Boutique Picks: Red Bears vs. V Picks vs. Blue Chips etc.

[bluewaterpig]

I just recently became aware of the high end boutique pick market. I never really knew there was much more than the D'Andreas out there, then I started googling. So far I've tried a V Pick Chicken Picker and both Red Bear Jazzer models and I have to say, I'm blown away by the Red Bears. Finding the right pick is all about finding the one that let's you play whatever you want if you ask me, and the bevel that comes on the Red Bears does that for me extremely well.

I laughed when I first saw that a Red Bear pick was $25. Now I'm laughing at the $50 Blue Chip and I'm sure ill buy one some time soon.

I also just ordered a mini sized ebony pick from Dugain, a well known French pick carver, and I'm waiting on a package from Gravity Picks that was ordered almost two weeks ago.




Id love to hear from anybody else who is familiar with any of the higher end pick brands.

[Spook410]

It's interesting how much difference a pick makes to how your guitar sounds. For me, a single pick doesn't work for everything. I will say that if you like the Red Bear's you might give Pearse Fast Turtle's a try as well.

[M-ster]

If you search this forum, you'll find numerous threads dedicated to pick selection and preferences.

[Carpal55]

I still like the Dunlop Stubby in various thicknesses. I borrowed one of those punches that lets you punch picks out of old credit cards and my son swears by the ones from old Blue Cross IDs. I made a few fiberglass with epoxy resin too but they had a rough string unfriendly finish that required a lot of sanding... Expensive picks to me are like sunglasses; I buy a pair of $100 sunglasses and I lose them in a month. I buy a pair of $13 ones at the gas station and I can't throw them away they just follow me around. No doubt an ebony pick would disappear at the first gig...

[edh]

@Carpal55 LOL...so true with the sunglasses analogy.

[Moonray]

I dig pick threads...it's the one really vital part of the signal chain that I can afford to mess with.

But having tried all manner of bog standard picks to boutique ones, like the ones you mention,
I find that I keep coming back to celluloid, Fender 358's to be precise.

I got into small picks when the Dunlop Jazz 111's came out, but I found the tone too bright
on lighter strung guitars, cool with 15-56 flats, I'm talking clean sound here.

I know that many of the rock shredders like them, Jazz 111's are great for fast playing there's no doubt
[for me anyway]

So I just switched over to the 358's....they're the tiny ones that some people call mandolin picks.
They need to be smoothed on the edge to be quick enough on the release.
I use very fine wet & dry paper for the smoothing, 1200 or 1500 grit.....and old habit I picked up
from my classical guitar days....looking after the nails.

Re bevelling, I tried some JB picks recently, they're made of some high grade celluloid it appears.
I bought a range of picks, some 351 shape, some more like a Golden Gate shape.
The straight ahead picks sounded just fine, but the bevelled ones I didn't dig at all.
The thing is that when you bevel a 1.5 pick it comes out being a lot thinner at the point of contact
with the string.
...Meaning, a thinner sound.....plus you pay a BIG premium for the labor cost of doing the bevelling.

So, I'm easily pleased.....heavy celluloid 358 thanks.......

Good luck to you all in your quest for the right pick for you.

As someone said on a recent string thread, it's like what's your favorite color?

[bluewaterpig]

I also ordered some JB beveled jazz models, I'm excited to try them out.

I swore by Fender 358s for a long time but didn't like the bright tone they produced.

I never really experienced a beveled pick before ordering from Red Bear. That's definitely what opened my eyes to all of this. The bevel really increases my speed and opens up some more possibilities.


Has anybody else tried out gravity picks? I would be careful ordering from them, my order apparently shipped 9 days ago and I still don't have it...

[sunnysideup]

Great topic, and a nice spoof :-)

I think that's why Jimmy Bruno finally left the forum.

[FrankyNoTone]

It isn't possible to have too many threads about picks

Regarding bevels, they're important and a personal choice. I like speed/wear bevels because they are natural, just like how the soles of your shoes wear as uniquely as fingerprints. I wouldn't pay extra for someone to pre-wear my shoes and neither would I for picks. I can do it myself much gooder (yes I said gooder) because its not too difficult first of all and secondly I know how my playing wears out picks.

Regarding boutique picks made of fancy materials, I think materials definitely matter but once you start shaping your own point/bevels, the significance of the material becomes secondary. There's enough variety in the common pick materials that one should be close enough to matter as much as it should within the overall scope of guitar playing. For me, I like a lot of materials but really like celluloid so its easy to control the GAS for fancy picks.

