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This week, a bossa, from Joe Henderson's "Page One."
8 bars of modal flavor followed by some descending ii V I's with a little twist. Fun stuff.
I did mine with Jim Hall in mind.
Enjoy!
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02-11-2021 08:19 PM
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So is it "Page One" or "Recordame"?
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Recordame, from the album Page One. Whole album is great though!
Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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Really nice playing, Jeff!
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Ok, I went looking for a backing track and found something fun! Inspired me to get out my little Ibanez guitar that's been modified to become a Cuban Très. Always gets me in a good mood to try to play latin music...Much needed in these special times we are going through.
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Very nice Jeff! Love the Jim Hall approach!
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This was AWESOME. Originally Posted by Ronstuff
I love the tres. I assume you cut new nut slots? What did you do about bridge spacing? It sounds great. Great playing too...those tres montunos were happening!
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I bought the instrument from a friend who had the work done by a Luthier, so unfortunately I don't know about the details. Basically the guy added new slots for the correct string spacing. Got it last summer, and started hanging out with some guys that play salsa in the park. The parks were pretty much the only place to play music here(Montreal) last summer... Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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Yeah, I can definitely hear some Jim Hall in there (channeling some Bossa Antigua, perhaps?). Setting the bar high, as always. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
This week, a bossa, from Joe Henderson's "Page One."
8 bars of modal flavor followed by some descending ii V I's with a little twist. Fun stuff.
I did mine with Jim Hall in mind.
Enjoy!
John
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I found a backing track by live musicians that I was really enjoying playing to (though it somewhat kicked my butt), so I played it all the way through. Too long, and with moments of Recorda-merde, but WTF, YOLO, fortune rewards the bold, yada yada.
John
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Love the sound and the vibe of it. Great stuff. Originally Posted by Ronstuff
John
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I don't know what to do with this. It's too easy and you don't have to learn that fiddly tune. The question is how long does it go on for and how long before we start putting strange ideas into it? Sorry, just being honest.
And I guess once it's done, it's done, if you see what I mean.
I shouldn't be writing this.
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Yeah! Some great lines there, the fast stuff really works for me. Originally Posted by John A.
The time is fluttery, as kris said, and to my ears it sounds like a recording, not a playing issue.
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I'm gonna let you pick a tune one week man, you don't like anything! Originally Posted by ragman1
In the spirit of jam sessions, ill be calling jam session type tunes. No 64 bar ABABCD forms or anything like that.
The acoustic with all the reverb sounds nice on this, creates a space. I think if you explore further you might end up liking this one...its like a miniature of a lot of 60's "modal tunes," most of which were structured more like this than say, "impressions."
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No, no it's a playing too many choruses too late at night problem. The last couple are the worst (hence my "recorda-merde" quip). That, plus the pulse in the backing track actually wanders around (I tried synching it to a metronome, but the time varies too much to do that) and the players are not always together with each other. There are a few spots there where I was stumbling between the bass and piano trying to figure out whom to follow. I should have picked a simpler and steadier backing track, but I like the energy of this one despite it being hard to follow. Sometimes that's how it goes in the real world, too. Originally Posted by kris
John
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Rag,
You already have a really nice and old school melodic concept that isn't so enmeshed in "trying to sound like bebop" like mine is most of the time.
Here's how I make these deceptively "easy" tunes worth my while.
Pick a very short melodic figure and develop it into a theme. Don't be obvious with how you refer to the theme, but always have the theme in mind. Play a phrase, pay attention to the contour--where is your highest note and your lowest note? Come back to that note in the next phrase. Practice the concept before, but let it occur naturally and spur of the moment when you improvise. After you try coming back to one note, find two. See how long you can hold on to a phrase in your head while NOT playing it. Then, right before you forget it--play it
Next up. A lot of people talk about the endless scale exercise, where you change the scale for each chord while maintaining it's contour and direction. I mentioned this a WHILE ago, but it's still public information that one of my teachers posted. Snake and the rocks:
He talks about more really funny yet illuminating music metaphors in his book The Lobster Theory. Worth a look
LOBSTER THEORY – Greg Fishman Jazz Studios
Not my advice, got the above from great teachers in the past. Helps make a solo compositional while still being improvisatory.
