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Try different ways and see what really suits you.
I'm sure there are many things and ways to practice that you haven't really considered. Many....so many.
One of the things that help with keeping it fresh for me was to have different, almost like philosophical, objectives.
Like.. learn, improve, play for yourself, play for imaginary audience, play/record(well) so something cool would remain to amuse you.
Then.. we have 5 memory types. physical, aural, visual, abstract and emotional. If your practice mostly deals with only one or two of them - it's gonna get tiresome fast.
I have a list of exercises figured out for way longer than I could ever exhaust. Just to have different things to do when getting bored of something.
For example, there's a zillion ways to play one single scale. It's insane. Doesn't mean that I have play them all.. just to have something different every time for those 20-30 mins. But that's just scales.
Same goes with every other aspect of the practice - there are just so many different ways to do something.
So, my best advice is instead just giving up when bored - figure out a new way to practice the same thing. Surprise yourself. Brain likes surprises.
And you are soooooo lucky to have 9 hours to "waste" on practice
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edit: I believe there is a huge difference between being bored, spent or tired. At first, those may feel the same but it aint so.
Boredom is curable, being spent means no new material for a while, being tired.... hm. It's possible to enjoy just playing something very much while tired.Last edited by emanresu; 12-31-2021 at 11:48 AM.
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12-31-2021 08:57 AM
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If you are into heavy practicing, I would suggest to find a great teacher, to help you organize your time, and provide material to work on.
You have to be clever with what you practice. Take brakes, have proper technique, hear your body (and mind), so that you don't injure your hands. Have short and long term goals.
In the long term, you can't force practice. You can only practice the guitar, if you enjoy practicing the guitar, not as a means for something else. We often envy famous players, wanting to reach their level of mastery, forgetting that we just might not really have their passion and commitment, or just cannot be that hard working. That's ok.
Most guitar players might envy the way say Julian Lage or Tommy Emmanuel play, but put them in their shoes (they probably play guitar all day every day), and they would be unhappy. So be truthful about what you really want, and who you really are.
Sooner or later, you find real life in front of you, things outside guitar. Might be gigs and music, but might also be other passions or just your everyday life. If you don't strive for sincerity and balance, you'll end up being unhappy.
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Hi, J,
Here's my advice: string players, especially those who use both hands(finger-style), must be cautious that they don't cause damage to their hands by over-playing--especially if you have bad/marginal technique. And, if you use a pick, left hand strain/nerve/tendon damage is a real outcome for overplaying. I've found that musicians who say they practice 8 hours a day are really NOT practicing but wasting time with un-focused play. So, here's my method. In a perfect world, 2 hours before noon/2 hours after noon is enough time to accomplish whatever you want to do if YOU STAY FOCUSED. Here's my regimen:
1. pick out one item(s)/song/problem(s) that can be accomplished in one hour.
2. set a timer when you begin and every time you wander from your goal(s), pause the timer and stop whatever non-productive noodling you're doing. When you return to your practice, hit the timer.
3. When your time has ended, save any unfinished items for session #2, 3,4.
4. Record your progress in a notebook to track your progress.
3. If you find you can't focus on specific goals, put your instrument away and return when you're
refreshed.
I learned this technique from Thomas Sternik at the American Conservatory of Music/Chicago where I studied Saxophone/flute. When I first began studying with him, I never could complete the workload he gave me the previous week. I told him I was playing 6-8 hours a day and he identified the problem immediately. I never had a problem finishing my studies again. I have also used this practice for the last 30 years on Classical guitar and still use it today. However, at the time, my life was completely devoted to music with no distractions of life.
Today, I play 2-3 hours a day. I don't believe the average person can focus 8 hours a day as it was said was the case with Coltrane and as a former Saxer, I don't know how his lips held up to that regimen! I believe a guitarist could do serious damage to his hands with that schedule for any length of time as I once had a problem when I pushed the 4 hour limit before a concert.
Good luck and good playing!
Marinero
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You already have lots of great advice from real players, here are my two cents as a schmuck with a guitar.
Moving from 1 hour a day to 3 hours increased my chops exponentially during that period. Not sure what would happen at 8 hours.
