Amp Settings for "Typical" Jazz Tone

**bluewaterpig** · 03-17-2012, 02:12 PM

I know this is a pretty vague question, and the best method for finding a tone you like is to try everything out yourself, but I'm wondering if there are any "typical" amp settings that are well known amongst jazz guitarists.

I'm asking because I used to be (and still kind of am) heavily obsessed with Stevie Ray Vaughan's tone and through a bunch of research and forum posts it seemed like there was a general consensus that amp settings for that sort of tone are high bass, very low mids, and medium high treble (yes this is debatable, but let's not turn this into a SRV tone thread).

I wouldn't expect there to be one ultimate setting for everything, so please post a bunch of different ones if you know them.

**mr. beaumont** · 03-17-2012, 02:27 PM

I approach most amps the same way to start: dead flat. Usually I'll cut a little high and add some mids. Bass is always to taste, depends on the room...don't want it too boomy.

Generally, a lot of classic jazz tones were strong in the mid range, but there's lots of exceptions.

**monkmiles** · 03-17-2012, 02:33 PM

I think it's a great question. In fact I was asking something similar in the Fender tube amp thread.

I generally have kept the bass knob up a decent amount because I used to think it kept things "warm". But if you roll your tone knob down a good amount on your guitar, it can get too boomy if the bass is set too high. So I'm starting to tinker with it down more (from 6 down to 4 on my Fenders).

**mambosun** · 03-17-2012, 02:50 PM

What I read from other website specialized in fender amps, the sound from the pick up being rather midrangy, the amps usually have a scooped midrange (eg: Twin Reverb), to my taste the best jazz tone I got needed a fair amount of mid, treble kept at 4 max and bass according to room acoustics & amp placements, trying not to be boomy.

**kris** · 03-17-2012, 03:07 PM

Jazz tone...?
different guitar different amp set up...but generally I cut all trebble in all my amps, mid and bass set up is different for my guitars.
My AER Copmact XL have a lot of bass so I cut it a lot...:-)

**whiskey02** · 03-17-2012, 05:09 PM

Another method is to set bass, mids and treble to full on, then simply remove what you don't want! In actual practice, you'll tinker around a bit, say while dialing back bass and mids as there's usually some overlap, but it works pretty well.

**ruiner54** · 03-17-2012, 08:04 PM

I read one idea where the person turns everything goes down the then dial it up to the point where you really hear it start to come in strong any stop right around there..do that on all three and you have a starting point...then fine tune to taste.
I think the point was that this "cut in" spot would be different for each amp...I tried it and didn't find it useful on my amps but you might.

On my cube I need to cut the trebling slot and the other two flat...my polytone not ad much because it has other tone shaping. Controls on it.

**kawa** · 03-17-2012, 09:14 PM

1. Listen to the direct sounds at the front of the speaker units.
2. Guitar ; Volume 8. Tone 10, Neck end Picking, Testing phrase and chords.
3. Master (if has) ; Max
4. Volume ; 2.2～3 (Minimum 1 type)
(some types by GAIN, ex ; Peterson P-100G Ⅱ Gain 1～2, Polytone Mini brute ⅡSonic Circuit Mode Gain 1～2)
5. Bass ; Turn up to the moderate fat, not too much. ex ; '65 RITR 3, '74 SFTR 1(Min), JC-120 0, '66 BFVR 3.5
6. Middle (if has) ; 6
7. Treble ; A touch for coloring, ex ; Fender 1～2, JC-120 2

**aniss1001** · 03-18-2012, 12:03 AM

I'm afraid my jury is still out on that one.. I really don't know what I'm doing and even less if what I'm doing is right

On the other hand I've tried several approaches and I allways seem to end up with the same settings. So perhaps there isn't more to it than that.

For instance I have always started off by setting everything at noon and then recently I read that on the Cube40xl (my amp) one should start out with everything at 8 o'clock and that starting out a noon is over-EQ'ing (whatever that means).

