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Hi All:
Interesting thing happened during a practice session tonight. Normally, I play my archtop into an Acoustic Image Clarus 4+ and a Buscarino Chameleon cab (8" speaker). I really like that flavor, however, tonight I plugged into my Fender PRRI (upgraded to a 12" Celestion Gold speaker) and noticed quite a warmer/softer edged tone. Any idea how to get that same warmth/softness out of the AI? I do have the Ethos Clean and it does help, but I don't seem to be able to get that same softer edge warm tone. Perhaps my settings are way off. Any suggestions? Thanks!
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12-02-2015 01:33 AM
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Tubes. Come to the Dark Side ….
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It wouldn't be nuts to try out a Joyo American Sound pedal in front of the AI. I've heard great things and the price is right.
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Agree with marcwhy on something tube-y. I'm a firm believer in all things tubed/valved. How about Brad Sarno Black Box to the rescue? Edit: My bad. Brad Sarno, not Bruce Sarno...Aiyaiyai. Sorry, Brad.
Steel Guitar Black Box, Audiophile vacuum tube pickup driver, buffer, impedance matcher l Sarno Music Solutions .Last edited by Jabberwocky; 12-02-2015 at 04:27 AM.
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Yes, Mark is right and you should sell me your AI real cheap and get a Fender DRRI. <grin>
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That black box is interesting, if pricey. Wonder what's inside, and if tubes can be desired.
I'm also suggesting a tube preamp or pedal of some kind. I've used my old tube overdrive set clean to bring some non-suck to my Roland with some success for both archtops and flat top acoustics. Maybe one of the Kingsley products is worth a look.
Eq could help, but I don't think it'll be enough. Maybe a flavored one, the like the barbEQ. I'll experiment with my new eqs and report back.
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That's what I was feeling tonight!
Originally Posted by marcwhy
Tubes. Come to the Dark Side ….
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I'll check it out, thanks. Originally Posted by Silentwiz
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Now this is interesting. Thanks for the direction! Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
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Originally Posted by docbop
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That would be great. Thanks for taking the time to experiment! Originally Posted by feet
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I've owned a couple of Brad Sarno's black boxes, and can attest to their ability to add "tuby-ness" to a solid state sound. He recommends they be the first thing the signal hits prior to any other effects or the amp. I sold mine when I sold off all of my pedal steel guitar stuff a few years ago -- it didn't dawn on me at the time that it might be useful for anything but steel. I believe they contain a single pre-amp tube to warm up the sound. Later versions have what's referred to as a 'variable z' knob, and I would look for one of those -- it functions as a simple tone control, but is very useful for on the fly adjustments.
I'd recommend checking the Steel Guitar Forum classifieds -- folks over there always seem to be buying and selling them at used prices. Brad Sarno is also very helpful if you want to contact him directly with questions. He has a range of products (e.g., Octal pre-amps) that might be interesting in this context.Last edited by bmw2002; 12-02-2015 at 11:28 AM. Reason: syntax issues
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+1 on the Sarno BB for giving some warmth to a SS amp. As BMW states, they come up on the Steel Guitar Forum, or you can join the SGF and post in the "Wanted to Buy" section. It's a fun place.
I gave up several years ago chasing this dilemma. You have two outstanding pieces of amplification gear. My solution was to gig with both a SS and tube amp. It would cost you zero dollars to try this: run the line out of the AI/Buscarino rig into the PRRI. Adjust to taste. Have you tried that?
Yes it means I carry another amp. However it gives me the best of both worlds.
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Some good fender pedal - Barber Barb EQ or Kingsley Squire. Mambo is releasing some new ones soon too.
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Try a different cabinet with a larger speaker. I have never been able to get the warm jazz tone I like out of an 8 inch speaker. Close, but not all there.
Try a RE Stealth 10 or Stealth 12 with your Clarus and you will have all the warmth of that Princeton reissue (and then some)
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I was kind of feeling the same, but I went to a 2x8" and that had the sound and still a compact size. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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I don't think "jazz amp" cabs (ported with bass speakers) will move the OP in the right direction - they're very different from an open back with a jensen speaker cab.
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I think the AI is the problem, not the speaker.
AI's are great amps, but as similar to a Fender as an apple is to a orange. The preamp ideas some suggest can really work.
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I have no experience with the Buscarino cabinet, but my experience with AI into RE cabs has been: great with carved tops especially if with mounted HB's, but too cold with laminates.
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This is exactly what I am thinking. Are you aware if the current quality of the cabinet is the same as built by the founder prior to his passing? I believe the extended range 10 & 12 came out around his passing or after so not sure. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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There are some differences between the Rich Raezer's built cabinets and the new ones built in Wisconsin. I own two of each. The RIch Raezer's built cabs are darker.
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I do have 2 Buscarino cabs so I'll try them as a twin 8 to see how it goes. Thanks for the suggestion! Originally Posted by docbop
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I have a Clarus 2r that I run into a WI Raezer's Edge 12". I have warmed it up by putting an ART tube microphone preamp into the effects loop. That warmth that we are talking about is more than likely the product of harmonic distortion operating at a fairly low and subtle level; the ART adds this. It does not make the amp sound like a Fender Twin but it does warm things up appreciably.
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well, good news and bad news. the good news is that it works. the bad news is that it doesn't work to a great extent. Originally Posted by Eagle2x
i parked a damage control liquid blues and a eqd tone job eq in front of my jc77 and plugged into it with the byrdland (i picked that one because i hate it in the jc77). i also had a 12 tube monster sitting just to it's left to go back and forth. i set the overdrive clean and gave it a little volume and it did add a little warmth and squish. it still felt kind of stiff and direct, but a little better than before. the eq helped tailor a nicer sound but didn't do much to change the qualities of the amp. on its own, once you dial it in, use your amp knobs and get used to the sound, it isn't half bad. it would work. i'd use it in a pinch without much reservation.
when i plugged back into the tubes, the difference was clear. i could call up a similar tone, but the feel and depth were different. its like the notes move around you while the jc77 was like getting hit with a solid block of sounds in the face. the notes are just kind of there, instead of swirling all around. they lack that stereotypical 3rd dimension. again, the tone was still pretty good. i just like tubes more, especially with that guitar. i tend to like acoustics and floaters into the jc77 a lot more than i do other kinds of guitar.
another thing i noticed that kind of helped was rolling off the volume just a little. maybe back to 9 or so, just enough to soften the attack.
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