There's a ton of rhythmic and "feel" (behind, on top, and right on the beat) type stuff you can practice a well. I think it's pretty straight forward to write or "pre-compose" phrases that start on different parts of the measure. The downbeat, the "and" of 4, etc. Doing that on the fly while you are in the midst of a solo can be more challenging. Actually, I switched from tapping my foot and 2 and 4 to now tapping on 1 and 3 for that reason. When I tapped on 2 and 4 I got so focused on those beats that I forgot how to feel 1 and 3--I couldn't feel the downbeat clearly in my body.
Tapping on 2 and 4 vs. 1 and 3 is another controversy and story for another thread (that I'm NOT going to start). Both have their purpose, and it goes WELL beyond Latin vs. Swing feel.
Anyways, that's all the news that's fit to print. Can't wait till tonight when I can play and record some
Last edited by PickingMyEars; 02-12-2021 at 12:09 PM.
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Hey, I didn't say I didn't like it! Where did I say that? I do like it! Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
The tricky part is getting the head together if you don't know it but that's okay because we don't have to use it here. But there's nothing wrong with the form or the chords, etc. Just trying not to make it sound like flamenco!
In fact this one's great - Bossa, not too fast (for me). I really enjoyed doing it. Couldn't stop, hence the 4 mins.
I haven't run out of ideas yet either. I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it!
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Great tune and one of my favourite albums. If it wasn't for Recorda Me and Blue Bossa anyway, the ballad La Mesha alone would be worth the price of admission. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Tried to record a take this afternoon but always get digital distortion on the audio track. Will give it another try tomorrow if you don't mind...
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My bad, you called the tune "fiddly." That didn't sound like a compliment. Originally Posted by ragman1
Hey, I didn't say I didn't like it! Where did I say that? I do like it!
The tricky part is getting the head together if you don't know it but that's okay because we don't have to use it here. But there's nothing wrong with the form or the chords, etc. Just trying not to make it sound like flamenco!
In fact this one's great - Bossa, not too fast (for me). I really enjoyed doing it. Couldn't stop, hence the 4 mins.
I haven't run out of ideas yet either. I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it I like it!
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It's fiddly if you've never played it before (like me)! Well, I thought it was. It's the leaps. Point is, it takes a long time to master the tune and very little to get a solo going. And I'm lazy and impatient :-)
I don't know if anyone's interested but one idea (not on the first go) is to make all the doms into backdoors, then use their ii's. If you consider the M7s as minor sounds then you get the descending line:
(Ebm) -
Dm - Dbm - Cm - Bm
Bbm - % - Am - E7#9
Then move the ii's up a m3rd and get this:
Dm - Em - Cm - Dm
Bbm - Dbm - Am - E7#9
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I think that idea has a lot of potential.
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Hell yeah, Peter.
Your posts have this "let's fucking DO THIS" attitude i love. Fresh and energetic.
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Jeff, I especially liked your chord work, great rhythm.
Ronstuff, that was very refreshing with a great rhythmic feel.
John A., I don't think it kicked your butt at all and I appreciate your adventurousness.
I didn't have time to figure out anything interesting, but I like to participate whenever I can.
Oh Jeff, just read your comment. Thanks man, that perfectly sums up my attitude when I used to turn up at jams without knowing WTF I was going to play
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I'm really enjoying all the different stylistic guitar mojo.
Here's my 2 cents:
Last edited by Marshall535; 02-17-2021 at 03:06 PM. Reason: updated URL
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Finally had a chance to record.
Long solo. I tried to make the solo build and not come off as "that guy" that takes one thousand choruses--in a damn jam session--and says nothing...
... I think I became "that guy." Building a long solo is an artform and I am on the tip of the iceberg. Hell, at least I found the right iceberg--they kinda all look like blocks of ice to me
At least I am having fun trying to out wit everyone here with creative titles for these submissions. Transcribing My Voice Memos = Recorda Me... yeah, I know. I get a pass for bad jokes because I'm a dad, right?
