ii-V-I 1/2 step displacement

[joe2758]

Freudian side slip

oof

[grahambop]

I recently analysed a Michael Brecker solo to find out how he did all those cool ‘outside’ sounding lines. The lines sounded so varied that I was expecting to find all sorts of clever substitutions and magic formulas. But in fact most of them turned out to be essentially based on playing a half-step above the chord.

What made them work so well was the way he could go ‘outside’ and come back again so seamlessly, i.e. no interruption to the melodic flow of ideas.

[pauln]

Thanks all for the smiles. My morning is complete;
now I may proceed with yard work before it rains.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

FWIW, Wes loved this and used it frequenrtly. His classic ending to Gone With The Wind (on The Incrdible Jazz Guitar of WM) is a truly beautiful encapsulation of the concept in the last 4 bars. It works well both against the 2-5 and with 3b-6b resolving to 2-5.

[ragman1]

FWIW, Wes loved this and used it frequenrtly. His classic ending to Gone With The Wind (on The Incrdible Jazz Guitar of WM) is a truly beautiful encapsulation of the concept in the last 4 bars. It works well both against the 2-5 and with 3b-6b resolving to 2-5.

Do you mean this?


It comes from this but it doesn't sound much like Jack's 251 displacement.

[grahambop]

There is a chord substitution of a half-step up (F#m and B7 instead of Fm and Bb7) all the way through the Wes version. First occurrence is at bar 30 of the youtube transcription you posted.

[ragman1]

So there is. I thought for a moment Jack's idea was to play Bbm-Eb7 over the Am7-D7 which doesn't sound that good. At least, that's what his clip showed. But Wes' one is the two bars before. Different kettle of stuff. Thanks.

[joe2758]

So there is. I thought for a moment Jack's idea was to play Bbm-Eb7 over the Am7-D7 which doesn't sound that good. At least, that's what his clip showed. But Wes' one is the two bars before. Different kettle of stuff. Thanks.

no you were right. I'm sure you already know you can get an "alt" sound by playing minor a half step up from the dominant, right?

So he is saying that it's like a IIalt-Valt- I

edit: notice how the chord a half step above the dominant is also minor

[ragman1]

So he is saying that it's like a IIalt

I know. Bbm over Am? Not for me.

There are things to do with a ii but I won't bore you. Unless you ask me to :-)

[joe2758]

ok, you just sounded unsure what the initial thread topic was..so that's what it is and it is what it is

[mr. beaumont]

If I could banish one phrase entirely from the English language it would be "no pun intended".

Just understand my puns are ALWAYS intended.

[ragman1]

They don't quite know where the word pun comes from but it might be Italian, which I think makes perfect sense

[grahambop]

Wes Montgomery used that ‘half-step up’ chord approach in some of his own tunes, e.g. West Coast Blues and the bridge of Jingles. Also he can be seen discussing it with the trio in that rehearsal video in Holland (he inserts the chords into the tune End of a Love Affair, as I recall).

[AllanAllen]

Thanks for posting this Jack, always good to see you around the forum.

[John A.]

Just understand my puns are ALWAYS intended.

I like the cut of your jib, Mr. Beaumont.

[pamosmusic]

So there is. I thought for a moment Jack's idea was to play Bbm-Eb7 over the Am7-D7 which doesn't sound that good. At least, that's what his clip showed. But Wes' one is the two bars before. Different kettle of stuff. Thanks.

I think it’s that when Wes (and a lot of the hard bop guys) do this sort of thing, the whole band plays the reharmonization. So it sounds angular and weird but not dissonant in the same way.