Anyway I tried this new approach and fiddled until I thought it sounded the best and ended up with the same settings as usual relatively speaking. That is everything was set lower but with the same relations between them. It sounded the same to me just with a lower overall volume.

Anyhoo.. My settings are:

Bass: 12-1 o'clock
Middle: 11-12 o'clock
Trebble: 8-9 o'clock
Tone on guitar rolled off ALL the way..

Seems to be the best sound I can get.

I've actually been thinking about whether the humbucker I installed recently is unsuitable for jazz or even flawed. I mean supposedly it's a DARK pup but it sounds EXTREMELY trebbly to me. Yes playing a HIGHER volumes with the settings I mentioned above I am getting something I can live with, but I can't help thinking that if my start off point was somewhat better I would be able to achieve a nicer sound. I mean is it normal to play with the tone knob at zero allways?

I posted a sample of the sound with all EQ knobs at noon and the tone knob at max. Is it normal that a NECK humbucker sounds THAT trebbly?

Sorry about spamming this thread with my questions it just seemed like an appropriate place to mention this

**newsense** · 03-18-2012, 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by ruiner54

I read one idea where the person turns everything goes down the then dial it up to the point where you really hear it start to come in strong any stop right around there..do that on all three and you have a starting point...then fine tune to taste.
I think the point was that this "cut in" spot would be different for each amp...I tried it and didn't find it useful on my amps but you might.

This sounds very much like the Matt Schofield method to find the sweet spot. The process relies havily on the non-linearity of most pots (even "linear" ones). But, Matt is a blues guitarist. He almost always plays a strat and he developed this method to find the point of greatest sensitivity of the amp to touch and pick attack; that is, the ease with which he can go from clean to more overdrive and sustain simply with pick pressure.
I'm not sure he would recommend this approach for classic Jazz tones, which need to be rather more well behaved than electric blues.

**jorgemg1984** · 03-18-2012, 07:29 AM

It really varies from amp to amp but I tend to keep treble pretty low (1 maybe) and mids flat, on a Fender maybe a little boost. Volume knob on 8 and tone knob can go from 2 to 8. Bass can go from 1 to 4 depending on venue / amp. But the most important thing is not to have any pre-coinceived ideas, if it sounds good with all the knobs on zero or all the knobs on 12 go for it. Use your ears not your brain.

I also think an EQ pedal is an essential tool to dial your sound, sometimes the knobs on the amps are very limited.

**Dennis D** · 03-18-2012, 01:15 PM

I went from a '60's tube amp owned since new, to a newer easier to lift solid state....I was unaccustomed to how interrelated the ss settings were / are....and having vintage stereo components - -also since new - didn't help either....I did find that other thread useful - -but getting the settings dialed in took a lot longer than I thought it would..I may return to a 'living room' tube amp again, not only for the sound - not only better to my ears - but also to just reduce the screwing around factor....MHO Dennis
PS Oh yeah - Did I mention I'm now considered an old guy set in his ways ??

**Classicplayer** · 03-18-2012, 05:31 PM

If you have a Tele' with a neck humbucker and you are using a Roland Cube 40XL, I'd first set it for the JC or Brit Combo model.

I would try firstly, putting the e.q. all the way up and subtract rather than add e.q.. I would also set my Tele's volume control at just past mid way and the tone control rolled back also to cut those highs. I would then try single notes, chords, partial chords, double stops and start adjusting the e.q. to what you think you should judge to an "approximate" Jazz tone; and that tone is different in concept to many players. You need enough highs for note definition, enough mids for single notes, and (in my own case) enough bass to get a full sound and to "trick" a listener into thinking you have an actual Jazz box guitar and that you might even have a bass player with you.

This is my concept (for what it's worth) and I do this with a Strat with single coils, and a Les Paul with humbuckers....right now through a Roland Cube 20X on "Tube Drive". Give this a shot and see how it sounds to you. If you get close, let me know, and I will give you a tip that I use to fine tune that.

