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New vid up!
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08-23-2025 10:22 AM
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Great topic
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small typo at 3:58 - montgomery ward bridges are I7 IV (not III7 VI7)
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Ah nuts. Can't be fixed sadly.
Originally Posted by brent.h
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great content nonetheless. am always looking forward to your vids.
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Good video!
A non-musician who knows a song will quickly recognize when they hear the song played incorrectly. I think that confirms that the non-musician knows both the melody and the harmony -- and achieved that knowledge without conscious effort.
My guess, and it's just a guess, is that a musician who knows hundreds of tunes knows them the same way.
The skill is to remember the tune like a non-musician but be able to immediately know the notes and chords. In any key.
It is as if the player's fingers go to the right place by themselves - without any conscious direction from the player.
I find that it's not difficult to play a melody I know well in any key. But, try as I might, it's harder for chords. And, if I have to remember something like "It's a Montomery Ward bridge in the key of the IV" I've already lost.
Some people clearly have an easier time with this sort of thing than others. For those of us who struggle with it, I think a reasonable way to practice it is to pick a list of standards which you know well (in the non-musician way) and work on playing the vanilla changes in random keys.
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Yes the point is to hear the modules. Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
So you can listen to a tune on the way to the gig and learn it that way. Or learn it on the bandstand.
If you block down the changes to a few modules (say 12 of them) that occur 80% of the time maybe this skill will seem less like witchcraft.
I can’t remember Sears Roebuck or Montgomery Ward either. It’s old outdated slang…. Now we’d have Temu and Amazon haha.
I just say rhythm or honeysuckle bridge.
This video ain’t doing great, but I’ll revisit the topic. It’s a sad fact of life that Youtube audiences tend to want videos on the least important subjects like gear or being spoonfed bebop licks in tab haha, but I think there’s a way to clickbait it.
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I like the French jazzers’ notions of Anatole and Christoph. Between them they account for much of the harmonic movement in a huge proportion of older tunes. Much easier to remember than all those lego bricks with silly names.
Anatole: I VI II V and its many variants
Christoph: I I7/3 IV #IVo I/5 and a few variants
Melody permitting any variant can substitute for any other.
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Yes I find Corks names a bit disconnected from actual jazz practice. Originally Posted by pcjazz
But there’s always local differences.
For instance I’ve heard musicians in London call ‘the Horse’ what French musicians label Christoph. That’s the name I used for it in the video.
(Although I thought Christoph was with the IVm?)
Another one is ‘the Rag progression’ like Tiger Rag C section. I V I for 8/16 and then the Horse/Christophe
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IVm or #IVo (as in the second half of All Of Me). A common variant. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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I’ll take your word for it, I’ve only heard it used for the minor plagal variant. Originally Posted by pcjazz
OTOH I don’t know if the Horse refers to both variants.
As you say they are somewhat interchangeable, and the decision to use one or the other is governed by the melody. All of Me melody accepts either although I believe it was IVm originally?
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Yes, per Denis Chang. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Good video, well done.
Yes, Lego Bricks seemed a good idea, but it has been too much to remember.
It was easier to remember common chord progressions that frequently occur in songs.
Jazz Lego Bricks example below:
The Method – Insights In Jazz
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I mean, per the sheet music. Originally Posted by pcjazz
But Chang tends to know what he’s on about
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One thing that Cork’s method that is really important is that he also covers the joins between modules. It’s a complete system. The names are not used by any one apart from Lego bricks disciples though, and there are names that are in use. Coker is better for that Originally Posted by GuyBoden
Good video, well done.
Yes, Lego Bricks seemed a good idea, but it has been too much to remember.
It was easier to remember common chord progressions that frequently occur in songs.
Jazz Lego Bricks example below:
The Method – Insights In Jazz
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"How You Learn Tunes Sucks!" Originally Posted by Christian Miller
"Learn Tunes The Smart Way!"
"Why You Can't Learn Jazz Tunes!"
"Fix How You Learn Jazz Tunes!"
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Confusing a Montgomery Ward bridge with a Sears Roebuck bridge will cause a trainwreck.
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Luckily we have these things called ears on both sides of our heads Originally Posted by sgosnell
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Exactly Originally Posted by Cunamara
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Yes, and the same chord, this time inverted, occurs again at bar 29. We commonly play that in the key of C as D-7 with an 'A' in the melody on the word 'not' but the original is Fm6/D (pre half-diminished terminology!) with an 'Ab'. A rare case - Darn That Dream is another - where the melody was altered to accommodate a harmonic variation. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Right, Denis mentions in a blog post that the sheet music has Fm although people often play F#o. I agree that it is good to know the original changes, but it is also good to know the common practice. When I played All Of Me with Denis we did it both ways. Either one works with the melody. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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It's an interesting example of dual-coding. I might employ terms like these to quickly communicate a sequence to another musician onstage. However, I never use such verbal prompts internally when recalling changes for standards. Originally Posted by GuyBoden
Good video, well done.
Yes, Lego Bricks seemed a good idea, but it has been too much to remember.
It was easier to remember common chord progressions that frequently occur in songs.
Jazz Lego Bricks example below:
The Method – Insights In Jazz
It strikes me as like learning to play piano on a keyboard with different colours on each key and stickers with note names. It's meant to reinforce the connection but runs the risk of taking us further away from the thing itself. Similarly, most foreign language methods suggest that we avoid translating new words or phrases back into our own language.
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Their demise preceded the internet, they were done in by lower priced retailers like Walmart and Target, so we may want to rename it the Walmart bridge (don't think Target ever sold guitars). Believe my first guitar came from Monkey Ward, it was not very good. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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$28 solid body electric from Montgomery Ward; taught myself to play with it, no amp! Eventually sold it for $50, still never having played through an amp. Kind of wish I'd held on to it... Originally Posted by Mick-7
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Yes the only other example I can think of off the top of my head are the Trane re harms but I’m sure there’s others Originally Posted by PMB
I do like that chord in All of Me
There’s a lot of nuances in the original changes that got lost over time. Indiana and Georgia are two more examples. I have had learn the older style chords for some trad bands I play in, which is great.
For the backend of Indiana we play
A7 Dm Db7 F A7 Bb Bo7 F/C C7 F
I understand why they changed it, but the old one is cool.
Conrad “Lego bricks” Cork pointed out a lot of bop changes are actually simplified from the old school ones. Facilitates blowing for one thing. Also stylistically I guess it sounds more modern.
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