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Billy Bean broke the neck on his guitars more than a couple of times. Apparently he had an L-5 for awhile that got it's neck broken. The whereabouts of that guitar is unknown. Billy had a pretty serious drinking problem. He was accompanying the vocalist Peggy Lee at a concert once and fell out of his chair. She kept on singing while others assisted him. Miraculously, his guitar neck did not break that time.
Billy stated in an interview that the neck on the guitar of his that I recently acquired had the neck replaced.
I thought I had the neck info on Billy Bean's 1964 ES-175 figured out. I was thinking it was an L4C neck that was used by Gibson to do a factory repair. I thought that because it has an ebony fretboard with the split parallelograms. But after obsessing on this some more, it looks like maybe L4C's didn't have ebony fretboards in the 1960's, and furthermore I discovered Billy's guitar's neck is not 24 3/4" scale anymore. So it is neither an ES-175 neck or an L4C neck. This is what I know:
-Handcut logo, placement of crown motif, width of headstock indicate a replacement neck from 1966-68.
-Neck has no stamped or inked numbers from the factory
-Now a 25 1/2" scale instead of 24 3/4" scale
-Ebony fretboard with split parallelograms, no point at end of fretboard
-1 5/8" wide at the nut
-celluloid end cap as on L-5
-neck is bound, headstock is unbound
-single piece mahogany neck
Do you think that this is just a Frankenstein neck the factory came up with? Maybe something special they put together for Billy? Any thoughts?
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11-30-2017 02:29 PM
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A 175 with a 25.5 scale neck, interesting
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That must put the bridge somewhere beyond the f-hole points.
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ES-350 neck? May not have been a current production neck, maybe one sitting in a bin in the backroom.
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Usually the shape pr profile of the neck are a good indication of year it was made. 1950's Fat profile, 1960-62 Thin Wide profile, 1963-65 shallower at first 5 frets and gradually fatter up to 12th fret and above. Late 1966-70 Narrow nut and tapered neck once again.
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L-7 neck?
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L-7 necks are single bound headstock
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How about from an acoustic instrument like a Gibson Dove neck?
25.5 scale and I guess some were one piece mahogany, ebony fingerboard, parallelogram inlays, no headstock binding and a single crown inlay. These mid to late 60's had also a bit narrower necks, so it might match...
Gibson Dove Natural 1969 | Reverb
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Good find! Quite possible and then a celluloid end cap for cosmetic cover up...
Originally Posted by vinlander
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Originally Posted by sgosnell
BB's 1964 ES-175 on left, 1965 donor ES-175 on right.
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Congrats on getting the right Donor for your restoration!
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Thanks! I got lucky. The beauty of it is...1965 being a transitional year, the chrome will still be vintage correct for the '65 after it gives up it's nickel. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
I switched the double ring tuners onto Billy's guitar last night. I will take both guitars to my luthier to have the tailpiece, pickups, and knobs (pots?) switched. I really suck at soldering. Besides, I couldn't deny my luthier the pleasure and story/cred of having worked on Billy Bean's guitar. He loved George Benson's 1998 Mortoro Starling!
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That's going to be a sweet guitar.
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Side by side, the difference in the scale length is apparent. The fretboard goes much further into the body, and the bridge is closer to the tailpiece, as would be expected. Not a huge difference, only ~3/4 inch, but it can be seen.
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Yes. My Painter P-350 has that too. Tom normally built his guitars with 24.75" scale, but I requested 25.5" for mine. As it turned out he used his usual template for the top which placed the F-holes and the holes for the tone and volume control in the "normal" place for the 24.75" scale instrument. There's just about room for the volume control knob beside the bridge base. On the Byrdland and the original ES350T with their 23.5" scale it's the opposite - the bridge is offset towards the neck. Originally Posted by sgosnell
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I like the later Dove neck theory - they could have started with that spec to make that neck (starting with the raw blank, because the dovetail angles are different), but that's NOT a Gibson-made crown inlay. OTOH, any authorized Gibson repair shop would have been able to get or have in stock a Dove fretboard and various Gibson headstock overlays, allowing a neck to be built that was reasonably close. Heck, I have a few Gibson NOS fretboards and headstock overlays around here somewhere. If anyone needs an L-5 fretboard to "restore" their Givson, I have a few...
Last edited by Hammertone; 12-02-2017 at 12:36 AM.
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The crown inlay caught my eye right away - a lot different than others I've seen - bigger and less uniform. So are you suggesting the inlay was done outside of the factory by an authorized Gibson repair shop? I'm sure Billy Bean could have found one in Philadelphia. I suppose all those repairmen are retired or dead by now. Also, the logo has the open "b" and "o" and no dot for the "i". The top of the "s" is obscured or missing. Originally Posted by Hammertone
FWIW, it is also a 14 degree headstock (1966 and newer on a 1964 guitar) and no stamped or inked numbers on back.
Last edited by Easy2grasp; 12-02-2017 at 11:15 AM. Reason: added more neck details
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