Did Django Reinhardt Have Perfect Pitch?

[rsclosson]

Silly question, I know. What does it matter? But still, I am curious. His improvisation which, in my humble opinion, doesn't border on genius its well beyond the border into the realm of pure genius. It seems so effortless and every solo is a miniature composition in its own right; even when I listen to multiple takes of the same tune.

He is not "trained" in the generally accepted sense, but his innovative playing has influenced countless guitarists and non guitarists. There is something happening there.

[FourOnSix]

Perfect pitch and musical genius are apples and oranges.

[mr. beaumont]

Not a chance. He couldn't even tune his own guitar, they say. That would have driven a person with perfect pitch INSANE.

[neatomic]

Not a chance. He couldn't even tune his own guitar, they say. That would have driven a person with perfect pitch INSANE.

i don't know about that!!!...because he only/mostly used 2 fingers to fret...he did so many slides and jumps over large intervals on the fretboard...and always hit them right on tune...or bent them in a pure tuneful way...thats pretty good pitch!!

he was perfect musical soul thats for sure!!

i've always loved his later electric recordings...he sings on the guitar


cheers

[rsclosson]

The rather dismissive replies are bewildering. Perfect pitch or not, I sincerely believe he knew every note he was reaching for, and the scales and intervals he used were never simple and never a bad note that needed corrected. I don't know if a perfect command of the fretboard can relate to perfect pitch, but to say he had a good ear is the understatement of the century.

I did read that he told Duke Ellington just to play and he would follow along. I dare say he did so very successfully!

[Hep To The Jive]

The rather dismissive replies are bewildering. Perfect pitch or not, I sincerely believe he knew every note he was reaching for, and the scales and intervals he used were never simple and never a bad note that needed corrected. I don't know if a perfect command of the fretboard can relate to perfect pitch, but to say he had a good ear is the understatement of the century.

I did read that he told Duke Ellington just to play and he would follow along. I dare say he did so very successfully!

Perfect command of the fretboard don't depend in any way on perfect pitch though. Sorry, but it's unrelated. He could have it, I don't know for sure, but I never read about it anywhere, and I wouldn't think it would matter.

Thing is, Perfect Pitch is not a next step in the ear development. You could have a fantastic ear for music and not have a Perfect Pitch. Usually people are born with it, and it could be a curse too. Relative pitch is far more important to develop.

[neatomic]

^^ good point hep..perfect and relative are different..tho i'd imagine anyone with perfect would also have perfect relative pitch as well


interesting


pitches in general are defined by location...the western system far different than say, the north indian classical or japanese koto music

cheers

[christianm77]

Not a chance. He couldn't even tune his own guitar, they say. That would have driven a person with perfect pitch INSANE.

Indeed. Tuning is what your little brother is for.

[christianm77]

Is it possible to technically have perfect pitch if you don’t know note names?

Django may have had absolute pitch perhaps.

[Alder Statesman]

He certainly had perfect timing.

[christianm77]

I would certainly take perfect time over perfect pitch. More important in this music.

[AndyV]

He couldn't even tune his own guitar,

Aw, c'mon - Django couldn't tune his guitar - ridiculous!

There's a famous story of a Paris jam session with American horn players where they kept changing keys and Django was the only one who lasted through every key modulations; his ear was simply unbeatable. He may have been lazy about tuning up but I dare say he could do it in his sleep.

[rsclosson]

From an article I found here: Gypsy Jazz and Django Reinhardt
"Possessing an exceptionally keen ear and quick musical mind, Django usually could hear a tune once and repeat it immediately back on his guitar. Excited by the new sounds, he began incorporating the music he heard from American artists into his own playing,"

Sounds almost like the same kind of talent Mozart had.

[rsclosson]

Thanks!!! I read on the djangobooks forum that he could, as reported by another jazz guitarist, quickly tune his guitar.

Aw, c'mon - Django couldn't tune his guitar - ridiculous!

There's a famous story of a Paris jam session with American horn players where they kept changing keys and Django was the only one who lasted through every key modulations; his ear was simply unbeatable. He may have been lazy about tuning up but I dare say he could do it in his sleep.

