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I grew up in the L.A. area, in La Canada which is just north of Pasadena's Rose Bowl. The $80,000 home I grew up in the 1970s (that was a lot of money back then), is now valued at $2.85 million. Yikes!! Needless to say, my dad was financially more successful than I am.
I live in San Diego, a couple miles from the coast near UCSD in a community called University City. Bought my 1,450 square foot house in 1991 for $200,000. It's valued at $700,000 now. Also yikes! I'm doing pretty good financially, even still I'm glad I'm not buying a house nowadays.
I really like San Diego. L.A. not so much.
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12-08-2015 03:19 PM
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I was in Seal Beach, but moved a few years back. Still have family there, so I'm in town a few times a year.
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I've lived in the westside since 1979 and I agree with all the posts. All I can say is that if you want to live somewhere decent AND be adjacent or central to lots of what LA has to offer, be prepared to spend more than anywhere in the state, except maybe San Francisco (now that will be an agonizing topic). One unmentioned yet affordable area to explore is Highland Park, where there local hipsters have claimed as their own.
Public transportation is still "evolving" so you gotta have a car. However Uber is ubiquitous in LA.
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I was in Long Beach for a year and National City for 6 years. I want to go back to Cali but not sure where yet.
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
Two places I lived and enjoyed was Santa Cruz my favorite Jazz club is there Kuumbwa Jazz Center and a lot of music in general there. Then I lived n Oakland for awhile and dug it, lots Jazz, arts and etc.Last edited by docbop; 12-15-2015 at 10:04 PM.
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
I lived in Cali north south east and west
for most of the last 50 years.
Haven't really lived there for almost 10.
and don't know where a good place would be
I go back every few years
but I just ain't feelin' it.
*Some cat on another thread was complaining about somebody using the above margin format so I thought I'd try it out just to be mischievous.
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Originally Posted by mrcee
I hear ya I grew up there and want out, but need to find an affordable place that has some Jazz going on.
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Originally Posted by docbop
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Originally Posted by mrcee
I know what you mean. The driving sucks for one thing.
I went to the Caribbean for the first time this year. I love it there. I don't know if there would be any use for me musically. I can fall into just about anything except for classical or jazz.
I would definitely be looking to start a band in LA, not join one. I'm going to sell my house and move cross town where I am now. Go from there. It's a big leap going from a house to an apartment.
These winters are getting to me.
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
I've been based in Houston, Texas for the past few years (San Antonio before that) and spending most of my time in Mexico, coming back to the States a couple of times a year. I get to Cali now and then and was just out for a month in Sept. Houston used to have a big R&B scene but now maybe just a few Dirty South rappers. It used to have a considerable amount of jazz and blues as well and some big names came out of there but now there appears to nothing to speak of except ZZ Top. Not even as much Country as you'd think. It seems to be mostly a Metal town. I am a little disappointed in Mexico from a musical standpoint. I'm in a town noted for rich party hungry international types but the music I've heard ain't happnin' Captain. Rich international types hanging out listening to the Three Dog Night.
I did do a couple of sets with a good singer and keyboard who were passing through town. Mostly jazz standards but some pop as well. I got 'em funky the best I could and everyone dug it. I'd like to put something together here, progressive straight ahead R&B with some improv (I like that Barry White Louie Louie number) (get ants in the people's pants so they want to dance. As far as I'm concerned if you don't pack the floor it's not for me) but I'm not too optimistic. Maybe a loose funky free lounge thing but I don't know if the crowd could stomach it. I'm deep in the woodshed though and that's good. I'm making a lot of headway.
I lived in Belize off and on for about three years and played a bit. It's totally a Caribbean scene. Excellent but most of the best musicians have moved to LA over the last thirty years. I wouldn't go back there now though. It's become a violent crack saturated cesspool and I'd more than likely be dead within two weeks. As a outspoken non tourist white boy musician who speaks the dialect and knows too many people I'd be bound to piss somebody off.
I think your plan to start a band as opposed to joining one is good. I don't care for joining bands that much myself. It's sort of like going on a blind date. I assume you're thinking of RnB. Old School Retro or something new and fresh? This post is kinda long and maybe would have been better as a PM but what the heck it may be of interest to someone other than yourself. And at least it's not a wacked out political diatribe. PM me if you like. I'd been interested in what you come up with musically as well as any current insights on LA if you wind up there.Last edited by mrcee; 12-15-2015 at 09:54 AM.
