Heritage Groove Master

[helios]

I was wondering if anyone had any insights regarding the "Heritage Groove Master" guitar. Please "weigh in" if you've played one, or heard one.

[Treading Water]

Hi Jeff, I believe I tried one at my local shop about a year ago.
It seemed like a fine instrument, but I decided to go with what I thought was the more "traditional" Heritage Sweet 16 (wooden bridge, floating pick-up). I think the two guitars are very similar, although mine may have a shorter scale length. It's very hard to remember tone differences trying guitars out in a shop.
I like my Sweet 16 alot, as it's my first archtop. I think that I would like a more "woody" vintage archtop, but worry that older used instruments without problems are harder to find.
I may have an intermittent problem with the pick-up on my guitar also, as it has cut out, and seems to be fixed by tapping on the pick-up.
I would like another archtop, and think the groovemaster would maybe have a slightly different tone and perhaps feel due to scalelength, but whether that difference is discernable after tweaking tone controls on your amp is questionable. That reminds me, I miss having a tone control on my Sweet 16, and am considering an external eq.

[helios]

Thanks for the reply-I was beginning to think the Groove Master existed only in print! The body dimensions of the Sweet 16 & Groove Master are identical (16 x20.25 x 2.75"), but the Groove Master has a 24.75 scale unlike the 25.5 scale of the Sweet 16. I can't find any YouTube clips of the Groove Master!!! Best wishes.

[DarinB]

I think the groove master and the sweet 16 are actually very different guitars for different styles of playing.

Groove master: laminate body, set in pickup, fixed bridge, 24 3/4" scale.
Sweet 16: fully carved, floating pickup, floating bridge, 25 1/2" scale.

I have a Sweet 16 for mostly acoustic playing. Great guitar, which I found used at probably 1/3 of the price of a new one.

Darin

[Flyin' Brian]

That Groove Master must have at least a partial block under the top in order to attach the bridge like that.

[Patrick2]

That Groove Master must have at least a partial block under the top in order to attach the bridge like that.

Yeah . . . it's called a floating block. It's glued to the top, for added support when drilling the bridge studs into the top . . . . but, it doesn't extend all the way down to the back. So, unlike the block in a true semi hollow H535 (ES335) . . . it kinda . . "floats" and allows the guitar to be a true hollow body.

Also, in comparisons made to the Sweet 16 . . (affectionately know by Heritage lovers as "The Sweetie") . . the laminate top . . (plywood for cjm's edification) . . on the KB is maple, where as the Sweetie is solid carved spruce.

[Flyin' Brian]

Yeah . . . it's called a floating block. It's glued to the top, for added support when drilling the bridge studs into the top . . . . but, it doesn't extend all the way down to the back. So, unlike the block in a true semi hollow H535 (ES335) . . . it kinda . . "floats" and allows the guitar to be a true hollow body.

Also, in comparisons made to the Sweet 16 . . (affectionately know by Heritage lovers as "The Sweetie") . . the laminate top . . (plywood for cjm's edification) . . on the KB is maple, where as the Sweetie is solid carved spruce.

OK so the same idea as my Prospect. Thanks Oh Patrick do you have any idea how many Sweet 16s Heritage built with a thinner body? Mine is 1/2" thinner than standard. Ren said that it was probably pretty rare.

[Patrick2]

OK so the same idea as my Prospect. Thanks Oh Patrick do you have any idea how many Sweet 16s Heritage built with a thinner body? Mine is 1/2" thinner than standard. Ren said that it was probably pretty rare.

Very rare indeed! Not too many people wanted thinner carved spruce top arch top guitars. When they did, they were directed towards the H525. It's 2.25". However, Heritage being who they are always try and accommodate everyone's wishes (within reason), so when they got an odd request for a thinner bodied arch top, they did it. I have only seen 2 thin line Golden Eagles, 1 thin line Super Eagle . . . and while there might be others, yours is only the 2nd "Sweetie" I've ever seen with a 2.25" depth. As I said, that would make it the same dimensions as an H525. Unfortunately . . . Heritage keeps no such records of what they've built in the past. They mostly rely on ol' Ren Wall's memory . . . which ain't too awful bad!!!