They're nice to look at however, especially those Dugain picks displayed like rare coins under the counter

[sunnysideup]

LOL, I really was looking at a Jimmy Bruno video the other day where he was warning about crazy jazz guitar forums where people discuss whether a blue pick will give them a darker sound than a red pick. I also noticed that he does have a user account here and that he hasn't used it for a long time...

so, intrepid sleuth that I am, I put 2 and 2 together... I wouldn't claim mathematics to be my greatest strength so I could be wrong...

and really no personal disrespect to the original poster, I do have difficulty sometimes sifting the pure troll having fun posts from the serious requests for information...

[cosmic gumbo]

I'm using high tech picks made by a laboratory in Switzerland using a combination of anti-matter and plasma, and I must say they are well worth the $325 cost. The materials are actually sent to the international space station to begin the process in zero gravity.

[Eddie Lang]

Wow! Dugain sell ebony and rosewood picks at $17+ each! Just about five years ago, you could buy similar ones on ebay at 25 cents apiece!

[3625]

It isn't possible to have too many threads about picks

ne'er a truer word spoken

So I recently received a Wegen GP250 (black), a bit too clicky/chirpy for my liking, but I used them not for gypsy jazz (which is what they were designed for) but for straight ahead on an amplified archtop. But, a very well designed & engineered pick. Plus most picks above 2mm (these are 2.5mm) are clicky to varying degrees.

What I'm using at the moment is the Dunlop 1.5mm Delrin. They sound awful without some very light sanding/buffering because the seams are usually rough. But when you've sorted that out they sound pretty good. They're excellent for playing fast - Andreas Oberg uses them, plus Pat Martino, Bireli (though the round edge) and Malmsteen! lol That's quite a pedigree

Still avoiding the inevitable... Buying A Blue Chip!

[sunnysideup]

Can anyone pretty please provide me with an original Wes Montgomery pick, I'm led to believe there may be only one in existence, but I can stretch to 5 bucks, or would consider a trade.

Oh, in addition, if I do use his pick can you guarantee that I will be able to use it reproduce his sound 100%.

[Eddie Lang]

In another pick thread a few weeks ago, I wrote this:

I've been a big fan of the Clayton Ultem 1.20mm Small Teardrop for a while now, but a couple months ago, I was at Long & McQuade to buy a few Dunlop Jazz III and next to them, there was some Traynor Tortex Jazz 1.5mm picks. I bought packs of each, but I adopted the Traynors right away and they are the ones that I use the most now (when I don't just play with my fingers)


Long & McQuade - Traynor Tortex Jazz Guitar Picks Pack Of 12 - 1.5mm




Here are a few that can be found in my tin of "regular" picks (well, among these, I mostly use #2 to 6, 9 and 12, really):
1. Dunlop Jazz III
2. Traynor 1.5 mm
3. Clayton Ultem Gold 1.20 mm small teardrop
4. Wegen Bigcity
5. Wegen Twin
6. Wegen Fatone
7. Wegen TF 140
8. Golden Gate
9. Dawg
10. Blue Chip 40
11. Red Bear TT-XH
12. Red Bear Style A Heavy

I reviewed some of them and a few more, about a year ago: Plectrums - Review

[SamBooka]

Woah!!! How do I get a traynor pick ???


edit: I overreacted
I didn't know there were any L&ms in Québec
not in stock tho

[mr. beaumont]

Wow! Dugain sell ebony and rosewood picks at $17+ each! Just about five years ago, you could buy similar ones on ebay at 25 cents apiece!

Dugains are worth it...perfect shape, perfect bevel, indentations for thumb and index finger that are actually comfortable...

I also really like the John Pearse Fast Turtles...

I can't beleive people balk at more expensive picks...still the cheapest way to change your tone.

(As an aside, I'm not impressed with Blue Chips in the least)

[Eddie Lang]

Jeff, I am not against more expensive picks (within reason -- not like the £5,000 titanium pick!). Right now I use a lot the inexpensive Taynor Tortex Jazz picks that I mentioned above, but I also love some Wegens and Red Bear which I use often. I even have a Blue Chip, but I did not bond with it, possibly because of its shape...

I was just surprised when I saw the wooden Dugain's price beacause they seemed similar to the ones that I got for cheap. I've had to tweek the bevel on some of these though whereas the Dugain might not need to -- I don't know.

I absolutely agree with you when you say that they are a cheap way to change our tone.

[FrankyNoTone]

...What I'm using at the moment is the Dunlop 1.5mm Delrin. They sound awful without some very light sanding/buffering because the seams are usually rough. But when you've sorted that out they sound pretty good. They're excellent for playing fast - Andreas Oberg uses them, plus Pat Martino, Bireli (though the round edge) and Malmsteen! lol That's quite a pedigree

Still avoiding the inevitable... Buying A Blue Chip!