There is lots of modern research around attention span, learning etc. Basically you need to work in sessions of no more than around 40 minutes, with a short break in between, and no more than around 4 hours of session/break back to back. The actual duration vary between studies. E.g. check out the pomodoro technique, which has you work 25 minutes, rest 5, repeat, take a longer break, repeat, then take a much longer break after 4 hours.
It is also shown that just pushing ahead for some longer duration straight will yield much worse results than the above. Don't do it. And it has nothing to do with age, this is similar for all age groups.
For me personally, joining an ensemble course in the form of a funk/soul band with an experienced leader/teacher increased my musicianship exponentially, compared to sitting at home hammering away during two years of covid isolation.
But during those two covid years, I practiced with the goal of finally being able to play advanced drop-2 chord comping. I was hammering away at some monster Barry Greene studies. Now I can do some things I could only dream of before.
So I would suggest to put together a mix of focused hammering away, and playing with people. This will kill the boredom and force you to learn new stuff that is applied right away.
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I find that practising for 30 minutes at a time is productive. I usually do that two or three times a day. Sometimes I find that more than 30 minutes is kinda junk time...unproductive.
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My goal is to get good enough to get gigs. Any type of jazz gig really. Slowly but surely I've been incrementing more practice time 2-3 hours I can get to now but the side effects from the meds have really taken a beating on me today so tommorow I'm going to check up with the doctor to see whats going on
Originally Posted by WILSON 1
I use some form of interleave practice as well and its really taxing on the brain, practicing different string sets and all that Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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That's simple: Originally Posted by jazznylon
- Take private lessons with a pro jazz player who can help you understand what you really need to work on. Having the guidance of someone who can help you to focus/prioritize will help you to cover ground faster. And you won't be trying to figure all of it out alone. A really good teacher is not only knowledgable but is also inspiring.
- Go to local jam sessions. You'll get some idea of the tunes that typically get called, and you'll gain valuable stage experience. Eventually, those players you meet at the jams may call you when they need a sub or can't take a gig because they are already booked.
HTH
SJ
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After the first few years, you should be able to focus on practicing to improve, not just to practice for its own sake. I produced some Barney Kessel shows, and he always practiced around 3 hours daily; when I asked him what he worked on, he said "what I don't do as well as I would like". For intermediate to advanced players, you have to realize that you're mostly training the brain, not so much the fingers. And the brain learns quickly if you use the salami technique of small pieces at a time. I manage to exercise as many as 15-30 different "problems" every day by doing each exercise for 3 minutes, using a downloaded metronome that I can program with tempo increases every 4, 8, 12 or whatever number of bars, usually 8. So if I start out at 60, a good warm-uptempo, by the time 3 minutes are up I'm at 105 (in 4/4). This might be a scale study, a set of arpeggios over a chord progression, a specific speed study, etc. I also utilize and have developed exercises for alternate, economy, sweep, cross and hybrid picking. Once an exercise is easy at 105, I will raise the start time to 70 or 75 BPM and the end tempo increases as well. This is really efficient and makes amazing progress, and generally takes no more than 90 minutes, divided in half with a short break. Classical players will spend 4-6 hours because they are also learning and memorizing long, difficult repertoire, but we aren't really in the same world; we should spend more time PLAYING tunes: heads, learning lyrics, improvising over changes, etc, after doing our technical work. Think about the mental library you can build working an hour or two on a new tune every day!
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Any update op? Has anything improved over the last week?
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No, not really. My problem is that I have no motivation, not just for guitar but for everything. I would at times just sit or walk back and forth without doing anything for hours. I guess I'm not just cut out for this whole music thing, but thanks everyone for the advices anyways! I did get an hour in today despite the zero motivation Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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Did you talk to your doctor?
There's an entire world between practicing 8 hours a day and giving up.
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Yeah but we only made light note of it and he recommended me to some program which unfortunatedly I forget the name of but yeah. In any case I printed out my resume today and will be going out job hunting soon most likely Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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Can you call his office and ask for the name again? Originally Posted by jazznylon
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I think you need to have a rest. Inspiration will come; until then find something else productive to do. Originally Posted by jazznylon
it’s Ok to not feel like playing sometimes. It doesn’t mean you’ll feel like that forever.
