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Okay, non-jazz content, but I know some of you will find it interesting.
Four days ago I got a phone call from a man saying the local guitar store had given him my name, that he had an interesting guitar, and that he would like me to see it. "Okay, bring it round". I didn't expect much, as this had happened a few times in the past, and it was an education to me to realise that most people think antique = the 1960s. This time was different.
Iain Adam presented me with a guitar from 1870s Madrid, with a label carrying quite a bit of interesting information. The instrument was made by "Antonio Carlos Garcia, Fabrica de Guitarras y Mandolinas, Madrid"; that he had won gold medals is all expositions; and that the instrument was made for the Alban Voigt company of London. I quickly discovered that said Alban Voigt was an importer of all sorts of musical instruments, with offices at 14 Edmund Place, Aldersgate Street, London (near the Barbican).
The guitar model was called, "La Madrileña", which I assume means a girl or woman from Madrid.
Iain said the guitar came down through his grandmother, who possibly played it, to his mother, who certainly didn't, to himself, who used to "bash around on it" when he was a kid. There is evidence that the latter is true:
Apart from the faded bling, the first thing I noticed was that it had its original tornavoz intact:
The tornavoz is a brass cone attached to the edge of the sound hole, reaching deep within the instrument, almost touching the back. Its purpose seems to have been to lower the cavity resonance of the instrument, in other words giving a very warm bass, and consequently a mellow tone. The great luthier, Antonio de Torres of Almeria, used such things in most of his instruments, including the two he made for Francisco Tárrega.
I played a few few pieces by Tárrega on it, and was pleased to hear a beautifully romantic sound, clearly aged, yet still sounding quite strong. The neck is true - it is not bent or warped, so playing in tune is possible without surgery to the instrument. And the original tuners work perfectly. The bridge looks original, yet had clearly been moved. Iain informed me that local violin maker, Brian Rattray, had shifted the bridge to correct the intonation, some time in the 1970s. Well, it plays in tune very well.
It has some features of the Valencian school, and might possibly have been made there for a Madrid-based exporter. If so, did Antonio Carlos Garcia really make it, or did he even exist at all, with a Spanish name being used for the British market? More research is required.
At this point I was feeling two things: that I wanted the instrument, and that I probably couldn't afford it. I asked Iain how much he wanted, and he said that he wanted it to go to someone who knew how to play it properly, and offered it to me for a mere £400. Deal! And thanks.
I have since found that prices vary widely and wildly for these instruments, from around £400 up to over £2,000. No one seems to know what to charge for them. They are not top-level instruments, such as those by Torres, Manuel Ramirez, etc., but they have excellent timbers - a solid good-quality Brazilian rosewood back, for instance, and a good (German?) spruce sound board. The inlay is a little rough overall, and the bling is not to my taste, though thankfully time has been kind to it, fading the excess to a golden memory of a past age.
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02-25-2019 07:37 PM
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what a story & what a fantastic piece to have in your hands...may it continue to inspire you....lovely playing
hopefully new strings and continued use will work out any intonation problems...guitars need to vibrate to come alive...years under the bed isn't good!! hah
congrats & enjoy rob
cheers
ps- tuning buttons have to be ivory!
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Well done to all involved!! I have a feeling this guitar found you , as the right person for it to be with at this time of its life
)
Will
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Rob, thank you for sharing your story. Very interesting indeed. You did buy it? It's probably worth 400 as wall art
Or As historical artifact. If you went to a jam session with it, you'd be the only one in the room with an instrument like that!
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And to think... that guitar had to wait all those years to finally meet Rob MacKillop! Lucky lumber!
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Wow Rob,
Speechless here.
Shit.
I mean really wow.
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That back! Haaaah! That sound!
How long is the string length?
Is that antique pitch? Did you tune down out of caution?
Lucky person. Wonderful tale. Play more!
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Rob,
Great story and a fantastic sounding guitar. I just love the low frequency timbre imparted by the Tornavoz. Your playing of the Llobet composition was excellent.....thanks for sharing. If you ever get tired of it - let me know .
Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk
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Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
Okay, non-jazz content, but I know some of you will find it interesting.
Four days ago I got a phone call from a man saying the local guitar store had given him my name, that he had an interesting guitar, and that he would like me to see it. "Okay, bring it round". I didn't expect much, as this had happened a few times in the past, and it was an education to me to realise that most people think antique = the 1960s. This time was different.
Iain Adam presented me with a guitar from 1870s Madrid, with a label carrying quite a bit of interesting information. The instrument was made by "Antonio Carlos Garcia, Fabrica de Guitarras y Mandolinas, Madrid"; that he had won gold medals is all expositions; and that the instrument was made for the Alban Voigt company of London. I quickly discovered that said Alban Voigt was an importer of all sorts of musical instruments, with offices at 14 Edmund Place, Aldersgate Street, London (near the Barbican).