[rsclosson]

Frankly, that makes sense. Just from extensive listening to his playing, I believe that he knew exactly what notes to play and where to go to play them. His opening chord melody in his J'attendrai Swing video is pure genius!

Is it possible to technically have perfect pitch if you don’t know note names?

Django may have had absolute pitch perhaps.

[rsclosson]

I will find the article if necessary but in speaking to a doctoral candidate in music performance, he cited an article that explained that speakers of pitch based languages almost all have perfect pitch. It's part of their communication system.

Perfect command of the fretboard don't depend in any way on perfect pitch though. Sorry, but it's unrelated. He could have it, I don't know for sure, but I never read about it anywhere, and I wouldn't think it would matter.

Thing is, Perfect Pitch is not a next step in the ear development. You could have a fantastic ear for music and not have a Perfect Pitch. Usually people are born with it, and it could be a curse too. Relative pitch is far more important to develop.

[christianm77]

Yeah ... Before learning the names .. Rick Beatos son Dylan had his own names for each note ... Bb was the star wars note and so on

Now that’s interesting. I’d not heard that....

however this leads into the thorny subject of the fact that I can sing Star Wars in the correct key but that doesn’t mean I have perfect pitch.

Most people have some limited absolute pitch recall.... presumably it’s some sort of spectrum.

That absolute pitch recall is fragile ... easily overwhelmed by outside influences.

Anyway I think the pitch thing is usually based around piano. Having someone develop perfect pitch on guitar might be a visual thing. Hear this note - see it on the fretboard. I have that a little bit but usually need a pitch reference to start.

[mr. beaumont]

Now that’s interesting. I’d not heard that....

however this leads into the thorny subject of the fact that I can sing Star Wars in the correct key but that doesn’t mean I have perfect pitch.

That just means you're a dork.

Gabba gabba we accept you.

[Ozymandias]

Stravinsky didn't have perfect pitch.

For me at least that completely settles the debate about whether perfect pitch is necessary for musical genius.

[rsclosson]

Oh! Is this a debate?? I thought I was just starting a friendly conversation that could have been fun.

Stravinsky didn't have perfect pitch.

For me at least that completely settles the debate about whether perfect pitch is necessary for musical genius.

[mr. beaumont]

My guess is Django had perfect or near perfect relative pitch.

Much more useful than perfect pitch.

Perfect pitch, for many, is a curse, not a blessing.

[Ozymandias]

Oh! Is this a debate?? I thought I was just starting a friendly conversation that could have been fun.

I referred to a debate. I didn't say the thread was a debate. But in any case a friendly conversation that is fun can, surely, take the form of a debate?

[PMB]

Now that’s interesting. I’d not heard that....

however this leads into the thorny subject of the fact that I can sing Star Wars in the correct key but that doesn’t mean I have perfect pitch.

Most people have some limited absolute pitch recall.... presumably it’s some sort of spectrum.

That absolute pitch recall is fragile ... easily overwhelmed by outside influences.

Anyway I think the pitch thing is usually based around piano. Having someone develop perfect pitch on guitar might be a visual thing. Hear this note - see it on the fretboard. I have that a little bit but usually need a pitch reference to start.

There's definitely a spectrum. The guitarist in a stage band I direct can recognise and sing any note played or requested yet he can't tune his guitar accurately without a reference. He's a student of mine, an excellent player who's only been learning for a year and a half and in one of our lessons, he mentioned that his interval awareness was weak. It's not uncommon for people with perfect pitch to have underdeveloped relative pitch skills so I played a middle C and asked him to sing the 3rd. He sang the 5th and I told him that I was looking for an E. He supplied that immediately. I followed with a G and then quickly threw him the names for a bunch of non-diatonic tones. They all came back with 100% accuracy. I asked this student how he identified each one and his source was songs by The Beatles, The Who, The Kinks and The Small Faces (so an absolute knowledge of British mod groups of the '60s as well, interesting enough for a 17 year old!).

[christianm77]

That just means you're a dork.

Gabba gabba we accept you.

Hehe

I can also do it for Eastenders, but this will mean nothing to you lot....

[christianm77]

I know quite a few people with perfect pitch

It’s not that much of a big deal