Starting from Scratch (again) with One Archtop

[Nick71]

Spain & Guitars
All I can say is, Do it!!!

I’m heading to Spain in a couple of days, and I know I’ll be tempted to bring home another fine flamenco or classical if one speaks to me. If not, I may commission another build in the future.

[Mark M.]

Here’s my current fantasy guitar. I’m sure the price is way out of my league. But, I’m fascinated by what a redwood/rosewood flamenco might sound like. I may ask my friend who is a recognized builder in Granada to make one for me.

Just a moment...

[whiskey02]

Rosebud.

Paging Doctor Freud:

Freudian psychologists believe that collecting is a way of imposing order on the world. Those who collect may have suffered abandonment issues when they were children, or feel that they lack control over their own lives. By gathering and curating objects, they can reverse that feeling somewhat. In particular, those with few mementos of their childhood might compensate by holding on to anything they can. At this point, the line between collecting and hoarding becomes blurred. While many might describe the former as an addiction, it is nonetheless something done willingly. Collectors have control over their behaviour, whereas hoarders do not. Their actions may be due to OCD or anxiety disorders.

[John A.]

Paging Doctor Freud:

Freudian psychologists believe that collecting is a way of imposing order on the world. Those who collect may have suffered abandonment issues when they were children, or feel that they lack control over their own lives. By gathering and curating objects, they can reverse that feeling somewhat. In particular, those with few mementos of their childhood might compensate by holding on to anything they can. At this point, the line between collecting and hoarding becomes blurred. While many might describe the former as an addiction, it is nonetheless something done willingly. Collectors have control over their behaviour, whereas hoarders do not. Their actions may be due to OCD or anxiety disorders.

I don't think the good doctor was entirely right about that. There's a difference between owning/being interested in items for personal or psychological reasons (healthy or otherwise) and collecting. Collecting is a form of social interaction. It's mainly about membership and status in a group or society the collector regards as special. What one specifically collects may be connected to other things (even OCD), but the chief attraction of collecting (as opposed to just owning items that one might appreciate out of utility, beauty, interest, nostalgia, personal connection, to fill a void, etc.,) is participation in a society, sharing knowledge and interest, and acquiring status in the society.

To illustrate, I have a fair amount of artwork, acquired more or less at random by wandering through life. But I'm not an art collector. I have very little of my own psychology invested in it, I don't post to art forums on the web, I don't go looking for pieces that fit the rest of my stuff, I bring no sense of purpose to it. I just have a bunch of paintings, prints, drawings, sculpture, tchotchkes, etc. -- some that I bought, some that were gifts, some that I inherited etc. I have many fewer guitars than this, not even a collection really, just a small number that more or less corresponds to what I can practically use and fit in my apartment. But I'm a collector nonetheless -- I post to forums, buy/sell to fit my ideas of coolness, completion, or complement (even if I keep the total number low), revel in the swapping of guitar stories, and generally broadcast my fascination with guitars in a way I don't with any of my other stuff.

Exactly how one goes about collecting might be shaped by OCD or other psychological factors, and certainly there are collectors who are also hoarders, but collecting is mainly about sharing stories about special objects with a special group of people.

[None of this is original thought; this is something I got from a friend who is a prominent collector of something very different from guitars. FWIW, he also happens to be a hoarder, but not of the things he collects. His residence is a disaster. His collection is in bank vaults and on display in museums and galleries, where other collectors can admire it and see his name. Anyway, it's an insight I've seen confirmed in various domains I've been involved in that have a collecting dimension. ]

[John A.]

Yes, but my initial question about was not about hoarding or collecting--the Benedetto thread hits on that theme--although I did question the 77 guitar collection. I think it gets to Vinny's comment above about chasing elusive tone in Archtops over many years, maybe most of one's life. It's harder and probably more expensive to attain with Archtops, compared to other guitars. And when we're chasing after tone in our heads, we're not really collecting things.