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Originally Posted by mrcee
I think this is very much on topic. It's about music in LA. It's probably hard to get situated there but it might be right for some people. I've only worked with jazz musicians one time. It was a girl vocal group and they used jazz sidemen. Best band I was ever in actually. After that it was a steps dance band. It was a mistake for me to play in a mixed band in Japan. I don't know why the bandleader asked me to go. I found out not long ago he passed away in 08'. He was only 48.
I'll never know now. He never went back there. I won't either.
Anyway I don't want to dwell on that anymore. Some musicians create a scene and some have to find it.
I'm a product of what Cameo fans call the 'Black new wave' I'd say. I didn't hear that till a couple years ago. A while back I was thinking, what did we call the music? We didn't actually call it anything. Now I just say R&B or funk as a loose description. pre-DJ.
It's old enough to be retro now.
'Funk' as a word has become a no-no for some people. I'm OK with that. People call it old school now.
Well thanks for the reminder I'm old! It's kind of stupid. People are all over Youtube saying....OLD school!! yeah it's old and you can't play it so what are you kids babbling about?
I think LA is probably good for jazz. Major cities that will be. NYC of course. I listened to some R&B bands in NY on Gigmasters.
....I don't think so.
The reason R&B is so popular in LA is because they destroyed it to being with.
That's just like..my opinion as they say in LA.
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
Little or no interesting live music to speak of. This was in Kobe/Osaka. Osaka had some big weird places with corny stage shows.
Interesting about LA destroying R&B. When I was last there in the 80s there didn't seem to be no kind of nothin' going on, as far a clubs went, except spandex stuff in Hollywood. I spent a bunch of time in the hood and never saw any R&B evidence. Some store front Rap venues. And two or three West Indian clubs that were sporadic. There was a place on the Strip called the Club Lingere. I saw Blood Ulmer there. It was great. Similar to The Stone in SF. Basically a bar with a big empty room like a dance hall. They both tended to have acts that were either on the way up or the way down or stuck in a holding pattern. Santa Monica and the west side had a similar room or two. And a few sort of groovy bigger restaurants in more out lying areas that had a music policy on the weekends but that was sporadic as well. And of course The Roxy. The Troubador may have still been open. And McCabe's in Santa Monica for acoustic music. I saw Bola Sete there. And whatever hole in the walls in beach areas. And a few odds and ends. So LA had less club action than you might think for a major city with a big music industry. No Village Vanguards. Although I may be well missing a lot of things. I'd be curious if there's now any legit Jazz clubs like Yoshi's in SF or the NYC joints. I can't see Pat Martino recording live at an LA club but hopefully I'm wrong.Last edited by mrcee; 12-15-2015 at 05:56 PM.
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I'd love to get a janitor job out there somewhere. LA, Ventura, Oxnard or something.
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Originally Posted by docbop
I want to go to Barbados for some reason. It's the same size as Milwaukee but it's not Milwaukee. I liked St. Martin. The music was nice. They just get the drum machine going and go for it.
Americans need to get hip. They make everything so complicated.
This singer on the street was funny. He had a big crowd, performing in front of a restaurant. He'd point at people and say where they're from. He pointed right at me and said- Wisconsin!! I looked behind me I'm thinking huh? Is it that obvious?
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
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Originally Posted by docbop
I'd say it's a fusion town musically. There have always been good players there with solid fans. This is a band named Gamelon. Excellent guitar player named George Puelo. he's on the black strat. Go to about 4 minutes in and they start tearing it up;
Last edited by Stevebol; 12-16-2015 at 01:07 AM.
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Originally Posted by docbop
I got to know my long lost relatives last spring when we went on a cruise. My sister-in-law said to me- we believe in drugs. I thought yeah I knew that.
I don't know if you remember Rick James out there in LA. Rick was Buffalo.
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Originally Posted by Stevebol
Buffalo used to be called the little Chicago and a lot of musicians there. Talking to people there still is a lot of music there, but winter is tough so that's has to factor in at my age. I know a lot of musicians like Eugene OR, but most are rock/blues players, but appears there's some Jazz too. I used to live in Boston and liked it there, but it now one of the most expensive cities rent wise, but that's why Providence RI is interesting it only an hour drive to Boston and a train ride to NYC. Portland has lots of music, but some say the city is changing a lot, but they have good transit system so living outside the city is possible. Then Vancouver WA is across the bridge from Portland, but traffic can be bad and many say Vancouver is a stepford wives like place. Kansas City has lots of music and looking cost of living isn't bad, but your right in the middle of tornado alley. Santa Cruz was real nice place to live, but rents are high and affordable places are in not so nice part of town. Oakland is similar story as Santa Cruz. I'd really like to get out of California the whole state is expensive in general.
