chips in it, and I'll get around to trying that one of these days.
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If you know how Class D amps work ('lets just mix this triangular wave in with the signal from your high-fidelity source, then we will round out the square wave with a low pass filter...') you might never want one for critical listening.
Apparently, the specs are pretty good.
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When the little class D amps first appeared, I found one and was initially impressed. With extended listening I thought something anomalous was going on with the high end... at least to my ears in my system, very hard to pin down, practically subliminal.
I was active on a audio systems form back then and everyone was curious about these class D amps, but nobody had seemed to find one except me. I started a thread offering to pass mine around - each member interested would have it for listening a few weeks and then send it on to the next person on the growing list. That little amp traveled the world for about three years before it finally came back to me.
A big lot of people (their ears and systems) thought it was fantastic and eventually followed up by getting their own. All that was about fifteen years ago; class D has had a good while to develop since then. I can't speak for how they might have improved; these days I'm strictly an old vinyl, tubes, and big horns guy.
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I have two class D amps, a Topping PA3s, powering a Stax headphones adapter, and a Loxjie A30 powering some Revel M16 speakers. Both scored high in tests at Audio Science Review, my favorite audio site. They are proper amps with great performance. The Loxjie is supposed to be a bit underpowered for a living room, but I get plenty enough volume for my use. I will replace it down the line as I'm missing is some type of loudness control for low volume listening (either a Yamaha S series stereo amp or an AVR). Still, if you don't mind the larger size, there are some excellent traditional amps for good prices, like the aforementioned Yamaha series, a very safe choice and they are built to last for years. But for desktop use, there aren't many convenient alternatives to the little class Ds.
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I’m not gonna get into the Class D or tube amp discussion, cause it’s not my bag. I like vintage SS gear. The 70’s was peak hi-fi for me.
Marantz to get all the attention these days, but both aesthetically and for bang for the buck Pioneer is the way to go. I LOVE their designs. I have a reconditioned SX-750 from the late 70s, currently going into 2 Infinity tower speakers (one of their RS models from the 80s—sorry don’t have the exact model right now). Excellent clean sound, and BEAUTIFUL design.
The SX-1250 is even more sought after, but IMO the 750 is “good enough” and MUCH more affordable.
There’s always more money you can spend on hi-fi. I had an Eagle 7A and Levinson preamp and giant Watkins speakers at one time, but it was too much. You need a sound space the size of a basketball court to make those sing.
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Those are Infinity Reference 4 speakers, Jeff. IIRC, the first gen had two 8" woofers. They went to the single woofer after Harman bought Inifinty. That Emit-R tweeter is oustanding - smoother and more even than the original ribbon style Emit driver. I still miss my RS IIs. The bass was astounding driven by the Hafler 500, and despite the plethora of drivers the sound stage was well defined and seamless. Unfortunately, they were over 2' wide and deep, and they were taller than my wife. So she didn't want them in the living room. I had to put them in my library / listening room that was only 10x17 with an 8' ceiling. It was gross overkill, even driven by only 760 triamped Watts Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
...currently going into 2 Infinity tower speakers (one of their RS models from the 80s—sorry don’t have the exact model right now).
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I’ve been an audiophile hog for 50 years. In the 90’s I swore Class A couldn’t be beat. And I didn’t mind the heat. I lived with them for some 15 years.
I migrated towards tubes and never looked back! The past 10 years I’ve been a big fan of SET and small SEP hand built amplifiers by Dennis Had, the former owner of Cary, who began building amps and preamps in retirement. They’re relatively inexpensive, especially used, and they perform way better than you’d expect from such a small amplifier, but hand wiring and solid designs do matter.
I’ve also been a fan of highly efficient speakers that don’t require huge power. 5 watts is all you need for audio bliss.
I’ve had more systems that most. But now I’m settled. A very solid Turntable, a small amp and preamp. That’s all one needs.
I absolutely love tube swapping.
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I may not have that kind of gear in my music room, but I do have that Coltrane poster smiling (well, not exactly smiling) down on me while I'm practicing! Always a good inspiration.
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So it's not just guitars that that happens with! Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
(12 years ago my wife finally agreed to move to a smaller home and property if I didn't bring the Magnaplanars along.)
