Mike Moreno solo on green dolphin

**voxo** · 04-20-2023, 06:14 AM

blimey .my Harley Benton acoustic/electric paid 50 quid for sounds as good....i have Mike as a soloist on band in a box...soon as i run the Phil Woods soloist...ill check him out...

**ragman1** · 04-20-2023, 07:12 AM

Heh heh :-)

**Enricopg** · 04-20-2023, 07:16 AM

Originally Posted by voxo

blimey .my Harley Benton acoustic/electric paid 50 quid for sounds as good....i have Mike as a soloist on band in a box...soon as i run the Phil Woods soloist...ill check him out...

Now I start to worry. Not only I do not understand what Mike Moreno plays in his solo. But I can’t even understand some of your replies guys. I think this is my old age…

**ragman1** · 04-20-2023, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Enricopg

Now I start to worry. Not only I do not understand what Mike Moreno plays in his solo. But I can’t even understand some of your replies guys. I think this is my old age…

I know, that's the whole point. Moreno's solo is modern and, as someone said, a personal interpretation. His timing isn't too bad but it's still mildly rubato, in other words as he happened to feel it.

It would help to understand what he's playing if we knew what was in his head. We'd like to think he was only playing over certain chords but he may not have been. Without a background harmony it's very hard to say. We know the usual chords but, as I said before, there are many different versions.

If you have time, try looking in You Tube for transcriptions of this tune by various famous players. There are several and they have the chords written in the score. They're all different, or most of them. I'd show you but I'm sure you can do it. So who knows what Moreno is doing?

It's no use other people telling you it's all very obvious to them. Good for them but it's no use to you. Personally, I think the only way you're really going to work this out is if you literally transcribe the solo accurately. Even then you may not fully understand it.

There's a version by Lage Lund, also highly idiosyncratic. These people will play this stuff! I'll put that video below. In the meantime, may I ask you a question? Never mind this ultra-modern playing, can you improvise over the usual version easily? That would help. Because I think if you find that difficult then it may be rather ambitious to attempt this other stuff.

I have a feeling all you want to do is get hold of some interesting bebop lines to put into your playing. Nothing wrong with that, of course, and I wish you luck with it.

Don't look into his eyes for too long... he's a very strange person :-)

**Jerzy** · 04-20-2023, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by Marc Grossman

I'm sure he's 3 times as good as I am, but I just don't understand this presentation. Why not record the chord changes, and then play the solo over the chord changes? Between 1:30 and 3:00 he's playing 95% single lines with no background chords. What's the point of this?

I'm sure he's 3xxx times better than you are.

**mr. beaumont** · 04-20-2023, 08:45 AM

If anything, this thread has definitely inspired me to play "Dolphin" as a solo piece...

**alltunes** · 04-20-2023, 09:36 AM

Thanks for posting this. Pretty obvious that it is Green Dolphin Street and a what an inspirational take on a standard.

**Enricopg** · 04-20-2023, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by ragman1

I know, that's the whole point. Moreno's solo is modern and, as someone said, a personal interpretation. His timing isn't too bad but it's still mildly rubato, in other words as he happened to feel it.

It would help to understand what he's playing if we knew what was in his head. We'd like to think he was only playing over certain chords but he may not have been. Without a background harmony it's very hard to say. We know the usual chords but, as I said before, there are many different versions.

If you have time, try looking in You Tube for transcriptions of this tune by various famous players. There are several and they have the chords written in the score. They're all different, or most of them. I'd show you but I'm sure you can do it. So who knows what Moreno is doing?

It's no use other people telling you it's all very obvious to them. Good for them but it's no use to you. Personally, I think the only way you're really going to work this out is if you literally transcribe the solo accurately. Even then you may not fully understand it.

There's a version by Lage Lund, also highly idiosyncratic. These people will play this stuff! I'll put that video below. In the meantime, may I ask you a question? Never mind this ultra-modern playing, can you improvise over the usual version easily? That would help. Because I think if you find that difficult then it may be rather ambitious to attempt this other stuff.

I have a feeling all you want to do is get hold of some interesting bebop lines to put into your playing. Nothing wrong with that, of course, and I wish you luck with it.

Don't look into his eyes for too long... he's a very strange person :-)

thanks for sharing this video. I do not appreciate listening much Lage Lund although I realize how good he must be. Your observations are all very valid. In the meantime I tried to transcribe few lines. I made few progress. It is not that strange after all.

**mr. beaumont** · 04-20-2023, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by ragman1

Then you're smarter than I am, bro :-)

But I did hear the odd reference to the melody. At least I got that far.

Oh, I don't think I'm that smart at all...I just keep singing the melody in my head while he's going and it all makes sense.

**ragman1** · 04-20-2023, 10:34 AM

Just a turn of phrase, Jeff. Incidentally, I looked through your channel to see if you'd done it but I couldn't see anything. Well, I dare say you'll just float through it easy as pie :-)

**Christian Miller** · 04-20-2023, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by ragman1

I know, that's the whole point. Moreno's solo is modern and, as someone said, a personal interpretation. His timing isn't too bad but it's still mildly rubato, in other words as he happened to feel it.