Enjoy or begrudgingly listen:
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Fine contributions so far! So here's my modest short take. I got a bit nervous because I still had problems with audio distortion so this is a bit shaky in places but I decided to upload and post anyway. Maybe I'll give it another shot when I'm more relaxed.
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Nah, long solos are fine. I just think its great practice for people to try and get down a good short statement. Building a long solo that doesnt meander is TOUGH.
So I say solo however long you want, but if you're consistently not loving the results, try a short one. Changes your thinking a lot.
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Thans Kris! It's a standard minor pentatonic blues phrase and re: the distortion: I had it fixed by then but had to scrap several attempts today because of it - thus me not being relaxed. Originally Posted by kris
Nice playing. I like the phrase you play on the beginig of the last chorus.
I do not hear any distorion...
Best
Kris
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Quite right. If you know you can sit and noodle away (I'm guilty) then off you go. But if you know you have only two choruses to say something worthy of attention then it does focus the brain. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Not that I can do it :-)
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Thanks Mr. B.
Just wanted to try and push myself. I never take long solos in jams in real life because I'm intimidated by everyone else. Great musicians over in my part of the world, seriously. Great players young and old. I thought NYC was it for talent... it's not (not like I was any good in NYC as well).
Flubs abound in this one, definitely. But I think I got to some kind of cool places in some parts.
Hard to stop and get out of the zone enough to stop the backing track and my editing software is kinda lousy and hard to use... at least for me.
I have very limited time to play these days, young family and all. So when I sit down to play I have to make a choice: record for this thread or practice for 45 minutes to an hour for the day (if that).
I gave a disclaimer on my previous post. If you want to listen, that's cool. If not, that's cool as well. I'll try to keep it shorter in the future
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Re: long vs short solos, this is a short form, played at a brisk tempo. 3-5 choruses is not long. Obviously, it depends on how well you execute, but taking a few is not some violation of etiquette like droning on for 10 choruses on a 32-bar ballad. Just play.
John
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You guys are way out of my league. My lame pentatonics and I are going to sit this one out and just take notes or something.
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Come on give it a shot lawson - it's not that complicated... Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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It's not that... it's just you guys are playing several levels beyond me and my last attempts on the previous thread, which I was actually happy about, drew zero comments of any kind, which I took as gentlemanly, polite dismissal of the effort. So there are times when one speaks, and times when one listens. This is a listening time I think.
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You ain't getting out that easy Lawson, pentatonics work great on this one!
As for a lack of comments on your last one, I think sometimes its just when you post and if there's traffic. There was a lot of discussion too last week, sometimes the music posts might get buried. Its just the nature of internet discussion, unfortunately.
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Well...I don't think I resemble that remark... Originally Posted by lawson-stone
I didn't get that many comments on my contributions either, maybe one or two. I plead guilty for not commenting on yours - I actually did enjoy them. I didn't do anything with Yardbird Suite because I had the feeling that it was beyond my abilities. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Lawson: I remember your thread about this forum not being much about playing anymore (because no one hardly posted any clips of their playing efforts) which was and still is encouraging to me to post my humble efforts. I want to thank you for that.
Back to the scheduled program now...
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Man you nailed me with my own complaints... so okay, you're right. I'll see what I can do. In one week, I doubt I can learn the melody itself, but the changes actually don't look as hard now as they did when I first checked it out. I've actually never even heard this tune, that I can recall. Maybe it came over jazzradio.com and I just didn't notice. Originally Posted by TOMMO
Well...I don't think I resemble that remark...
I didn't get that many comments on my contributions either, maybe one or two. I plead guilty for not commenting on yours - I actually did enjoy them. I didn't do anything with Yardbird Suite because I had the feeling that it was beyond my abilities.
Lawson: I remember your thread about this forum not being much about playing anymore (because no one hardly posted any clips of their playing efforts) which was and still is encouraging to me to post my humble efforts. I want to thank you for that.
Back to the scheduled program now...