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I’m thrilled that Maggies have the same effect! Originally Posted by Woody Sound
I’m grateful that my “little” Focal 726 towers have survived about 15 years in our home. They even made the cut when we downsized from a 4000 sq ft house to less than half that in an apartment 10 years ago. But TBH, after more than 5 decades with sound reproduction far better than anything she ever knew existed, my wife has turned a corner. She now uses the audio systems I’ve set up in multiple rooms both as TV sound and to listen to music. She even wants a soundbar for our bedroom TV.
There is a god!!
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You should have come back with I’ll not bring the Maggie’s if you don’t bring the piano. Originally Posted by Woody Sound
So it's not just guitars that that happens with!
(12 years ago my wife finally agreed to move to a smaller home and property if I didn't bring the Magnaplanars along.)
I’ve always had the luxury of having my own space, and frankly can’t relate to being in a relationship with someone who doesn’t enjoy the same things I do. But I know it’s a thing with stereo gear where there’s a WAF (wife approval factor) in the home of many audiophiles. I think if I experienced that I’d not be in that relationship. My first marriage I ordered a grand piano, without her knowledge, that was delivered and placed in a living room that was entirely empty, and unused.
She was absolutely livid. So I returned the piano at a $1k loss. But the hypocrisy was I was supposed to give in when she got custody of 3 children (1 every year) over a 3 year period. And then it was I who was to take care of them? That relationship was over within a year. There’s compromises to be made in any relationship, but my personality is I’m not living in a dictatorship.
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I found mine in 1990 hanging in a used record shop. I had it sealed and laminated against a hardboard for $100. Laminating it made the colors pop, and it looks as new as it did in the 60’s. It’ll be around when I’m long gone. Originally Posted by bluejaybill
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One of the most beautiful things about my half-century relationship with my wife is that we enjoy many of the same things, yet we respect each other for those interests that we don't share. As a result, we've both learned a lot and found some new interests by first observing and later sharing each other's. Many such early forays were undertaken with emotions ranging from boredom to something approaching resentment. But over the years, we discovered more of ourselves through each other. Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
The topic of this thread is a great example. When we first met, she only listened to music in her car, and her choice of radio stations was appalling, to say the least. Her records looked like pizzas because she left most of them lying around her bedroom in her parents' house without sleeves or covers (even when she left home for college). She hadn't had her own record player of any kind since high school. She liked music well enough, although her collection and radio choices focused on top 40 and then AOR when it came along.
Over the next few decades, I brought a whole new world to her. She discovered Little Feat, Wilson Pickett, Thad and Mel, Joe Williams, Nancy Wilson (the real one, not Heart), TOP etc etc. She learned about funk and fusion. She professed not to like the blues, but she'd never actually heard live blues. As soon as she heard them, she loved Chris Cain, Robben Ford, Koko Taylor, Larry Garner, Larry McCray, Michael Hill, Buddy Guy, Shemekia Copeland, etc.
After years of ignoring our sound systems, she started to listen to music at home on her own. it started with FM and grew when we got a smart speaker with a digital assistant. Then she expresed an interest in getting the music to come out of "the good speakers". She asked me how to turn on the living room system, and I made it easier for her by linking the digital assistant to smart switches and outlets. Yesterday, I came back from running some errands to find her dancing around the room singing along with Bonnie Raitt.
It only took 50 years
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Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
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I received my Douk Audio ST-01 PRO. Here is my report:
It's pretty good. Initially I thought the UV meter was broken because even after adjusting the sensitivity it didn't move much. I was testing it at night and I didn't realize how much volume it needs to get moving even in the high sensitivity setting. The other issue is that it sounded a bit too mid forward. It's great for listening to podcasts but listening to music was a bit fatiguing. For example piano right hand voicings sounded twice as loud as anything else in small combo recordings. This is probably not the fault of the amp but my super clinical bookshelf speakers. They are also sitting on my desktop which is not their ideal placement. As a solution I maxed out the treble and bass controls on the amp as there is no mid control. Now it sounds very balanced and pleasant. It was a good purchase. Thanks for the recommendations.
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