The guitar model was called, "La Madrileña", which I assume means a girl or woman from Madrid.
Iain said the guitar came down through his grandmother, who possibly played it, to his mother, who certainly didn't, to himself, who used to "bash around on it" when he was a kid. There is evidence that the latter is true:
Apart from the faded bling, the first thing I noticed was that it had its original tornavoz intact:
The tornavoz is a brass cone attached to the edge of the sound hole, reaching deep within the instrument, almost touching the back. Its purpose seems to have been to lower the cavity resonance of the instrument, in other words giving a very warm bass, and consequently a mellow tone. The great luthier, Antonio de Torres of Almeria, used such things in most of his instruments, including the two he made for Francisco Tárrega.
I played a few few pieces by Tárrega on it, and was pleased to hear a beautifully romantic sound, clearly aged, yet still sounding quite strong. The neck is true - it is not bent or warped, so playing in tune is possible without surgery to the instrument. And the original tuners work perfectly. The bridge looks original, yet had clearly been moved. Iain informed me that local violin maker, Brian Rattray, had shifted the bridge to correct the intonation, some time in the 1970s. Well, it plays in tune very well.
It has some features of the Valencian school, and might possibly have been made there for a Madrid-based exporter. If so, did Antonio Carlos Garcia really make it, or did he even exist at all, with a Spanish name being used for the British market? More research is required.
At this point I was feeling two things: that I wanted the instrument, and that I probably couldn't afford it. I asked Iain how much he wanted, and he said that he wanted it to go to someone who knew how to play it properly, and offered it to me for a mere £400. Deal! And thanks.
I have since found that prices vary widely and wildly for these instruments, from around £400 up to over £2,000. No one seems to know what to charge for them. They are not top-level instruments, such as those by Torres, Manuel Ramirez, etc., but they have excellent timbers - a solid good-quality Brazilian rosewood back, for instance, and a good (German?) spruce sound board. The inlay is a little rough overall, and the bling is not to my taste, though thankfully time has been kind to it, fading the excess to a golden memory of a past age.
wow, what a beautiful instrument. In fact, I think it’s the finest I’ve heard you sound on your videos. The tone on that guitar is just sublime.
what is the scale length? Sorry if I missed it in the vid.
CONGRATS!!!
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A stunning instrument. Congratulations Rob. Your playing complements it naturally.
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Thank you so much for the edification.
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Wow -- that straight-grain Brazilian back! Love it!
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Rob,
That's a heck of a story. And the sound...
Thanks for sharing this with us.
Best to you.
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Wow, guys, thanks for all the great comments. I'll try to answer your questions.
Yes, the buttons are ivory, so I won't being taking it out of the UK. Actually, two or three of the buttons are rattling when I play loudly, so I'll have to get them fixed. I have a luthier friend visiting me on Wednesday, so I'll get his advice on how to go about that.
The string length is 643mm.
The pitch is low for two reasons, one being historical pitch was lower than today, though possibly not quite as low as it is at the present. The second reason is that it arrived with super-high-tension strings on that the guys at the local guitar store put on when the owner sought to restring it before selling. So I immediately lowered the pitch about three-quarters of a tone. I found two used gut strings for the B and G, and have now ordered a set of Gut and Silk strings from Aquila.
The Brazilian rosewood back is of the highest quality. Another luthier friend seriously suggested salvaging it, discarding the rest of the instrument, and allowing him to build a new guitar. As if!
And, yes, I bought it! Not sure how I'll get a Charlie Christian pickup on it, not to mention a whammy bar, but where there's a will there's a way!
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What a find! Congrats!
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Hi Rob!
That instrument has an incredible projection of the sound and an unique evenness of tone and volume between strings and notes, from what can be heard in that video. Truly remarkable. And you know I'm not a fan of old things, mind you.
Well...?
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But you are an old thing yourself...
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I'm young at heart, Rob... that's all that matters! Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
But you are an old thing yourself...
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Indeed.
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One of the coolest threads here in quite some time: great guitar (oh my !!), great playing and wow what a story... Kudos to you Rob...
Big
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Cheers, Big, and not a b5 in sight!
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Great story, great playing and wonderful sound. It's like the past speaking to us in the present.
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Cheers, Jeff. The ghosts in the machine heads...
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Awesome guitar and background, what a full, deep tone! Would love to hear La Catedral on it
My old anonymous piece is not as nice, but interesting nonetheless. When I first got it and reached in to explore the bracing, I discovered a nickel bag taped to the underside of top.
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How strange, the nickel bag. Must have been for tips.
Your guitar looks really nice, Woody. How does it sound?
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