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@allanallen
You should not talk about things you don't know. I know dude personally, and he is doing quite well financially and always has a smile on his face. Some other things about him are he always has a positive upbeat attitude, along with mucho drive and focus. Those are intangibles that help people reach their goals.
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03-10-2025 03:17 PM
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It is very possible to have a career in the arts, and it almost always comes with some type of sacrifice as well.
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Everyone makes sacrifices in some area. Elon Musk makes sacrifices to accomplish his goals, and he's a billionaire. He's running at least 3 large corporations and also working for the Govt. Reportedly, he works long hours, so one sacrifice he makes is probably spending less time with his kids, for example, and probably also taking fewer vacay's than he could.
When Bill Gates was starting Microsoft he said he didn't take any vacations for years because he was worried the competition might surpass him if he did.
Everyone makes sacrifices in some area or another to become successful, that's not surprising.
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Career based sacrifices usually go over better than telling your wife you'll miss her birthday because it's on the same night as your for tips gig at a pizza place.
I no longer think we are having the same conversation.
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No, as I said before, at your current level of aptitude on the guitar, those kinds of gigs are all you're likely to get, but don't try and put that off on everyone else, because that is not the truth for everyone. That's all I'm saying.
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Well, Allan… you heard the man … I guess it’s time to buckle down and hit the shed.
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What's the name of this guitar player and where is he located?I always enjoy going to hear a good player.Does he have a website?I'm sure he wouldn't mind you giving him some free publicity.
Originally Posted by AdroitMage
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I’ll get to it one of these days. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Woah, tough crowd at this forum gig! - but at least the great pay compensates for it.
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How much less do you think it is, and compared to when? Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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You might even need to gig a little, you know, hustle a bit Originally Posted by AllanAllen
I’ll get to it one of these days.
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Some places that used to book bands are booking solo or duo acts, some places are cancelling music, some are closing forever. Originally Posted by Al Haig
I know places come and go, but I’ve had patrons tell me it hasn’t been the same since Covid and that the casino down the street is full, but bars are empty.
But then last night I played to a full room of jazz fans, so who knows.
It’s a small sample set, but I’m not surprised that an industry with razor thin margins is struggling in years of inflation and stagnant wages.
I also don’t have first hand pre-covid experience, I didn’t know this 3 hour band thing still existed until I moved out of Chicago and went to a blues jam. My scene was 3-4 bands splitting a bill playing original songs. I thought 3 hour sets died in the 60s.
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What if I make a mistake in front of people Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
You might even need to gig a little, you know, hustle a bit
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Some of you guys in this thread remind me of that old school cartoon character who used to always say, in a really funny, drab voice, "'t'll never work, it'll never work.' Meanwhile, all the more upbeat, slap happy cartoon characters would get to it, and of course after some zany cartoon antics, LOL, everything would work out beautifully. I think there's a lesson in there somewhere. Hmmm???
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Hey, if you really want it, that's what you'll do. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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I was wondering this, too. Originally Posted by nyc chaz
There does seem to be an unwritten rule on this site not to actually name players. Not sure why, in most cases folks are singing the praises of these unnamed players, and I'm sure the majority of them would welcome the additional exposure.
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Wait.... you don't think Adroit Mage conjured this player out of thin air, do you? Originally Posted by nyc chaz
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If that were it, I’d be famous already Originally Posted by AdroitMage
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About the general music-performance environment: Ours is not a jazz town, but I've been able to observe (and even participate in) the local musical-entertainment biz and culture for thirty-plus years and have quite a few friends and acquaintances in gigging-players circles. Here's what I've seen:
When we moved here in '77 there was a thriving bar scene (we're a college town and a retail hub), featuring both rock and country music in the bars and the tail end of the folk boom in coffee houses, pizza places, and some campus spaces. A series of legal-cultural-economic changes whittled away at that scene--no-smoking laws, increased drunk-driving enforcement, and other pressures on the saloon business. The creeping acceptance of DJs over live music didn't help, either. Control of university activity planning was taken over by student committees who booked, say, a Don Knotts speech rather than acoustic music acts. (And now the cultural event budget has been all but eliminated.) By the time Covid hit, half the joints along the bar strip had either closed or stopped hiring bands, and when things opened up again, the damage was done.
The new live-music environment features tribute-band concerts in sit-down spaces, with a tiny handful of restaurants and drinking establishments hosting non-rock acts. (Two non-profit groups bring in chamber music and folk acts and the city's renovated vaudeville house books crowd-pleasing middlebrow and country touring acts. All three depend on arts-board grants to stay viable.) The university recently collapsed the music department and is planning on closing down the performance-center building that houses two of the three campus auditoriums.
I still know a pretty decent bunch of highly competent local players, and nearly every one of them depends on a day job and/or a working spouse to maintain a middle-class existence. That compromise was part of the formula thirty years ago, but now it's nearly universal. There's a joke about the theatre: you can make a killing but you can't make a living. It seems to apply to music as well. (Also to writing, acting, painting. . . .)
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No name has been forthcoming so i will let people make their own conclusions. Originally Posted by CliffR
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LOL, I never said that's all you have to do, but yes if you really want it, you'll do that. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
Metheny, by his own admission, woodshedded like a maniac for 10 hours a day from the age of 12 until he was 19 or 20 and teaching at Berkley. I could tell you a lot of other true stories like that.
I also said in a previous post that you have to be really honest with yourself about how good you are. If you're shedding like crazy and still not sounding great, then maybe being a musician is not for you. The truth is, not everyone has the ear to be a great musician. Joe also said that being a good player of improvised music is more about hearing than playing because you can't play what you can't hear. I happen to agree with that statement.
Especially in jazz though, that shedding time is important.
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You could practice all you want but a lot has to do with circumstances and luck.Yes you have to prepared to take advantage if such an opportunity presents itself.Go to a place like Nashville and there is literally a great guitar player every 10 ft but a lot are working other jobs to make money hoping maybe they can break through.You also don't have to be the most talented to make it.Eric Gale was a guitarist who played on many jazz albums in the 70's through the 90's and recorded many solo albums.Nobody was going to confuse this guy with George Benson but he had a solid career that most people would jump at.No blazing licks from him but he did more than ok for himself.
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I'm sure there are thousands of players who have put those hours in but never had the luck and/or other skills needed to turn all those efforts into a career. But, in jazz - and several other genres, too, I suspect - you have to do that work. Otherwise, when lady luck graces you with her presence you may find you missed your one shot because you neglected that woodshedding.
I've never come across a great player yet who, when you read their biographies and interviews, didn't do that work. But, of course, the ones lady luck (and lord wherewithall) never visited don't get interviewed.
But they probably show up on forums such as these, where they are valuable members. Mightn't be what they originally aspired to, though.
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Jimmy Bruno has said on his channel, his entire career as a jazz musician is because a guy who ran a pizza place liked him so much he recorded him and got him on a label.
Jimmy has also said when he toured, there was a world class guitarist in every town he went to "an I mean ev'ry f'kin town I went to" who just didn't get lucky.
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You make it sound like a "world class guitarist" in every town is the norm, something that shouldn't be hard to find if you just turn up to any town and head to the local jam session.
Luck plays a very important role, I know it from personal experience in my family (nothing guitar related). But luck can only get you that far, you also need to be very good to make "it". Better than most.
And yes, people have blind spots. Famous maxim from the Temple of Apollo at Delphi in ancient Greece: Know thyself
Peace
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Chunking, does it work for Jazz improv?
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