It would help to understand what he's playing if we knew what was in his head. We'd like to think he was only playing over certain chords but he may not have been. Without a background harmony it's very hard to say. We know the usual chords but, as I said before, there are many different versions.

If you have time, try looking in You Tube for transcriptions of this tune by various famous players. There are several and they have the chords written in the score. They're all different, or most of them. I'd show you but I'm sure you can do it. So who knows what Moreno is doing?

It's no use other people telling you it's all very obvious to them. Good for them but it's no use to you. Personally, I think the only way you're really going to work this out is if you literally transcribe the solo accurately. Even then you may not fully understand it.

There's a version by Lage Lund, also highly idiosyncratic. These people will play this stuff! I'll put that video below. In the meantime, may I ask you a question? Never mind this ultra-modern playing, can you improvise over the usual version easily? That would help. Because I think if you find that difficult then it may be rather ambitious to attempt this other stuff.

I have a feeling all you want to do is get hold of some interesting bebop lines to put into your playing. Nothing wrong with that, of course, and I wish you luck with it.

Don't look into his eyes for too long... he's a very strange person :-)

Bloody love it

He’s a man of dry scandy wit which I think is how he plays

**mheton** · 04-20-2023, 12:39 PM

@jimmybluenote.. that is very well explained +1

**Lionelsax** · 04-21-2023, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by ragman1

Uh? There's no assumption. The OP said it was hard for him to follow where he was in the progression. Dead right, it is.

You should add your legendary comping on it and everything will be clear enough.

**Lionelsax** · 04-21-2023, 09:58 AM

I listened to it, there is nothing to add.
It's just great !
He plays good, he plays music.
It doesn't sound so "modern".
It sounds like someone who knows what he is playing.

**James W** · 04-21-2023, 09:59 AM

Bit late coming to this thread, but having just listened to the video in question, I have to add my voice to those who are perplexed about finding it difficult. He quite explicitly outlines the chords and doesn't get much far out or even that adventurous (sounds good though!)

Probably just a case of the OP lacking familiarity with this tune, which I am familiar with from several or more Miles Davis records.

**GuyBoden** · 04-21-2023, 10:10 AM

Wow, that's good.

**kris** · 04-21-2023, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by Lionelsax

You should add your legendary comping on it and everything will be clear enough.

This may not be so easy.

**Lionelsax** · 04-21-2023, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by kris

This may not be so easy.

It can be done but with a bass or a gentle comping.

**grahambop** · 04-21-2023, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by Lionelsax

You should add your legendary comping on it and everything will be clear enough.

Well funny you should say that, I have just done something like that. I’ve tapped out a click track on it, and overdubbed a simple bass part. It wasn’t too difficult, except in a couple of places where the time went a bit ‘elastic’ for a moment. He wasn’t playing anything remotely rubato, it was all pretty close to a constant 182 bpm. (I slowed it down by 25% to make it clearer). Thought it might help the OP, and I might pinch some ideas from it myself!

I’ll post it when I’ve finished mixing it.

**eh6794-2.0** · 04-21-2023, 10:53 AM

Log into your Google Chrome browser. Download the plugin "video speed controller." You can slow songs down to 2% without changing the notes.

**Lionelsax** · 04-21-2023, 10:53 AM

Originally Posted by grahambop

Well funny you should say that, I have just done something like that. I’ve tapped out a click track on it, and overdubbed a simple bass part. It wasn’t too difficult, except in a couple of places where the time went a bit ‘elastic’ for a moment. He wasn’t playing anything remotely rubato, it was all pretty close to a constant 182 bpm. (I slowed it down by 25% to make it clearer). Thought it might help the OP, and I might pinch some ideas from it myself!

I’ll post it when I’ve finished mixing it.

I was playing the bass when you posted this.
When I'm alone at home I will record my bass and share.
It's definitely not modern, everything is clear and good !
For me there is no reharmonization.
It's strictly the changes.

**grahambop** · 04-21-2023, 11:07 AM

For Enricopg, here it is slowed down by 25%, with clicks on beats 1 and 3, and bass notes on the chord roots.

**jameslovestal** · 04-21-2023, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

Really? I think he's outlining the changes quite well, and lots of hints to the melody too...

I also can hear the changes quite clearly with enough "hints to the melody" to hear the changes.

I assume those that can't either don't know the changes very well or are just need more than "hints" to follow them.

**mr. beaumont** · 04-21-2023, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by jameslovestal

I also can hear the changes quite clearly with enough "hints to the melody" to hear the changes.

I assume those that can't either don't know the changes very well or are just need more than "hints" to follow them.

This is a good one to just sing a reduced melody along with. Like just long tones on the A section, 2 bars Eb, 2 bars Db, 1 bar C, one bar B, one bar Bb...

Just sing that along with Moreno, or even Lund, and you can hear the ideas better, I think.