*** Edit for clarification . .. the H525 is a laminate maple top.

[Flyin' Brian]

Very rare indeed! Not too many people wanted thinner carved spruce top arch top guitars. When they did, they were directed towards the H525. It's 2.25". However, Heritage being who they are always try and accommodate everyone's wishes (within reason), so when they got an odd request for a thinner bodied arch top, they did it. I have only seen 2 thin line Golden Eagles, 1 thin line Super Eagle . . . and while there might be others, yours is only the 2nd "Sweetie" I've ever seen with a 2.25" depth. As I said, that would make it the same dimensions as an H525. Unfortunately . . . Heritage keeps no such records of what they've built in the past. They mostly rely on ol' Ren Wall's memory . . . which ain't too awful bad!!!


*** Edit for clarification . .. the H525 is a laminate maple top.

Well that's cool. It was made for somebody who got divorced and it hung in a New Jersey music store for a while. It was built in 1997, is a second although I don't know why, and I bought it as NOS in 2000.

[Patrick2]

Well that's cool. It was made for somebody who got divorced and it hung in a New Jersey music store for a while. It was built in 1997, is a second although I don't know why, and I bought it as NOS in 2000.

Just out of curiosity, which NJ store was that? Are you from NJ?

[Flyin' Brian]

Just out of curiosity, which NJ store was that? Are you from NJ?

No I live in Canada now but at the time I was living in Chicago but working at Teterboro Airport.
The store was in East Rutherford, I don't remember the name. Seems like it was on a corner in an older building. Maybe Rutherford Music Exchange? I just remember that they had several arch tops hanging from the ceiling, all dusty. I had owned an H-535 and had played Henry Johnson's Sweet 16 when I took lessons from him. When I saw this one with the thin body I flipped. It was actually subsequently bought for me as a gift.

I put on a tone pros bridge for intonation, had it PLEKed by Joe Glaser in Nashville, and took out the Schaller pickup and put in a Fralin P-92 because I'm not crazy about the bass response of humbuckers.

[Patrick2]

No I live in Canada now but at the time I was living in Chicago but working at Teterboro Airport.
The store was in East Rutherford, I don't remember the name. Seems like it was on a corner in an older building. Maybe Rutherford Music Exchange? I just remember that they had several arch tops hanging from the ceiling, all dusty. I had owned an H-535 and had played Henry Johnson's Sweet 16 when I took lessons from him. When I saw this one with the thin body I flipped. It was actually subsequently bought for me as a gift.

I put on a tone pros bridge for intonation, had it PLEKed by Joe Glaser in Nashville, and took out the Schaller pickup and put in a Fralin P-92 because I'm not crazy about the bass response of humbuckers.

OK . . . I do remember that guitar from when I was still a member over at Heritag Owners Club forum. I remember those very same pictures as well. In fact, I said yours was one of 2 I knew of. This is the other one I was thinking of. So now, yours is the only one I know of.

By the way . . it's really pretty!! If it was mine, I'd put an ebony insert in the tail piece and go back to an ebony bridge saddle . .. fully compensated, not partially like the original Heritage bridge bases.

[Flyin' Brian]

OK . . . I do remember that guitar from when I was still a member over at Heritag Owners Club forum. I remember those very same pictures as well. In fact, I said yours was one of 2 I knew of. This is the other one I was thinking of. So now, yours is the only one I know of.

By the way . . it's really pretty!! If it was mine, I'd put an ebony insert in the tail piece and go back to an ebony bridge saddle . .. fully compensated, not partially like the original Heritage bridge bases.

That sounds like a good idea. I'll have to call Kalamazoo.

[tgee]

Old thread, I know. I really like the rounded cutaway on the Groove Master. Has Heritage ever put a rounded cutaway (venetian, I think) on a Sweet 16-type guitar?

BTW, Brian, your Sweet 16 looks very sweet indeed.

Tom

[jazzrat]

Has Heritage ever put a rounded cutaway (venetian, I think) on a Sweet 16-type guitar?

I could be wrong but I think Vince Lewis has a custom Sweetie with a Venetian cutaway.

[Patrick2]

I could be wrong but I think Vince Lewis has a custom Sweetie with a Venetian cutaway.

Yes, you are wrong jazzrat. Vince actually has two Venetian cutaway Sweeties. A sunburst and an antique natural. The antique natural is just over the top gorgeous. I played it at the HOC Parsons Sterrt Pilgramage 2 years ago. Vince is a wonderful person . . . (for a jazz guitarist )

[jazzbow]

Yes, you are wrong jazzrat. Vince actually has two Venetian cutaway Sweeties. A sunburst and an antique natural. The antique natural is just over the top gorgeous. I played it at the HOC Parsons Sterrt Pilgramage 2 years ago. Vince is a wonderful person . . . (for a jazz guitarist )

Patrick2, is their any way of ordering a groovemaster through a British music store or is it a direct order?

