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there's a fundamental flaw in these amps. In every other digital/modeling amp, you have a master volume prior to the power amp. This allows you to dial in the sweet spot in the fender amp (typically 3-4 on the volume control for jazz, slightly higher for blues) and then turn the master up so that you can amplify *THAT* with your power amp. That's not how the new fenders work. They work exactly like the analog amps in terms of the volume. So even though the deluxe has a 100w power amp, you don't get a full 100w until the volume is cranked way up. To me, that's a fatal flaw. I'd probably buy the deluxe if it didn't have that issue.
The twin version will likely have less of that issue since it has 2x the power of the deluxe version and I'm assuming you can get it loud enough and still be clean but it's disappointing that they'd whiff on this issue which every other modeler gets right.
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09-16-2019 06:29 AM
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Treble is by nature (physics) directional. Easy solution, turn the treble down. I use fender amps and they sound great with my strat, tele, 335 style and barney kessel. From twang to fusion to straight ahead classic 50s/60s jazz to modern jazz. I haven't found anything they aren't good at. I can make it sound more similar to polytone just by adjusting the tone controls. Unfortunately, you can't make a mambo or clarus sound like a fender by adjusting the tone controls (even with the fender switch).
Originally Posted by christianm77
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Originally Posted by jzucker
Well I find an EQ pedal gives me better control, as the controls on a PR are treble and bass. I suppose I could mod it... But there is a voice going in my head - 'if you don't like smiley face EQ, why the hell did you buy a blackface fender amp?' which is.... fair enough.
(This is after I've swapped in a Hemp speaker as well.)
Unfortunately, you can't make a mambo or clarus sound like a fender by adjusting the tone controls (even with the fender switch).
So I need something quite transparent to flatter that particular quality. A small PA unit would do, honestly. The guy whose Mambo I tried owns a 175 of the previous year, and understood what I mean right away (he was keen for me to try it). A lot of people don't like those guitars. I love it though, suits my approach and style.
The Princeton is a great amp, but I feel like I'm moving away from it. Probably hang on to it though, it does a thing. And, naturally, it sounds badass with my tele. And I do like to tele.
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Also, the PR is too loud for recording really. Need something that warms up a bit earlier. No, really.
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the hemp speaker may be your problem. They are EXTREMELY colored. The princeton is a very different beast of an amp. Different phase inverter than the standard blackface fender. I love them for low volume practicing but not loud enough for playing clean with a drummer.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
Very efficient though. I've had no trouble with headroom. I did have trouble with the stock Jensen, it broke up fairly quickly. You should try a PR with a more efficient speaker sometime... It's pretty striking how much more usable the amp becomes.
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12w doesn't work for my style no matter how efficient the speaker is. Even a deluxe doesn't work for me. I need 40w minimum and even then, I usually run in stereo with a 2nd amp for headroom.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
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Originally Posted by jzucker
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Originally Posted by ruger9
Also, the deluxe reverb (analog version) has a bright cap hard-wired in and from the clips I've heard, it appears they have modeled that in the deluxe version of the modeler. Many people I know never use the bright setting and clip out the capacitor on the analog model. Fender should have added this functionality. This lack of common sense feature set seems tone-deaf and gibson-esque IMO.
Regarding the blues cube artist, I haven't tried it. But I had a katana and while it had potential, it was way too bright. I had to keep the treble on zero which is ridiculous.
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Originally Posted by christianm77
I think the ship has sailed on being able to use a 12w guitar amp. Might be different for playing background music. On my duo gig in the wine shop, I could definitely use a princeton but not on the big stage at cleveland bop stop or night town.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
John
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Originally Posted by jzucker
The BCA is NOT bright. Some people actually think it's dark. I think it's neither. The EQ is so versatile (and subtle; for example, the bass control doesn't go from little to underwater, and the treble control doesn't go from blanket to ice pick; their entire ranges are VERY usable) that imo it's hard to get a bad sound out of it. Of course you have to like it's base tone (which is modeled after a Tweed Bassman), or get a Tone Capsule you prefer (I have the Ultimate Blues tone capsule)... and the amp sounds like that no matter where you put the EQ. And the "power scaling" (which, after reading your comments) seems to me to likely be the same or very similar to Fender's "attenuator". The BCA power scaling does indeed sound the same at pretty much any volume, except for very quiet levels (0.5W, MV turned down to 2)... nothing sounds the same when you're barely moving any air. But flip the switch to the 15W setting, and raise the MV to 3... and anywhere from there up sounds pretty much the same... I use the 15W setting at home, and the 45W setting with the band (much louder), and it sounds as much the same as it can, taking into consideration the Fletcher-Munson curve.
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Originally Posted by John A.
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Originally Posted by ruger9
So they obviously did think about this but decided it wasn't a feature that people wanted or needed... So with less than $5 worth of circuitry they could have added the master level control prior to the power amp.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
If there's a DR or a Twin at the venue I'd rather play through that. Usually this is the case for a jazz club or festival... But I'm not up for lugging one of those around London. Can't comment on NYC, don't work there.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
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Yeah, you can't really gig with a drummer and use a princeton reverb and stay clean...unless we're talking real soundman/everybody mic'd up kind of situation...which, I don't know about you, but...
These still really aren't a subway amp, I guess, the box is too big. For me, I'm far enough out from the city center that it makes more sense to drive to stuff, so I could see myself parking and walking a few blocks with a "lighter than my Polytone" Deluxe...if it sounded pretty darn close. I will be trying these.
Anybody seen one "in the wild" yet?
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Originally Posted by jzucker
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Originally Posted by jzucker
Attenuator seems like one compromise they had to make to increase the appeal of these amps to their main crowd which isn't jazzers. Most people (blues and rock crowd) want high volume crunch tones at lower levels (attenuator) in quieter gigs or bedrooms, not low level tones at high volumes (master volume). They figured they already offer Twin for the second group. Also a master volume would have been more invasive to the original panel.
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Originally Posted by jzucker
John
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Well one things for sure Jack Z will give us a full review as soon as he gets one.
Jack Z is our resident tester for all things gear. You go Jack,and we all thank you for saving us a bunch of $$
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Originally Posted by Tal_175
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Originally Posted by jads57
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Originally Posted by jzucker
KA PAF info please
Today, 11:52 AM in Guitar, Amps & Gizmos