So the search goes on and knowing me one day I will just say screw it pick up and go it won't be the first time.
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It's can be tough... I blew out of Cali almost 10 years ago. I got some peeps in Oregon and spent a bit over a year there. Got good friends, one an excellent bass player with a botique bass company, in Portland. Vancouver, WA as well.
I can't really say much about the area one way or the other. It seems kinda like Cali North to me. And the rain?
fuggedaf**kinboutit.
I've been in Texas since 2007. San Antonio and Houston. Affordable and jobs with plenty of elbow room but not everyone's cup of tea. Works for me though. No music that I'm into to speak of. The much touted Austin (stupid traffic and getting expensive) scene has been described as "all the music from A to C". This is coming from a misanthropic geriatric jazz fan (seen Coltrane and Monk etc) friend of mine so should be taken with some grains of salt. I could be wrong but I don't think Pat Martino plays there. My sense of it is that it's not much of a jazz town. They say San Antonio is more so but I didn't see it. Just one big C&W place the size of a Walmart with New Country. It looked like a
Cracker Barrel restaurant on major steroids. I'm not counting the few odds and ends. Very little Mom and Pop retail action of any type in Texas cities except a bit in Austin. A couple of small independent music stores here and there. But mostly all big corporate Toys R Us type action. Jewelry stores the size of a Toys R Us with 10 ft. Rolex signs. You get out of town into the country though and it's sweet and goes on for ever. Maybe it's time for everyone to chip in and set up a Jazzville on the outskirts of town. A kinder and friendlier Jonestown where disenfranchised jazz people can jam and sip the jazz Kool Aid. The house band could be called The Zombie Apocalypse Band. Kind of like one of the Fun Camps they're supposedly planning. Maybe there's some federal grant money available.
So I've got my woodshed in San Miguel de Allende, Mexico a 12 hr drive south of the border and I can practice 12 hrs/day if my fretting hand would tolerate it. Living on 500/m. Probably could do it on 400 if I really went monastic. . Hopefully I'll get some chances to sit in a bit here and there. The danger element in Mexico is over stated (very safe where I'm at) although some parts of the country are a little iffy but there's places in the States that you don't want to be in after 4 in the afternoon. And imo Mexico has never been a particularly safe country even back when they were slaughtering virgins on top of the pyramids.
I'm kinda over Cali. I can remember the good old days too clearly. I don't know much about Oxnard and Ventura these days but it could maybe work. There's always Bakersfield but even that's changing. Mays well be in Texas except that Texas is better. Sure, if I had my druthers and some heavy jingle in my jeans I'd live in LA by the beach, but welcome to the real world.//////Last edited by mrcee; 12-16-2015 at 10:14 AM.
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After living in the desert no Texas or south for me in general, I want green. I heard there is a nano sized Jazz scene in Boise Idaho. I think any college town should have some music scene going on and some culture.
I've had friends that lived in Mexico a long time and loved it. There's a Jazz piano player over at freejazzinstitute.com he retired and moved to Mexico awhile back and appears to love it.
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There's actually maybe a nano sized jazz scene almost everywhere these days which is a good thing for what it's worth. There could be a country band or 2 on Cape Cod. And a southern gospel band in Aleppo. *wwelll.....probably not* It's a new world (dis)order. anyway. Boise could well have on a per capita basis as much of a jazz "scene" as what I saw in LA in the 70s and 80s.
btw is there a or any first rate jazz club in LA today that features/specializes in internationally known big name straight ahead non fusion headliner jazz artists as their policy on a weekly basis? Players like McCoy Tyner. World renowned players that have little or no pop or fusion angles. A club like Yoshi's or the Iridium. You know. A real Jazz Club like the Vanguard. (Maybe The Lighthouse was the last one, huh?) Not someplace that presents a mixed bag of acts with the occasional Scofield or Mike Stern thrown in. Or a smaller local venue that may have the occasional second tier artist who just happens to be in town and is looking for something to do and pick up a couple of 100 extra bucks. What about Portland? Houston sure doesn't.