[Patrick2]

Patrick2, is their any way of ordering a groovemaster through a British music store or is it a direct order?

Heritage doesn't sell direct to the consumer. They only sell through dealers (music stores). I was just at the Heritage plant yesterday. They had a beautiful Groove Master ready to be buffed out and assemble the hard ware on it. I don't think it was committed to a dealer . . . there was no tag on it. I might have been made for NAMM, Nashville, coming up soon. You can contact them by email, tell them I told you about it and ask if it's available. You can also tell them which music store you normally deal with and they'll attempt to sell it to you through that store.

[jazzbow]

Heritage doesn't sell direct to the consumer. They only sell through dealers (music stores). I was just at the Heritage plant yesterday. They had a beautiful Groove Master ready to be buffed out and assemble the hard ware on it. I don't think it was committed to a dealer . . . there was no tag on it. I might have been made for NAMM, Nashville, coming up soon. You can contact them by email, tell them I told you about it and ask if it's available. You can also tell them which music store you normally deal with and they'll attempt to sell it to you through that store.

Excellent news, I will be selling a whole bunch of gear at a guitar festival in Carlisle at the back of August which might just cover it.
Thanks for you reply Patrick, I'll have to try out the specialist shops in Britain, any idea whether they have any dealings with any? I did send an email to them ages ago when I was flush with cash but never got a reply.

[PTChristopher]

Nothing to do with guitars, so please excuse,...

>>> guitar festival in Carlisle

Oh man - late May either side of the borders would work for me right now.

Long days in Longtown, or maybe over on the A68 north through the national park then down through Jedburgh,...

We can get more and cheaper guitars here (I live right next to our Carlisle, nice enough small town.) but a May day in the northern UK can be a supremely fine thing.

OK, sorry for the off-topic.

Chris

[stevedenver]

??????????????????????????

[jazzbow]

Nothing to do with guitars, so please excuse,...

>>> guitar festival in Carlisle

Oh man - late May either side of the borders would work for me right now.

Long days in Longtown, or maybe over on the A68 north through the national park then down through Jedburgh,...

We can get more and cheaper guitars here (I live right next to our Carlisle, nice enough small town.) but a May day in the northern UK can be a supremely fine thing.

OK, sorry for the off-topic.

Chris

Oh yeah, right at you with that one, Hadrians wall during the day, steak and beer at the pub in the evening

[IbanezAS100]

Excellent news, I will be selling a whole bunch of gear at a guitar festival in Carlisle at the back of August which might just cover it.
Thanks for you reply Patrick, I'll have to try out the specialist shops in Britain, any idea whether they have any dealings with any? I did send an email to them ages ago when I was flush with cash but never got a reply.

These guys (High End Guitars) have a good Heritage inventory and can also place custom orders for you. I have seen a fair few used ones for sale though so maybe ebay, gumtree and preloved could be the answer. There's also this chap who usually has a few used ones in stock: Rickenbacker Gretsch Guild PRS

[helios]

Heritage doesn't sell direct to the consumer. They only sell through dealers (music stores). I was just at the Heritage plant yesterday. They had a beautiful Groove Master ready to be buffed out and assemble the hard ware on it. I don't think it was committed to a dealer . . . there was no tag on it. I might have been made for NAMM, Nashville, coming up soon. You can contact them by email, tell them I told you about it and ask if it's available. You can also tell them which music store you normally deal with and they'll attempt to sell it to you through that store.

Hi Patrick,
There's been a lot of interesting posts here, but I'd still like to know if anyone has actually played a Groovemaster, and what their impressions are! I can't for example find anything on YouTube.
Having owned a Borys B120, and an ES-175, I personally prefer the sound of laminates when amplified, as opposed to that of a carved top when amplified. The Groovemaster has features that would appeal to my tastes. Best Wishes, Jeff

[jazzbow]

There's also this chap who usually has a few used ones in stock: Rickenbacker Gretsch Guild PRS

Oo! He has a H575! Just sent off an email for a swap! Might get lucky here

Thanks for the links