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Inspiration ebbs and flows, but I seriously question these practice goals.
Lately I've been wondering if Parker and Coltrane had some kind of obsessive compulsive. It doesn't make sense that Coltrane would regularly practice until his mouth bled, that's not the behavior of a mentally sound person. Just something to consider, like I said, there is a world of possibility between practicing 8 hours a day and giving up entirely.
Go back to post #32 and take that advice. You can do that while working a full time job.
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Well everyone, I finally did it. Somehow I managed to clock in 5-8 hours today. Don't know how I did it but I'm happy, now its just a matter of consistency. I can finally get the E Major Scale off my back now
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Based on my experience, if you're working on basic building blocks (major scale) you need to get a teacher involved. You're going to spend 8 hours doing 1 hours work.
At least that's how it went for me.
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So far so good, I've been practicing a lot in this second day so thats something.
I looked into it and the program is called Navigate Originally Posted by starjasmine
I'm working from a book actually, its a lot of work even when I trim down the time it takes to do things Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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Legend has it that people like Joe Satriani and Franz Liszt practiced as much as 9 hours a day. You are neither of them. Set realistic goals.
My sister performed with major symphonies and taught at well known music schools. Before she retired from performing she told me she was lucky to get in 1-2 hrs/day. As we grow older, real life intrudes.
I’ve been playing for close to 60 years and that’s a good foundation, but I’m lucky to get in one hour a day.
Hard work is a habit. You have to build up to it. And for most of us the limit is a small fraction of 9hrs/day.
Last story: a friend was working on her doctorate in piano when I was an undergrad. She had to drop out. Gave up piano completely. Too many hours of practice had led to numerous surgeries for carpal tunnel syndrome. Piano had been her entire life.
Realistic goals.
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I did not read all of the posts. I plan to when I get a chance. Here are a couple of things I find useful: it is easy for me to set unrealistic goals. When I set up a plan, I use a timer and see how long it takes. That allows for me to shape how I attack a certain area. Second, focus is primary. I do not think anyone can learn any music by route. I gave mindless playing a try once. For a year I would watch tv and play the same five licks over and over again for 2 or so hours. As soon as I stoped playing those licks daily, they completely disappeared. Also putting things into a framework. The example above also elucidates the framework issue. Things have to fit into your knowledge and approach.
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The question is - is it better than not playing at all? Originally Posted by st.bede
I've done this to make my fingers go to right places by themselves.. They do that now. But they are living their own lives now (the fingers)... whenever I try to consciously "meddle" with what is happening, there's gonna be a mess
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Segovia's routine
Five hours a day, in four periods of an hour and a quarter.
Fifteen-minute sets with a short break between each set.
After three sets of practice, a fifteen-minute break.
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I read he practiced for two hours a day and spent midday soaking in the tub ‘my hours are not like your hours’ Originally Posted by Litterick
power of visualisation is also under appreciated.
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My favourite comment from a concert pianist at a masterclass ‘if you have to practice more that three hours a day you lack talent.’
Ouch. Definitely struggle with three. But the my main issue atm is regularity and concentration (kids eh) I think those trump sheer hours. Better 1 hour a day for a week that 7 hours in one day obviously.
I sneak in some time where I can and try to have ‘ready to go 5m practice activities’ that I can do right away when the opportunity presents. Then do all the deep dive stuff when I get time to throw at it. Needs organisation.
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For instrumental facility, yeah. The physical part. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
But classical musicians aren’t required to take requests on 60 or so tunes, perhaps with changes in key, feel or style. They also aren’t required to improvise. Improvisation is a type of spontaneous composition. If that concert pianist added “composer” to his day job, his 3 hours would get blown up. (Probably the most profound apples to oranges comparison of classical and jazz.)
Classicists control their repertoire and recital selections. They work on repertoire, concertize, then move on to different repertoire. The past stuff is recoverable but not readily available.
Big name jazzers that fill concert halls (not clubs) could do that too, to some degree, especially if it’s some kind of pop or smooooooth jazz. They just don’t have to do that old journeyman stuff any more.Last edited by Donplaysguitar; 01-15-2022 at 02:56 PM.
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