Ya, those lavender 1.5mm's are pretty good when they've been fixed up a bit. Its my favorite pick made from Delrin and I like them better than the green 1.5mm Gator Grips. I might send Mr. Bruno a PM asking his opinion on whether the lavender vs green color has an impact on tone. Mind you, the Malmsteen signature picks in white might be the best of all. Very classy looking and perfect for say, neoclassical jazz:




As is clear from all the great players using these common picks to make great music, you don't "need" to use these fancy picks but it is undeniable that "want" is a powerful force. Perhaps this need/want duality is fundamental in humans just like light's wave/particle duality in nature.

[mangotango]

Currently in a state of flux about picks. Was using ProPlecs large teardrops but I just found that after a while, they felt a little clumsy (I feel guily about this, because Jazzy Jim sent me some that he'd fallen out of love with, and now here I am doing the same! On the other hand they work great with a bass guitar.) Anyway, on the recommendation of the owner of the store I go to, I got some carbon-fibre Jazz III's. Wow, do they make everything sound bright!!

Round about that time, I started trying out some D'Addario Half-Round strings and in combination with the Half-Rounds, the Carbon Fibre Jazz III's sounded too tinny and a long way from what I hear in my head. So I found some Pro-Plec Small teardrops on the 'Net, and they work fine with those strings, and pretty much all my other guitars too.

However, while waiting for those to drop through the letterbox, I used an Ultex Jazz III that I found in a plectrum box, and that sounds pretty good too. The Pro-Plecs small teardrops also help me to play faster - although that just means that sometimes my fingers outpace my brain!!


So, I'm waiting for things to settle at the moment - tho' since today was NAD, there's now another variable to be thrown into the mix as well!!

[DRS]

I always laugh when guys spend $100 on a guitar cable but won't plunk down $12 for a decent pick or even try different picks. They think their Fender medium 351 sounds the same as any pick out there.

I've tried a lot of different picks and my faves from best down are:

Papa's- faux tortoise from casein $12
Pearse Fast Turtle - faux tortoise from casien $12
V Pick original - acrylic $4
Fender Extra Heavy large triangle $.75

[bluewaterpig]

I just got an order today that had a pearse fast turtle, some Wegen big city jazzers, and a pearse rosewood just for fun. I must say, I'm really disappointed with the Pearse fast turtle. It's big and clunky to me. I do like the Wegens which surprised me.

Still waiting on packages from Gravity picks, JBs, and a Dugain.

To anybody who owns a blue chip, do you really love it? At $50, it would have to be my go to pick, not just something I enjoy using.

[Bryan T]

Dugains are worth it...perfect shape, perfect bevel, indentations for thumb and index finger that are actually comfortable...

The disappointment for me was realizing that I pick with the 'wrong' side of the pick. I'd need to buy "left-handed" picks if I want a bevel.

[Tom Karol]

Wow! For that kind of money, I could buy a couple hundred Blue Chip Jazz 60's!

To answer your earlier question, BWP, yes I do love the Blue Chip Jazz 60's with my archtop. I bought 1, then 2 more, then got 1 as a present. So I have 4 of them. If they last as long as they're supposed to - and they seem to - that should be a lifetime supply.

But to be honest, I use plain old Dunlop Ultex Jazz III's with the rest of my guitars.

[Tom Karol]

I just finished messing around with the various picks I have on hand, and as much as I'd prefer to use one pick for everything, I've come to the conclusion that for me different picks seem to be best suited for different guitars, etc.

Archtop: I love the Blue Chip Jazz 60's for solo playing and single note lines. But I have to admit that I'm not as pleased with how they work for me when comping. Still, these are my go-to picks for this guitar. I do, however have a few ProPlec pentagonal-shape 1.5 mm picks. They feel nice, but I don't like them at all for single note lines - way too muted sounding to me. They're great for comping, however, so I keep them in my archtop case too.

Semi-hollow and Tele: Dunlop Ultex Jazz III's - the amber ones - exclusively. This is actually the one pick I'd use for everything if I could only use one, so every guitar case has at least a few of these. And I keep one in my pocket at all times.

Martin 000-28: I bought a small assortment of Wegens a while back. I don't like them at all with my electrics, but Wegen Twins are my current favorite with this guitar. I can really generate volume for lead lines when I have to without losing too much speed. They fatten up the bass on this guitar too.

Acoustic Travel Guitar: The other Wegens I have are called Big City Jazz. Again, I didn't like them at all with my electrics, but they seem to make this little guitar sound nice and full without overpowering it. And with the holes punched in the gripping surface, you cannot drop them!

So, what does this all mean? How the hell do I know!

Addendum: The Wegens have speed bevels; the others have universal bevels (i.e., not asymetrical). It would appear that I like speed bevels on picks for acoustics but not for electrics.