My archtop story boils down to figuring out whether I really want one and then finding one I really want. I started out with a cheap one as an experiment. Some years later decided that a semi-hollow could do the work of both an archtop and Les Paul type guitar and so sold both of those and and bought a semi (in the opposite order). Some years later, I decided that I might want an archtop after all and bought another cheap one. Enjoyed that, but decided that I did genuinely want an archtop, and therefore wanted a better quality one spec'd more to my needs and tastes. Found that, and am done.

[Litterick]

I don't think the good doctor was entirely right about that. There's a difference between owning/being interested in items for personal or psychological reasons (healthy or otherwise) and collecting. Collecting is a form of social interaction. It's mainly about membership and status in a group or society the collector regards as special.

I think you are right. Doctor Freud's weaknesses were seeing everything as a problem and thinking of everyone as an isolated individual. People came to him as patients, alone with something wrong. He did not observe communities. Your contrary insights, and your friend's, are valuable.

[Skip Ellis]

I've ben playing Teles so long (right at 50 years) that I have a problem playing anything else but would love to have an archtop. Problem is, I can't seem to find one that I enjoy playing - been through a bunch: Peerless Monarch (?), & Leela, Gibson ES-165, and some I've forgotten - and that's in the past few years. Historically, I've owned a museum grade 1947 Super 400, a ratty 60's Super 400, an ES-5, a 1956 ES-175, a 60's L4C, a Johnny Smith, a couple of Fender D'Aquistos and probably a few others that I've forgotten. It seems that I had to be heavy handed to get anything out of them - there was no response to speak of; I had to fight to get any tone. I also had a beautiful ice tea orange label 335, an Ibanez As153, and now an Eastman T486B (for sale..too heavy); they didn't work either. Now, I'm getting ready to, probably, pull the trigger on an Eastman T146 - I'll try one more time and if it doesn't work, I'll just stick to the Teles. It just seems funny, but, if I go to play a solo GAS gig at the local assisted living, I think they would look on me more as a serious guitarist if I had something that looked more like a jazz guitar than a plank of wood. Probably all in my imagination, though.

[Spook410]

I probably have so many because selling them is such a PITA while buying is pretty easy.

[Sleeko]

You'll be dead for a long time. Buy what you want.

[DawgBone]

I only keep what has utility to me. More than a main player and one or two backups is excess baggage since I don't like having a lot of "stuff". The money takes up less room than the guitar or other collectible. I have a couple other valuable items that were gifted to me but they just dust collect because it's not something I use. I dislike sentimentality but am forced into it cause it was grandpas, uncles etc etc.

I don't even really have an actual backup guitar right now cause I just don't really give a damn anymore about guitar stuff. I got a semi for gigs and an archtop with limited upper fret access so no go for regular gigs for me using that. I could borrow a guitar if needed. I have nice usable stuff so I will just wear it out before justifying next instrument. In a business situation it's just money out the door. I guess I only see collecting in the light of for-profit otherwise to me it's just a burden. If I live cheap I can do more what I want and that is worth more to me than one hundred wonderful instruments. I don't even have a closet in this house to put them in anyways.

[Spook410]

<snip> I guess I only see collecting in the light of for-profit otherwise to me it's just a burden.

'Collecting' implies a degree of forethought I'm not really applying in the acquisition of shiny objects like nice guitars. Though I will occasional throw a shallow rationale at one.

Whatever makes you happy is OK as long as you can afford it and it doesn't bring suffering to others.

[Stringswinger]

I only keep what has utility to me. More than a main player and one or two backups is excess baggage since I don't like having a lot of "stuff". The money takes up less room than the guitar or other collectible. I have a couple other valuable items that were gifted to me but they just dust collect because it's not something I use. I dislike sentimentality but am forced into it cause it was grandpas, uncles etc etc.

I don't even really have an actual backup guitar right now cause I just don't really give a damn anymore about guitar stuff. I got a semi for gigs and an archtop with limited upper fret access so no go for regular gigs for me using that. I could borrow a guitar if needed. I have nice usable stuff so I will just wear it out before justifying next instrument. In a business situation it's just money out the door. I guess I only see collecting in the light of for-profit otherwise to me it's just a burden. If I live cheap I can do more what I want and that is worth more to me than one hundred wonderful instruments. I don't even have a closet in this house to put them in anyways.