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Originally Posted by jzucker
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05-01-2011 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Flyin' Brian
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Originally Posted by jzucker
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Originally Posted by schmoe
Instead, I found myself opinining about the right hand studies I was doing a while ago. Since I've found that technique creeping back into my right hand action lately, I figured I might as well offer an update. Well, I guess I just did.
That is, I practiced the Renard Hoover technique hard for a while, but I never felt I was getting it. But then, lo, a year or so later, I was trying to learn a little Steve Lukather ouburst of shredage, and decided to see what it felt like to lift my right hand completely off the axe, something I was never really comfortable doing before. But this time it was quite natural, and I found I could invoke what little I understood of the Hoover technique at will.
I also read Tuck Andress' exhaustive commentary on the subject, and decided to give the method he attributes to George Benson a try, and was able to make that work, too, although I'm not entirely sold on it.
So what's cool is that if you practice this stuff, you can actually do it eventually. Way cool.
But I'm still trying to find that happy spot, that zone, where I KNOW all is sweetness and light and I can let 'er rip.
Rock on!
~schmoe.Last edited by schmoe; 10-15-2012 at 07:29 PM.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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Originally Posted by MatsP
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Originally Posted by MatsP
Here's Herb with Duke Robillard playing "Stuffy". (Interesting to compare with Herb's duet with Joe Pass on the same tune.)
~https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-jyQEmPjEw
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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Originally Posted by MatsP
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Originally Posted by MatsP
Yes, picking every note can sound mechanical ---though it doesn't sound that way when playing a melody!---but it can also allow you to play faster. Lots of horn-like trills sound better if not picked.
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Originally Posted by MatsP
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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Originally Posted by MatsP
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I think the original Nick Lucas pamphlets back in the 20's advocated "no angle" picking....not saying it is good or bad, just that it is not a new idea.
Let me throw out another notion, based on sports movement. In sports, fluidity requires the ability to almost change motions without being "off kilter"...look at a really good broken field runner in football---the essence of a great "juke" is getting the tackler to commit in one direction, then to cut back the other way.
In basketball, great shooters, e.g. Ray Allen, would run their patterns to get open, and receive the ball off the pass...with knees bent and be able to go up quickly in one motion. Watch junior HS or HS basketball players, 98% of them will receive a pass, then sink down to "compress" and then jump up....slow, wasted motion that allows the defender to catch up and get onto them.
So, what I'm saying is ....whatever picking motion or technique we use, maybe it would behoove us to think about the "next motion" to allow us to finish a phrase...or flow into another one...or play against the beat...Wayne Gretzky used to say hockey to him was all angles...and the ability to think 3 passes ahead...and he was probably the best ever...I think great virtuoso instrumentalists have this same sense of "seeing ahead" , so to speak.
Exactly how to do that...I guess is up to the individual, and we know there is more than one way to skin a cat..
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Originally Posted by goldenwave77
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[QUOTE=MatsP;561847] Regardless of that, in jazz, I think it's important to have a clearly defined attack.[/QUOTE]
+1 on this. When I took some lessons with Peter Mazza, maybe 15 yrs. ago., we talked about bebop one time, and he was of the opinion that the biggest departure in bebop was in rhythmic phrasing. He noted that the other stuff, had been used in classical stuff in one form or another (there are 12 tones, only, after all). Peter is a player with very advanced harmonic understanding, as anyone who's ever looked at his chord melody stuff can tell you.
In any event, playing "Oleo" or "Billie's Bounce" well, for e.g., it seems to me, is first and foremost getting the attack, the groove right. The ability to do this more easily with a pick, seems to me the chief argument for using one. (Though Joe P. later on started playing more finger style, and does it well, though maybe he does lose a little rhythmic accent.)
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You can get a loud attack with the pick without pinching the pick as hard as possible. The guy I study with says to let the thumb fall into place and to use the weight of the thumb. Too much tension could mess up your forearm in the long run, we wanna play as long as Bucky is doing so, am I right?
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Originally Posted by Irez87
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[QUOTE=goldenwave77;561899]
Originally Posted by MatsP
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For clear and clean, I think of the classical rest stroke for a reference. Full toned, clean, and defined. As balanced as possible with the other notes, and as full as possible, even on the high e. Playing, I try to think of the inherit dynamics of the phrase. But in practice, nice and even.
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Originally Posted by Irez87
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Originally Posted by MatsP
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Sorry Matt, wasn't saying you were. But a lot of guitarists think that you have to squeeze harder to play louder. That only messes them up in the long run. I can't imagine life without playing guitar, so I wanna avoid those types of injuries.
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Originally Posted by Irez87
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Originally Posted by MatsP
Like-New Gibson ES-335's
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