Classicplayer

**Classicplayer** · 03-18-2012, 06:44 PM

annis1001,

When you believe to have you own "Jazz" tone, post a sound file up. You might surprise yourself that you got closer than you though you would. I'd be interested in hearing it, for sure.

**Classicplayer** · 03-18-2012, 06:55 PM

Before you adjust your 40XL's e.q., set your guitar volume at 1/2 to 3/4 and roll the tone control back a bit......then start adjusting the amps's e.q. and listening to your results. The goal here is to get the amp to where you can just use the guitar's volume and tone to fine tune your tone. I can use my guitar's controls to brighten my sound by rolling the volume back just a touch and the tone control to fine tune that. When I do this, I find I don't have to keep adjusting my amp. It should work with you Tele. The key is having some patience and to listen carefully. When I first went to a modeling amp with my 20X, I thought I'd take forever to get it just right, it did take me some time to find the sweet spot for amp and guitar. My experience with a tube amp was that I got to that point sooner.

Classicplayer

**aniss1001** · 03-18-2012, 07:19 PM

Originally Posted by Classicplayer

When you believe to have you own "Jazz" tone, post a sound file up. You might surprise yourself that you got closer than you though you would. I'd be interested in hearing it, for sure.

I recently made a thread about my mods where I also linked to a sound clip. Now the sound I get from my Cube speaker is actually better than that (more balanced) but it still gives you an idea.

And it does sound way better than before the mods. In particular when playing at higher volumes but I'm still not entirely happy with the sound on the higher strings.

In the clip I'm playing with the tone knob on zero as allways.

PS: Perhaps not a bad idea to answer in that thread. I think we're derailing this one quite a bit

**Classicplayer** · 03-18-2012, 07:51 PM

annis1001,

I listened the clip attached to your link. I was impressed with your playing and your tone on that Tele with the humbucker. That is what I call a "Jazz" tone!
Are you satisfied with that? Are you going for that with the amp's speaker?

The only thing I'd change, and this just my own preference, I'd drop out some of the mids and try to get a bit more brightness in, not much though. I'd like to hear a clip of your chords too. Try some chord melody playing, I think I'd go for just a bit more definition in those solo notes because the chords would need some definition. There is absolutely nothing wrong with your playing, excellent.

Classicplayer

**aniss1001** · 03-19-2012, 01:31 AM

Originally Posted by Classicplayer

I listened the clip attached to your link....

Hey thanks

In that sample I pretty much played with the same settings as I would when I play straight with the Cube. I think I lowered the bass knob a tad because when recording the lower strings sound more muddy than when I play straight. Also the Cube sounds better the more volume you add but when I record I have to set it at VERY low volume otherwise my recording device (a USB guitar link) just can't handle it and starts breaking up. I believe it was made for plugging in your guitar directly and using amp emulations such as Guitar rig.

But no still not satisfied with the sound. As I said I'm still fiddling with all the knobs. It is hard to get a fat tone on the higher strings as I like without mudding up the lower strings. And generally I have to roll of so much of the highs because it sounds really bad to me on the higher strings if I don't.

I still think it's odd that this pup sounds SO trebbly by default.

Anyhoo thanks for your opinion

**jorgemg1984** · 03-19-2012, 06:39 AM

Aniss why do you run your EQ so high? When I use Cubes I keep the bass and gthe treble close to zero and the mids on 4 / 5 (but I am using an archtop with heavy strings). The clip does sound trebly but I think it sounds right given those EQ settings.

**Classicplayer** · 03-19-2012, 08:18 AM

annis1001,

I don't record my 20X, but I did read on a Youtube video that if recording the 20X it's best to keep the volume no higher than 9:00 o'clock.

I struggled with getting the high string notes to get them full sounding as opposed to tinny sounding. With the 20X I tweaked the e.q. to get it close to my version of a Jazz guitar tone, then if the high notes were not quite there, I used the gain control and just moved it up in small increments and it solved my problem. Do you use your gain control on the 40X and where was it set for that recorded clip that you made?

