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I'm building an F hole Selmer Maccafieri inspired guitar, I want to mount a pickup in it. For various reasons I don't want to stick anything to the top, I'd like to route a hole in the top for something like a humbucker mount (not necessarily a humbucker mount but something like that).
I think the pickup I'd ideally use would be the DeArmond Rhythm Chief with adjustable pole pieces but the mounting is not what I'm looking for.
Any ideas what an alternative would be? Is there another single coil pickup that would be similar? I want to have adjustable pole pieces.
I have been thinking about a Gibson Classic 57 and a coil split switch for single/double coil.
Kent Armstrong archtop pickups look cool but they are all surface mount I think.
I am open to all suggestions. The neck on my guitar is adjustable (it can tilt forward and backward, so something that's attached to the neck and touching the top isn't ideal. Also my fingerboard is not going to be flat on the end so that also may complicate the Rhythm Chief mounting.
This is the basic design:
Last edited by sully75; 04-09-2023 at 10:03 AM.
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04-09-2023 08:12 AM
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One option to consider is the Kent Armstrong 6 pole single coil hand wound floating pickup
Kent Armstrong Handmade Jazz guitar pickups | sidemount single coil floating style for 6-string archtops | SOUNDISLANDMUSIC.COM
Described as follows …
“a slender single-coil suspended pickup that produces the unique broad-spectrum sound of a vintage single-coil design. Without nearly all the hassles. And with a tap, you can switch between a vintage DeArmond style sound and a P90.”
I’m just having one installed on my vintage Epi archtop, so can’t vouch for it yet, I’m afraid! But I’m hoping it lives up to the promise.
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You could use a KA HW set humbucker with a coil split switch. That’d give you exactly what you want, along with a full HB option.
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That would be exactly what I was looking for but not in a sidemount.
Originally Posted by MrFixie
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Like this one? Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
Kent Armstrong Handwound Series Vintage Humbucker Pickup
I never really understand what's a jazz humbucker and what's a rock humbucker or are they all sort of similar?
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"DeArmond Rhythm King"
Hey, I like that better than the name Dearmond used, Rhythm Chief, but I guess it's too late to change at this point.
Maybe another company had already trademarked it.
Good luck on your project.
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A pickup is a pickup, and a guitar is a guitar. You can play rock, jazz, or whatever on any guitar with any pickup. It's all perfectly legal. Humbuckers were invented to reduce hum and other noise that are common with single coil pickups.
If you don't want to drill any holes, a pickguard mount is the usual solution, and you can get many different pickup types for that. Armstrong, Lollar, Biltoft, and others will make custom setups. Vintage Vibe (Pete Biltoft) has several stock models, and will make pretty much whatever you want. I haven't dealt with the others I mentioned, but they have excellent reputations.
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I prefer and have this one. But as you can see from the linked page, you can get it covered or uncovered in a variety of finishes. Originally Posted by sully75
But it’s not clear why you’d rather set a pickup in the top than use a simple top mount. I’d think the set pickup would affect acoustic tone far more than a thin, light top mount.
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Sorry I should have been more specific, I know what a humbucker is and have wired up a bunch of guitars. It's just confusing because they are genuinely marketed in the language of rock, so I don't really know if I can buy a Seymour Duncan Antiquity or Gibson Classic 57 and expect a decent jazz tone. I assume I can but I'm not sure what the difference is between these supposed copies of original PAF designs and pickups marketed towards jazz players. Originally Posted by sgosnell
And then on top of that, how they might respond to Argentine strings.
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Fixed it!
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That looks really good actually, thanks! Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
I prefer and have this one. But as you can see from the linked page, you can get it covered or uncovered in a variety of finishes.
But it’s not clear why you’d rather set a pickup in the top than use a simple top mount. I’d think the set pickup would affect acoustic tone far more than a thin, light top mount.
Don't want to get too controversial, but there's really not much happening on a guitar acoustically near the end of the fingerboard. There is so much bracing and mass there, and not much driving the top at that point.
On my guitars there's a fairly massive neck block that supports the adjustable neck, and that's next to the transverse brace (which is pretty common on everything but archtops). So putting a hole in the top at that point is not a particular big deal (I don't think). There's not much there to vibrate (and generally in that area there isn't).
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It's your guitar, so do what your want. Perhaps I was influenced by your desire to not use any screws, which will surely be required in the top to hold the pickup ring, which is necessary to hide the hole in the top. A set humbucker does tend to give a different tone, due to the pickup moving ever so slightly with the top, but it's a tone I like a lot. I have a couple of acoustic archtops with Rhythm Chief 1100 pickups, and I couple them to the top using Blu-Tack because I prefer the sound it gives. I thought about having the top routed for a humbucker by the builder, but decided against it. One sounds near perfect as it is, but one might have benefited from a set humbucker. Impossible to say with any confidence, though.
I will say that it's possible to mount a Rhythm Chief or other pickup without any screws at all, using Blu-Tack. Whit Smith used that on one of his Gibsons for a long time, and toured with that setup. He removed the pickup during the covid pandemic, and you could see traces of it still in place. It's possible to get it all off, but I suppose he just didn't want to go to the trouble. Blu-Tack holds securely, and doesn't damage the finish at all IME. Just another thing to consider, do as you wish.
