Jazz Comping - The Lightbulb Moment

[scout]

I've been struggling a bit with Jazz comping rhythm playing ..and this morning things went really well .
I stopped using the 'death grip' with the plectrum and gripped the pick a whole lot softer than the way I usually grip it ..
What a revelation !! .. Things just fell into place ...something so simple made such a difference .
I think it was someone on these pages who suggested this technique , I owe him a beer .

[AllanAllen]

You want the notes to have tension, not your body. Loose and easy is the way to go.

[Mick-7]

Yes, relaxation is the key -- Donna Lee fingering for speed

[pauln]

Might have been me; I wrote about a loose pick grip as letting the string win over the pick (mechanically) rather than the pick winning over the string... it feels and sounds different, I think in a good way.

[Jimmy blue note]

Great revelation. Heyyyy, you think this approach might work with girls too?
Hmmmm, relax, and let up on the death grip. You may be on to something...

[scout]

Thanks all ...all good and helpful responses ..
and to Jimmy Blue Note ... could work for you mate .. could also be fraught with danger .

[MiniMerckx.22]

Just in case you didn't pick up on it, relax or tensing one hand automatically relaxes or increases tension in the opposite hand. So if you hold a pick with a death grip you will overgrip your fretting hand simultaneously. You only need to fret with enough pressure to allow the note to ring clearly without buzzing and only need to hold a pick firmly enough to prevent the pick from moving between your thumb and index. Any more "work" than what is required is working against yourself.

[scout]

Thanks MiniMercx ... that make a lot of sense ..
After a week or so of more relaxed fretting and plectrum holding ... I am hearing results .. my playing has improved in many ways .
Cheers mate ...

[acoustic_archtop]

how do you know if you're holding your pick too tight, too lightly or just right?

[pauln]

how do you know if you're holding your pick too tight, too lightly or just right?

One way is to get a range of picks in graduated thickness (and flexibleness). From your current pick, switch to one that is a bit thinner for a while; long enough that you don't over-bend it as you play normally. Give it a few days until you get used to it.

Then step down some more to a thinner one. Few more days, etc. Repeat until you get to so flexible a pick that you can't get it to work, can't get used to it. Bump back up to the one before that and use it for everything for an extended time (weeks).

During this time focus on how it mechanically responds and feels, not how it sounds (tone, picking noises). Once you have evaluated it, step up to the next thicker one and evaluate that one, comparing to the prior one. You will have had to lighten your grip and now you want to go back up to see how thick a pick you can use (for tone) without losing the light grip. It may take a while but when you get the right pick and light grip it will be worth it.

Used a 3mm, then 1mm, then .88mm, now .73mm nylon, I'll never go back.

[scout]

Cheers Paul ,
I used to play with a 3mm Buffalo Horn pick when I was playing rhythm guitar Gypsy Swing.. perfect for that ,but not real good for Jazz comping on my Epiphone Emperor Regent .. Like you, I'm enjoying and improving my playing with a .73 nylon pick .

[garybaldy]

Cheers Paul ,
I used to play with a 3mm Buffalo Horn pick when I was playing rhythm guitar Gypsy Swing.. perfect for that ,but not real good for Jazz comping on my Epiphone Emperor Regent .. Like you, I'm enjoying and improving my playing with a .73 nylon pick .

Yes, a GJ pick is no good on a 'regular' archie. I use a Delrin 500 1.5mm for archies and a 5mm Wegen for GJ.

[AllanAllen]

how do you know if you're holding your pick too tight, too lightly or just right?

If your fingertips turn red/white that's too tight. If you drop your pick that's too loose. Just right is somewhere in between the two.

[Cunamara]

If your fingertips turn red/white that's too tight. If you drop your pick that's too loose. Just right is somewhere in between the two.

LOL!

I use a 1.0-1.5 mm to a 2 mm pick with a very light grip. Currently I am liking casein picks, but my go-to for decades has been the small D'Andrea ProPlec teardrops. No doubt they will be again, I have a lifetime supply (being 66 now, a "lifetime supply" is not as many picks as it used to be) once the casein infatuation goes away. I like to play without a pick more and more, though, and will assume I have a lifetime supply of fingers.

I used to play sometimes with a guy who insisted on using a 5 mm pick with his archtops. Then he'd roll the treble way down to cut the pick noise, and crank up the reverb to try to liven up the dead muffled tone. The result was a dark, watery sound. It was too bad as he played pretty well in terms of his ideas, but his tone let him down. A 1.5 mm or so pick would have made less noise and allowed a brighter tone to be heard better.

[scout]

I just bought a 6 pack of Jim Dunlop .71 mm Delrin picks ... should do me for a while .

[alltunes]

Relaxation is something I struggle with especially flatpicking bluegrass fiddle tunes. Right shoulder gets hiked up; right forearm tensed etc. Almost need to tape a note to my guitar (like the folkies did with setlists) reminding me to relax my entire right side.

[scout]

Both feet planted on the floor is a good idea (not one foot arched up ,or resting on the edge of the chair etc.) to help relax. If you have to ( sometimes me ) have a raised foot ,put it on a nice piece of timber . Mine is a piece of old Baltic Pine ,sanded smooth and oiled .