Classicplayer

**aniss1001** · 03-19-2012, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by jorgemg1984

Aniss why do you run your EQ so high? When I use Cubes I keep the bass and gthe treble close to zero and the mids on 4 / 5 (but I am using an archtop with heavy strings). The clip does sound trebly but I think it sounds right given those EQ settings.

Well 1st off don't confuse the sound sample with what I do when I actually play!! In the sample I tried to get the "default" sound as I said. That is volume/tone at MAX and all EQ knobs at noon!

When I play I tend to use these settings as I said earlier:

Bass: 12-1 o'clock
Middle: 11-12 o'clock
Trebble: 8-9 o'clock
Tone on guitar rolled off ALL the way..

Don't know why?!.. Well I start out with everything at noon and then add/remove until I get the closest to the sound I want. That usually means adding a tad of bass and cutting a tad middle and allways cutting almost ALL the treble.

But like I said I'm still fiddling here. The only real constant seems to be that I always end up cutting ALL the tone on the guitar.

But you think it is NORMAL that it sounds THAT trebly by "default"?

**aniss1001** · 03-19-2012, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by Classicplayer

Do you use your gain control on the 40X and where was it set for that recorded clip that you made?

Hi again,

Well like I said I'm still struggling to make the high E string in particular sound less wimpy / thin / plingy / tiny (or whatever

).

And no I don't use the modelling amps really. Don't really like them too much. I play with the clean channel which has no gain. When I have the money I plan to get a Rat clone, mod it and kind of use it as a preamp (low distortion) to get a more natural sounding gain. But for now I'm just playing it clean.

Hmm... again I kind of wish you would have responded in the thread I linked to before as I suggested. I feel that we are derailing / spamming this thread by now. This thread is about EQ settings in general. Not MY EQ settings in particular

**mr. beaumont** · 03-19-2012, 12:04 PM

Aniss, that sound is pleasant to my ears, but it most definitely does not sound like a humbucker with the tone rolled all the way down.

Does the tone knob seem to make a difference at all? I wonder if the wiring was wrong and it got bypassed?

What kind of pot did you use? I've heard people say before that a humbucker with a 1MEG pot was too bright...

With the Roland cubes, I definitely found the best jazz tones were with the EQ pretty much flat, favoring mids more than highs. I might not run the guitar's volume at full, and might roll off a bit of tone.

Usually, the resultant sound from rolling down the tone pot all the way is unusably muddy.

And don't worry about hijacking the thread--better to get this worked out for you. I think we've already learned that everybody's route to their jazz tone is pretty different.

**aniss1001** · 03-19-2012, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

Aniss, that sound is pleasant to my ears, but it most definitely does not sound like a humbucker with the tone rolled all the way down.....

No no! As I said the sound in that sample is with the tone control at MAX and all EQ knobs at noon. This was to show my "default" sound before I turn the knobs to my liking. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't find it pleasant if you heard me play single lines with that sound. I will make a sample of that a bit later.

The sound I like the best is by rolling off ALL the tone. Since I installed the socalled greasebucket tone circuit (as our local tech wiz Chris suggested) it no longer muds up the lows by doing so. The thing about the greasebucket is that it doesn't add or alter the lows as you turn. I ONLY cuts the highs. And it is very efficient at doing that. WAY more efficient than the treble knob on my Cube.

Here is a sample of MY sound. That is with the tone control on zero. AS I said it sounds a more muddy when I record it than it does thru my Cube speaker.

And when I changed the pup I also changed the pots to some 500K DiMarzio ones. That seems to be the norm and besides the manual that came with the pup clearly states that one should use 500K. Later I have learned that a lower value (250K to 350K) perhaps would have been better but for now I'm stuck with these.

**mr. beaumont** · 03-19-2012, 01:04 PM

Okay, my mistake--the soundcloud post definitely sounds more like a guitar with the tone rolled all the way off.

If it sounds less muddy in person, I think you're good to go...for recording, I'd just get a little more "cut" to the tone.

You might just try going up one string gauge on only the high E if it continues to bother you. I actually use .11's on my tele, but use a .12 high E for better balance.