I always appreciate advice from the guys here who play. I don't remember to say it always on clips, but I'm happy to think about constructive criticism from anybody who puts their music out there like the rest of us, no matter their level of accomplishment.
So I'll see what I can do. Maybe I'll use the WRONG pentatonic and end up sounding like some really advanced outside player...
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I don't think you should assume silence is dismissal. I for one stopped paying as much attention to the thread and had moved on mentally after the first few days. I also didn't want to overdo it with comments. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
As for playing this one or sitting it out, I don't think you should let comparisons to others stop you from trying. Either you'll exceed your expectations or you won't. Either outcome is informative, and no one is going to think you shouldn't have bothered or ridicule you. If you don't like the tune or have other things you'd rather work on that's a different story, but don't psych yourself out of trying. Or maybe try the middle ground of taking a stab at the tune privately and deciding whether or not to post later.
John
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(Too?) many notes this time. Thanks for nice and differing contributions everybody.
I liked the space in "Picked"s long take and now I'm listening a second time...
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That's the spirit! Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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Nice one. Good phrasing, you hit all the changes, good tone, good feel. Originally Posted by TOMMO
John
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Very nice! Interesting to see you stay in position - I will have to figure that out. Originally Posted by hohoho
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Thanks a lot John. Originally Posted by John A.
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Nice relaxed feel...you don't sound shaky! Originally Posted by TOMMO
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Nice clean relaxed playing. You're gonna make me want a strat, too Originally Posted by hohoho
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Well, if no one really contributes then this idea will probably just go the way of the PS one. Even M-ster has given up contributing to it.
Personally, I don't have much of a problem doing it. I look at the chords, see what to do with them and do it. Usually it's the first take but if I don't like it then I throw it and do it again. And again if necessary.
I'm quite sure Lawson can do this. I've sent him something to get him into action!
I think a lot of us overthink everything, which only gets the brain screwed and the nerves shivering. You don't need all that. Just sort it out and play it. Worrying whether it's 'brilliant' or not, or 'technically correct' isn't worth it. Just do something. Eventually it'll gel, always does eventually. Lawson, for example, at the end of the last tune, was relaxed and enjoying it. At least, he said so!
Tommo got round it fine. Some players, you think 'the guy's lost, it's just vague and undecided'. Tommo's wasn't, the notes were good, so he knows what to do. He's a nice player anyhow.Last edited by ragman1; 02-14-2021 at 03:26 AM.
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Want to listen closer with headphones later, but your patience is admirable...I like that I can hear you following melodic/rhythmic fragments and developing them. Originally Posted by PickingMyEars
Finally had a chance to record.
Long solo. I tried to make the solo build and not come off as "that guy" that takes one thousand choruses--in a damn jam session--and says nothing...
... I think I became "that guy." Building a long solo is an artform and I am on the tip of the iceberg. Hell, at least I found the right iceberg--they kinda all look like blocks of ice to me
At least I am having fun trying to out wit everyone here with creative titles for these submissions. Transcribing My Voice Memos = Recorda Me... yeah, I know. I get a pass for bad jokes because I'm a dad, right?
Enjoy or begrudgingly listen:
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Mr. B,
Thanks for the patience on your end.
Mr. Hohoho,
Space... is the place... man. In some parts on the internet I am known as Mr. Space Man, for better or worse...
... probably for worse
Lawson-Stone,
Give it the ol' college try. Helps to build up confidence so that once all this all done, you can play at real jam sessions.
If you find the right spot, jam sessions are quite supportive and a great place to grow.
If you find the wrong spot... then you learn what "taking a long solo" really sounds like a jam... it's even worse when you are on the bandstand with that person--in the rhythm section--and they don't give two franks about listening to you or anyone in the rhythm section. They just want to prove to everyone that they are worthy of Coltrane and McCoy Tyner... Most of the time they are not, but it awesome to witness the musicians who come close to that bar
Yeah... I've had some great jam experiences and... well, Hep's been with me for a couple of 'em in NYC wayback in the time of waybacks. He'll attest to the wankering as well as the quality playing that frequents these joints
Last edited by PickingMyEars; 02-13-2021 at 02:38 PM.
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