Affordable acoustic archtop for a beginner

[spiro2903]

No I don't think I will be shaving the neck down. I do like a bit thickness, but it's not like all my electrics have the same neck, and you get used to it as long as it's not anything extreme.
I did some reading on the flatwounds and general consensus is that they are not ideal for an acoustic guitar, more for an electric (or at least one with pickups). And the sound is usually quieter and duller(?).
Anyway as it is an acoustic it makes sense to use acoustic strings. I'll leave these on for the time being and then see which ones to get.
BTW the action on mine is quite low as well (around 2mm) I'll probably raise that to 3 as I tend to dig in a bit more and play with heavier picks (Vpicks and Gravity picks).

[jim232777]

I used flatwounds on my Kingpin II, but when I bought the acoustic 5th Avenue (arguably would be similar sounding due to materials/construction) I had some phosphors on hand and put those on. I would say Christian's description of the differences is accurate.

But on the string topic, and purely subjective, it seems to me the string noise is more noticeable than on my flat top. Has anyone noticed this, and perhaps tried the D'Addario Flat Tops Phosphor Bronze? The web description says "eliminates fingers noise, while still maintaining the attractive string tone, though slightly dampened."

[RJVB]

But on the string topic, and purely subjective, it seems to me the string noise is more noticeable than on my flat top. Has anyone noticed this, and perhaps tried the D'Addario Flat Tops Phosphor Bronze?

No. On the contrary, I have the impression that my flattop picks up small sounds better than my archtop. I haven't tried PB flat-wounds, I'm not overly appreciative of the more muted sound of the brass flat-wounds in the Spectrum sets. I'm in the process of ordering some polished strings from Pyramid though, those should be much closer in sound character than flat-wounds.

[jim232777]

No. On the contrary, I have the impression that my flattop picks up small sounds better than my archtop. I haven't tried PB flat-wounds, I'm not overly appreciative of the more muted sound of the brass flat-wounds in the Spectrum sets. I'm in the process of ordering some polished strings from Pyramid though, those should be much closer in sound character than flat-wounds.

Thanks. I need to put some fresh strings on the flattop and do an A-B comparison--make it a little less (albeit still) subjective.

[Evan Bloom]

I know I'm a little late to the party, but I've been down this road for a couple of years and (think) I've run it down, so I'd like to add my thoughts to the conversation. I've been a pro (rock/pop mostly) player since my mid 20s, but I've had the swing bug for several years and have been chasing a good early jazz guitar without breaking the bank since it's the hobby side of my playing. I worked in instrument retail for a roughly decade, and was a repair wrench for about 6 years, so I've had the oppurtunity to play just about everything, including some really great vintage pieces.

The short version is this: if you want a solid carved top acoustic archtop, the Loar LH600 and 700 are the only viable options under $1500, short of winning the lottery on a used piece. There's nothing else on the market, unfortunately (unless the Aliexpress guitars are real...I've never seen one in person)

I finally caved and got an LH-700 this week (Got a great deal on a B stock with negligible cosmetic issues). It's fantastic, and really does the thing. I have a Godin non cutaway Kingpin on loan from a friend with an incredible hollowbody electric collection, and while it's a great guitar on its own merits (especially for the price), it is *not* an acoustic instrument. I've had an Ibanez AFJ-91 for 4 years because it was the closest thing I could find at the time, set up tall with monels, and it is a better acoustic guitar than the Godin. Neither of them hold a candle to the Loar as an acoustic guitar, they're just a different species.

I may keep the Godin, it's a reasonable stand in for an ES-150 and it's really tough to find a non cutaway electric. I may have a CC wound up in a P-90 case for it, but even with the current P-90 it's a good jump blues guitar, and certainly way better for what I'm trying to play than a humbucker jazzbox.

You might try to find a small bodied parlor guitar, too. It won't have the bass and boominess of a larger acoustic, and is reasonable for early jazz (Nick Lucas, etc). The Gretsch may work for you. I suspect it would sound better than the Godins acoustically, but still nowhere near a real carved top. One thing I rarely see mentioned are the Epiphone reissues from a few years back. They can be tough to track down, but might be another option. I played a round hole Deluxe recently, and it was decent. Not quite the real thing, but different than a flat top acoustic, for sure. They are also pressed solid tops.

Be warned, the Loar neck is big, wide, and a pronounced V profile. You'll either love it or hate it. I think it's appropriate for this style, and I like guitars with personalities that push me in different directions.

To throw my 2 cents in on the lav mic sidebar:

I use an Audio Technica AT831, both with the clip on the soundhole for my Selmer copy, and with the little gooseneck mount off of hardware for banjo, fiddle, and resonator. I definitely have more feedback issues with the soundhole clip. If you think about it, the gooseneck points the mic at the sound source much more directly, and puts the rejection pattern in a better spot as well. The manouche guys usually aren't fighting horn and rhythmn sections, either, so that probably has something to do with it, too. As Jonathan pointed out, monitor position in relation to the mic is critical, but definitely doable even on club gigs if you plan for it. I'm usually running IEMs on loud gigs, so it's even less of an issue for me.

[RJVB]

Be warned, the Loar neck is big, wide, and a pronounced V profile. You'll either love it or hate it.

The answer to that would be a Loar LH650. Or even an LH350, which is the budget version with lam. B&S (but still a carved top). I'd definitely want to try that model before buying, but (theoretically) they can sound almost as good as the solid-woods models.