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Hi all,
I've been in possession of this pedal for about two years now but have decided to part ways with it just because I don't use it much and I need the money right now. Before it goes I wanted to share a video with my thoughts on using it in settings where you're playing with a heavily overdriven sound but still need to keep dense chords understandable.
As a jazz/fusion guitarist, a problem for me was finding a way to play both lead and rhythm with the same drive pedal. With most pedals at higher gain, tightly voiced chords become way too ugly to use and you're often limited to only playing two or three notes over the course of two octaves. I've found that with the special ratio knob on the J Rockett The Dude pedal, you can comp similarly to how you would without drive and get good results.
The key here is that instead of a knob controlling the amount of overdrive, the "ratio" is actually controlling the blend between your clean and overdriven sound. There's a bit more to it than that but I'll save that for the video above.
Anyway, feel free to share your thoughts on the subject and your own favorite gear for playing complicated chords with overdrive. Hope someone finds this useful!
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07-30-2019 04:17 PM
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Tube Screamer actually retains Clean along with the OD sound. For me the One Control version works best.
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i prefer the jrockett blue note. I like it better than "the dude" for chords and it has a more natural overdrive plus, it doesn't sound quite so much like "talk your daughter daughter" which is so overdone.
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I like the ProCo Ltd. Ed. White Face Rat pedal for fusion. Sounds great with chords if adjusted properly. Just dial the amount of Distortion you want for your solos, then roll back the guitar volume a bit for chords.
ProCo Limited Edition ’85 Whiteface RAT Pedal Review
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What do you mean by one control version? I haven't heard of that
Originally Posted by jads57
Tube Screamer actually retains Clean along with the OD sound. For me the One Control version works best.
I think that's the first I've heard of someone using a Rat for jazz haha. You have any playing samples? Originally Posted by Gitfiddler
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One Control pedals makes the "Persian Green Screamer" pedal. It's a mini modified Tube Screamer designed by Bjorn Jule of Mad Professor fame
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One Control is a pedal company. Originally Posted by McJazzer
Sco has used the Rat for decades!! Grab any of his albums, and you'll hear the Rat!
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I’m not trying to keep up with everyone’s gear, but Kurt Rosenwinkel played one for years. Possibly still does. Originally Posted by McJazzer
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Yeah, Kurt used one for decades-
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Nice playing McJazzer, nice sound too.
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Amazing haha. Admittedly I don't really keep up with what others are using aside from a few of my favorite players. I just know what I like.
Marcwhy - I'll check it out!
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I don’t play fusion but I love Blue Note too. Originally Posted by jzucker
Sorry Jack, but what does mean ”(...) it doesn't sound quite so much like "talk your daughter daughter”(...)”? I am not a born english speaker and I have never seen this expression. Seems amusing!
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"Talk to your daughter" is a song made famous by Robben Ford - Herie is (I think) referring to Robben's guitar sound on this song. Originally Posted by Herbie
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Talk to your daughter is the quintessential dumble amp tone that robben made famous with this track. IMO, this album started the whole dumble sound lust that occupied the gearpage for almost 10 years. I'm not kidding either. an entire cottage industry of "talk to your daughter" inspired amps, pedals and guitars was created and fueled a huge part of that forum's content. Originally Posted by Herbie
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Oh man, this is interesting, thanks! Originally Posted by jzucker
I did not know this background. I just thought it is some kinda idiom.
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Wait, there's a pedal that makes you sound like this? Gimme one! Originally Posted by jzucker
John
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The interesting part is that it's become an idiom though I think only a handful of guys refer to it as the 'talk to your daughter' tone. Must folks just refer to it as dumble tone. (howard dumble amplifiers and inspired by dumble pedals) Originally Posted by Herbie
The dumble amps go for as much as $80,000! It's not unusual to see them being bought and sold in the $20,000 range.
Interestingly enough, robben ford often uses a zendrive or vertex ultra phonix drive with a rented twin these days.
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Man, the Vertex gear is addicting. I picked up the Steel String recently and it's a game changer. They're offering the T Drive for $100 right now and I'm on the fence.
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I think of the "Dumble tone" more as the live tone RF, Carlton, and also guys like Sonny Landreth, even Lowell George get/got. It's less processed sounding than RF's Talk to Your Daughter tone; the Blue Line records come much closer (and IMO sound better). That sound comes, at least in part, from playing loud (RF was crazy loud live in the Blue Line days). Originally Posted by jzucker
John
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The talk to your daughter tone is specifically what the dumble tone fad is all about and the entire dumble market is pretty much a result of that tone and that album. Here's a link with specific info about the amp used on that album. Originally Posted by John A.
Did Robin Ford use a Dumble on the "Talk to Your Daughter" album? | The Gear Page
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Well I actually owned a Dumble OD Special back in 1980. Of course they were a mere $ 1400 back then. A lot of $ but nothing like recent pricing.
They had a Clean Scream as my friend would say. The overdrive had way less harshness to its tone than say an equal Mesa Boogie amp of that era.
They were also quite Mid heavy overall. Nice amp.but no reverb or effects loop. I use to use a EV 12L and finally ran in stereo with Yamaha G100 2x10" Combo.
Nowadays with the various OD pedals and platform amps,you can get quite a bit closer to these Dumble OD type of sounds.
You can also buy Dumble Clone amps used in the $1k to $5k range used.
Ceriatone, Bludotone, etc. These are based on the same circuits just not tweaked by Howard himself.
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I'm not questioning what equipment he used on that or any other record; I'm just saying that in my actual in-person experience of people playing through Dumbles, they sound somewhat different from that record, and RF's later records are a better representation of that. What people think on TGP (something I never read unless a link takes me there) has never crossed my mind. Originally Posted by jzucker
John
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And I just disagree and so does an entire industry of "talk to your daughter" inspired gear. That album literally created the entire cottage dumble industry of which thegearpage.net was the key market influencer. People don't realize how many gear trends were attributable to the gearpage's influence. Originally Posted by John A.
And I disagree with the assertion that they sound different from that record. I have played through several real dumbles and owned close to a dozen clones based on the amp he used on that record as well as the various dumble pedals, zendrive, ethos, simbal, yada-yada, and they are *ALL* in the ballpark of that "talk to your daughter tone".
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Speaking of the Blue Note ... I've been curious about that pedal. Looking for something capable of subtle drive, after clean boost. Seeing as I had picked up Jack's Vertex boost awhile ago and love it for modest clean boost, figured maybe I should try another of his recommendations.
So I just picked up a used Blue Note, little used. Looks new. Sure enough, it has exactly what I was looking for - the option to get a little denser, more sustainy kind of edge sound without overdoing it. Without too much compression and gain. What works best so far is the switch set down (hot is up), with gain up fairly high, at 3 oclock, volume at 9 oclock. Tone and Fat knobs at about 1 oclock.
Excellent pedal. With as much bass or as little as you might want via that Fat knob. Thanks again Jack.
MD
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Jack Z the Dumble OD Special 50 wich I owned back in 1980 or so. Was a an earlier a somewhat different circuit than the later versions. They did not have the Ratio control for example,as well as probably different internal values.
They had somewhat a similar tonality,but an example of these is better illustrate by Lowell George or David Lindley with Jackson Brown.
So I can see John A. point of live tones being different.
The Ceriatone as well as other copied Dumbles are usually the later designs used by Larry Carlton and Robben Ford. I believe the circuits and blueprints were available on Amp Garage.
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Chunking, does it work for Jazz improv?
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