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I have to admit that there is something special about an accomplished improviser ripping a complex bop solo.
But one thing that attracted me to Miles Davis was his ability to make a strong statement with simplicity and taste. A couple of his quotes that I like are "In music, silence is more important than sound." and "Don't worry about playing a lot of notes. Just find one pretty one."
As jazz musicians, and I think especially true for guitarists, we spend a lot of time developing technique to play impressive riffs at breakneck tempos. There is nothing wrong with that. Good technique is important for a musician to be able to convey whatever sound they hear in their head, but I sometimes think it can be more difficult to elicit emotion with an economy of notes. It's like Mark Twain said, "I apologize for such a long letter- I didn't have time to write a short one."
One of the things that made me fall in love with Kind of Blue was some of the simplicity of many of the solos- long silences punctuated by some well chosen nates making a beautiful musical phrase. Of course, I don't think it would have been nearly as interesting without the contrast of some of the flurries offered by Coltrane and Adderley.
When it comes to blues, it doesn't get much better than a few well chosen notes from B.B. King, especially when he uses that wonderful vibrato of his.
I would love to hear your thoughts on this as well as some examples of players saying more with less.
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09-23-2019 09:50 AM
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I totally agree, I spend all day trying to play faster longer lines on the guitar, yet I find myself listening more and more to players like Lester Young or Jim Hall because I love their melodic economy. Bit daft really! I suppose my ideal is to be able to do both approaches, then mix them up as required.
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For myself, that’s just not what music sounds like in my head. That being said, I play with a buddy of mine that has a sparse style, and I think it makes a nice pair. To each their own.
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Many notes very fast is not only jazz improvisers trap.
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The master of "less is more" was Louis Armstrong.
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or McLaughlin?
(joking)
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Yea... different tunes or performances... different improv. You need to also learn... as also a technique thing... how to build solos.... there are some basic shapes.... which seems to be where your going. generally even when your playin burnin lines.... There are TARGET.... If you just play those simple target notes.... you'll have that very simple slow melodic line you might be looking for.... The point.... different notes have stylistic characteristics over chords...
take a tune and play a simple line on top of the chords... if there aren't that many chords... add some. The point is to start hearing how different notes sound on top of chords.... Ex... take Eb... on top of Bb-11 / Dbmaj9 / C7#9 /G7b13/ then F on top of F-11 / Bbma7 / A7b13 / D7#9.... Where I'm going is there are standard slow melodic lines that can become a melodic figure... a motif that goes through different stages of Development. Melodically, harmonically, rhythmically... articulations.... standard shapes within Tune Forms.
Ever play Sweet and lovely.... you can burn and get very blusy, even bop lines... or you can play simple pedal like melodic note or simple lines... I mean that's what the melody is.
I remember a single note solo the Jazz Pianist Michel Petrucciani took on a tune after some burnin solos... and it was perfect.... I think he then wiped his forehead... as though he was exausted.
Good subject... that thing about burnin players not being able to take those simple sweet solos.... Hmmm. kind of an amateur thing right.
I get that most don't want to make performing etc... but there are standard shapes and organizations,
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Interesting.. Miles' mature improvizational style to me is more about 'impressions'... he plays like making occasional 'brushstrokes'... it is not purely sonoric but still it does not have narrative quality in it ... most jazz players (fast or slow) sound very 'narrative' to me, it is like a consequential story.. even the player like Frisell who seems to be very 'sonoric' in his tools, very much focused on colour of sound - still his solos are consequent tales to me, the phrasing is just like that...ut one thing that attracted me to Miles Davis was his ability to make a strong statement with simplicity and taste. A couple of his quotes that I like are "In music, silence is more important than sound." and "Don't worry about playing a lot of notes. Just find one pretty one."
and Miles sounds like he has a big canvas and just throws it here and there...
Probably that is why I never had interest in copying his phrases... his effect is mostly in overall soundscape he creates... his music is in a great deal formed by the musical enviroment he creates for it himself (maybe he is a sort of playing 'conductor')...
Sorry it is not quite in the topic but it just came to me when I was reading your post/...
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Leaving a pause for a few beats of the measure is a good option. Keeping it busy all the time will eventually become automatic and the notes are not gonna rely on a real urge. During those rests I feel the tension rise and some passages even getting constructed ahead of playing.
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Less is more. Unless it's a time when more is more, then it's time to BURN.
I like balance. Even in a solo with a lot of notes, there's still room for phrasing. Horn players have to breathe eventually. Guitar players should breathe too.
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Speaking of Miles, one of favorite solos of his is on the Sonny Rollins tune "Doxy."
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”Doxy” will always have a special place in my heart. This recording was actually the first jazz composition I heard back in the days. Thanks for all the nostalgia!
Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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I completely agree. I hope I didn't come across as being against players ripping off a burning solo. Hey, Giant Steps is one of my favorite albums! Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
I just think that there are times to sit back and appreciate the simpler things in life. Then again, maybe I'm just getting old.
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As a big Coltrane's fan I think that sometimes "more is more". Trying to put all the possible notes with all possibles intervals in every possible order on every possible chord was a musical exorcism for him and had led to some of the best records of the sixties (it's a personal view, your mileage...).
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Well, I'm old and less is definitely more, even by accident. In fact, my own minimalism sometimes surprises even me...
I was going to say I'm only joking but now I come think of it...
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No, I don't agree with your statment at all that playing slow is harder. It's actually way harder to play good melodic lines over fast tempi than over ballads. All my favourite chops players are great balladeers. Even the fastest of 'm like Bireli. You can't be a good jazz musician if a particular tempo does not suit you. You have ballads and you have fast tunes. That's the way it is. Originally Posted by raylinds
Bebop simply requires fast players. Here's the definition of bebop:
Note that it specifically states "fast tempo."Bebop or bop is a style of jazz developed in the early to mid-1940s in the United States, which features songs characterized by a fast tempo, complex chord progressions with rapid chord changes and numerous changes of key, instrumental virtuosity, and improvisation based on a combination of harmonic structure, the use of scales and occasional references to the melody.
Playing fast is just a tool of expression that comes with the trade. It has nothing to do with lacking emotion or what. Playing fast IS the emotion really.
DB
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I like hearing players with great chops. But, when I listen to music, I rarely put that sort of thing on. I'm much more likely to listen to something at less-than-fast tempos and with a good deal of space in the soloing. Jim Hall and Wes are my favorite guitarists. Jim for medium tempo material and ballads (I don't like his fast stuff as much). Wes doesn't sound so fast (until you try to play his stuff) - maybe he's so melodic that things seem slower. Originally Posted by raylinds
At jam sessions, I like hearing other guitarists burn and I wish I could do it, but I don't hear the music that way so I never developed the chops.
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