Mexico is ok, Not Paris in the 50s. But for me it's a workable woodshed. At this point in my life I could be anywhere if I was comfortable and spoke the language. There's a yearly jazz festival in my town which I haven't gone to yet. The past couple of years have had Paul McCandless and Tuck and Patti as headliners. I think Mike Stern as well one year. Pat Martino was here not too long ago doing some teaching in MX City at a place called Fermata. I know someone who saw him play in Cancun of all places. He made a big impression.Last edited by mrcee; 12-16-2015 at 09:46 AM.
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I wouldn't recommend Milwaukee for jazz. If you like to hear jazz way too loud, no dynamics and all Bird phrases then Milwaukee might be for you. Otherwise skip it.
I think it's odd that old R&B is very popular in LA but not NYC. Those are two jazz hot-spots though.
Here's my prediction for what it's worth- the popularity of old rock and old R&B is going to spread. The reason is that the big 3- rap, country and edm are getting weak. Rap beats especially aren't good these days. The only reason the big 3 are popular is because they're easy to dance to.
It's about jobs. Old school music can create them. Here's my thing- use a drum machine or drum tracks for old school R&B. You'll never get tight with a real drummer. It takes too long.
Jazz musicians tend to have a good ear for vocals and that's what it comes down to.
Start creating some jobs. People might be getting sick of canned music.
Too bad old-timers into jazz don't have some hot spots. Mid-sized cities where we can congregate. We could start a rumor about some place.
It has to be warm for me.
We need our AARP music!
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I'm with you on the drum machine. Back in the late 80s in Berkeley, CA. I saw a first rate Caribbean show at a good theater. They had a great West Indian band from NYC backing up several top Southern Caribbean singers. (There were theater seats but everyone was standing doing their thing). Each doing a short set. Singers like Crazy and The Mighty Sparrow. Plenty of pieces. At least one keyboard, a horn or 2, percussion maybe plus the usual stuff BUT they had no traps drummer just programmed tracks. I'm observant and I didn't even realize it until half way through the second number. It was a big theater and the stage was fairly crowded so it wasn't visually that clear as well. The whole show was great. This was Soca (short for Soul Calypso) music. I'll bet everyone on this forum is familiar with it. Hot Hot Hot by Arrow crossed over back in the day. This type of music is really just modern Calypso and relates to it the way Funk and Disco relate to classic R&B. imo..It's fundamentally similar, and often played by the same musicians for the same audience. Soca doesn't use steel drums if rarely and is synth, DX7, heavy. With the sitar patch. The guitar rhythm is very difficult for non Caribbean players and is almost never gotten right. Physically demanding as well because the left hand is constantly engaged playing full major triads, not a lot of 7ths, up the neck and has no time to rest. Not much muting and nano rests between beats. Lots of 4 fret C maj position inside chords. What the Country guys call a chicken claw fingering. And the right hand strum is super fast and loose. A lot of the Jimmy Nolen type guys can't even get it. Reggae is child's play, comparatively. A lot of the reggae guys don't like it and disparage it as Jump Up music.
Any way long story short imo modern funky dance music doesn't really need a traps. A good one's always a plus though. Even just a kick, snare and hi-hat to give it some human input.
Here's a tune from a few years back. about 25 to be exact. A slightly different style from straight soca.
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For me L.A. isn't a real Jazz hotsptot (oh I can feel the villagers lighting there torches) the Jazz that's here is so laid back and perfect chops the real Jazz attitude isn't there. L.A. musically was always the technically great town compared to NYC the place with the attitude and soulful players. I still remember the first time I heard NYC jazz in L.A. it was Woody Shaw and it was like fire was blowing out of there instruments, veins popping out, and when not soloing they were watching to focusing on whoever was. I'd watched in L.A. clubs Jazz players leave the stage when not soloing, talk to audience members by the stage, trying to get waitress to order more drinks. The treat gigs more like day job than playing art of Jazz.
This is one of those threads I've written four replies and deleted them, I don't want to want walk out of my apartment and hear a sniper rack his rifle. This is how I feel and I know others will disagree and express should yourself. I did write about it and delete, but I did recently go to concert here with a burning NYC sax player, I was totally depress when he played a laidback L.A. style show, so it still goes on.
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That sounds like very unprofessional behavior.
Is it just NYC and NOLA now for jazz?
I can understand if you're a native Californian why you might want to bail but it's a wasteland in most other places. We can't all live in NYC.
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