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Recently i received the following answer from Kent Armstrong upon an inquiry i did:
I would try my pick-guard single coil it is very much like a DeArmond 1100.. with a coil tap for extra boost.
Obviously he is in the position to manufacture floaters wich resemble the sound of DeArmonds. I would bet he can also pack it into a regular PU housing. But i do not know how the sound of a 1100 resembles a RhythmChief.
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oh maybe I misspoke. I'm not anti screw. I'm pro screw. Originally Posted by sgosnell
With this guitar I'm HOPING to make a sort of switch hitter in that I could play Django style music with it acoustically and also plug it in and play either electric Django or something approaching an archtop/electric sound. Part of that to me is having a pickup that's solidly in the guitar, no wires coming off the front etc. I totally get that it's a common thing to have floating archtop pickups, and I might end up going that way, but I like the idea of having everything locked down in the guitar.
Thanks for the thoughts, it's very helpful.
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I think the 1100 is a Rhythm Chief. Originally Posted by JazzNote
If he could make that in a humbucker mount, I'd be all over it.
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Humbucker won’t sound anything like a rhythm chief. I’d email Lollar pickups and ask them for an overwound gold foil or a Johnny smith (humbucker but clearer sounding than the other suggestions), you can explain your mounting ideas to them.
I have a soap bar mounted Johnny smith pickup in a tele. Sounds really awesome.
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Is this a genuine JS or a clone built with identical specs? Originally Posted by omphalopsychos
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Have a look at djangobooks.com They carry several different
Types pickups, including ones for Django type guitars.Last edited by DougB; 04-10-2023 at 01:49 AM.
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If you don't want any wires on the front, there are only a few choices. You can use a pickguard mount, with the output jack on the pickguard, you can use a Rhythm Chief or similar, or a Johnny Smith type bracketed to the end of the fretboard, with the wire going into a small hole in the top, or you can do a full set pickup routed into the top. The 3" or so of cable from the end of the Rhythm Chief to the end of the f hole doesn't bother me, but I'm not you. I'm just mentioning possibilities. If you don't mind routing the hole, a humbucker set into the top is a sound I like a lot.
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Macaferri players often use soundhole pickups like the Dupont. If there is space between the end of the neck and the soundhole you could mount a Krivo on the soundboard with putty or double-sided tape. I can’t see installing a routed-in pickup on a lightly built Selmer style guitar.
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The issue with these special Argentine strings will play a big role in the sound since they are made of different materials than the "normal" steels strings used on archtops. etc.
I have a KA singlecoil floater on my 2018 Trenier Jazz Special , wired up to the push/pull volume knob. That switching option gives me a second sound when I pull up on the knob : the sound gets a bit thinner, like a bass cut, quite useful for old-style comping 4 to the bar. That is the tapped output, taken from the coil with a few 1000 less windings. The sound of the un-tapped pickup is full and round, with a nice dose of highs that don't make it hi-fi sounding (which I hate...) so that plugged in it
lets the acoustic properties of the lightly built guitar be heard and felt. I like it regardless of the type of string I use and have no plans of changing it. The hum is absolutely tolerable, has never been an issue.
I had once asked Kent's son Aaron (he lives and works out of Britain) to build me a tapped single coil in a humbucker housing and that was no problem at all - I have not yet put it to use in one of my guitars but will do so soon - tone report will follow.
Speaking of the DeArmond pickups : as with all hand-wound pickups of yesteryear : there can be considerable differences in windings between two pickups from the same batch, resulting in one pickup being extra bold and the other a bit weak sounding. At one time the DeArmond family had their young sons sitting at the winding machines ....
Ever since Larry DiMarzio and Seymour Duncan (and Bill Lawrence) started the custom-pickup buisiness some 50 years ago (!!!) the marketing lingo has totally confused everybody - there is no consensus re the def. connotation of the various adjectives used in describing the different tonal properties of pickups (and guitar speakers, same story) - I at least am non the wiser after all these years. When talking to the maker(s) I can describe what I want but the marketing talk (and the raving reports on the familiar forums) have never helped me much in finding what I wanted. How come a set of simple Tele pickups from the currently most-talked-about winder can cost $ 750.00 while a VERY similar set from one of the bigger companies costs 2/3rds less ? These things are not made out of un-obtanium ....
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My experience is that a pickup balanced for bronze strings also does ok for Argentines; the Krivo micro Manouche for example.
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If Krivo made a pickup in a humbucker mount with a humbucker look, I'd use that. I don't really like the look of their pickups and I'm trying to make a really beautiful guitar. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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that wasn’t really what I meant Originally Posted by sully75
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OK sorry I didn't get get it. I have an older Krivo that's fine but in this particular guitar I don't really want a surface mount pickup. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
It's probably kind of a limited knowledge zone because there aren't a ton of selmac guitars with router pickups. I know Shelly Park made one with a Charlie Christian but that was sort of a slim line.
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On smaller speakers...
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